Not sure how this happened but, ouch 2017 flop

[wfo9]

Side note. I just read the most ridiculous diatribe on FB 4Runner group about this.

It started with. How can you hydrolock a motor with no water in sight... Then it turned into those 5th gens are just grocery getters and have no business out on rocky trails unless you solid axle swap it. That is what caused this.

LOL. What a ridiculous comment. That accident had 0 to do with IFS.. I'm sure of that. And people keep bringing up the cost of the truck being 50k. WTF does that have to do with anything? If you can afford it... buy it and do what you want with it. Simple as that. Why are people so offended by someone offroading an expensive truck. They are paying for insurance....

Frustrating to read the garbage and immaturity people post...

 

[83Mule]

Hey!......Someone just found a new ''Project'' Truck with lots of killer add-ons!:eyebrows:

 

[jpachard]

Regarding anyone who's framing this driver as stupid, incompetent, etc.. I don't think we have enough information to establish what the case is here. But not only that, calling people stupid isn't exactly creating an environment where the driver of that truck is going to feel like he can tell us what happened without being overtly defensive. In doing this we're letting him down as a community and as a support network. Intelligent people can make mistakes, however they need the opportunity to take responsibility and demonstrate that they've put actions into motion to prevent this kind of mistake from occurring again.



This didn't happen at work so he can't talk about it in the office, and he (as far as we know) committed no crime so he's not defending himself in front of a judge. Social media is going to be where this guy makes amends with both himself and the community, and if he does hopefully we'll be able to hear him.



Sorry for the rant but I've been on the support-end of publicly shamed individuals and recognize how important it can be for them to come to terms, learn, and advance from mistakes. It's my hope that he follow's through with learning from what happened.

Excellent post! Well said. We all have bad days. I've run these passes multiple times on my BMW R1200 gs and the terrain changes so much year to year it's easy to get caught off guard. Hopefully no one was hurt.

Cheers, James


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[3wbdriver]

Side note. I just read the most ridiculous diatribe on FB 4Runner group about this. Frustrating to read the garbage and immaturity people post...

Yeah, I started reading the posts in that FB thread and made a snap decision not to join that particular group. I've already dropped out of another 4Runner group on FB because of similar judgmental people. I am SO glad we don't have anybody like that in here...... :behindsofa:

 

[CS223]

Looks like a FL tag. I'm betting it's hydro locked and not seized.

 

[AndrewTK]

Seeing this has me thinking about how an auto policy would handle this claim, and if there is an easy out for them to deny it. I suppose I should read the fine print on mine to see if it addresses a situation like this, I recall some of my motorcycle policies in the past having clauses about coverage if an accident occurs at a track. Any chance your insurance could leave you out in the cold on a deal like this?

 

[Teamoatmealpie]

Yeah lets chop that guys balls off - What a dummy.

We shouldn't forget about those idiots driving lifted F350's and Nissan Muranos pulling campers right out onto the beach and burying it to the frame. Non-airing down nicompoop's.:clap2:
They should be taught a lesson- fire and brimstone for those refusing to air down and those who make mistakes. :dance:

 

[Xtremluck]

Seeing has me thinking about how an auto policy would handle this claim, and if there is an easy out for them to deny it. I suppose I should read the fine print on mine to see if it addresses a situation like this, I recall some of my motorcycle policies in the past having clauses about coverage if an accident occurs at a track. Any chance your insurance could leave you out in the cold on a deal like this?

This would not be covered under the majority of insurance policies. I do a lot of track driving as well and very similar to that this is considered off highway driving.

 

[wfo9]

Looks like a FL tag. I'm betting it's hydro locked and not seized.

Hyrdo lock will seize it.. The rods bend and the entire bottom end of the motor becomes an anchor. If it just stalls from hydrolock at idle.. you could be lucky and pull the plugs and get the oil out and still have a healthy engine. But once you try to start it with the plugs in... guaranteed destruction. I wish more people understood this. Seen a few motors destroyed this way, and just a little education might have saved it.

BTW, pretty much all insurance polices will cover it. Never heard of one that will not.

However the guys I know that had a similar thing happen still lost out big time. They total the vehicle and won't let you get your stuff back unless you replace it with stock equipment. It ends up being a major PITA and you get very little money out of them.

Knew A guy with an 80 that he had 20k in rebuilt motor. Totaled... they gave him 4k. Similar thing with an FJ with 15k in mods. He got blue book and could not get any of his suspension tires... back. He did get the accessories.

 

[NMBruce]

This might be covered under his insurance, what most people don't know is that a lot of the trails up here are county roads, Black Bear is not, but it is a Forest Road, 823/648 so who knows.

 

[Xtremluck]

This might be covered under his insurance, what most people don't know is that a lot of the trails up here are county roads, Black Bear is not, but it is a Forest Road, 823/648 so who knows.

Yeah good luck with that, especially with all the digital evidence of what happened. This is similar to a guy/girl who puts their car into a wall on a racetrack and has their wreck towed to a highway for insurance scam action.

 

[WallyT4R]

Yeah, I started reading the posts in that FB thread and made a snap decision not to join that particular group. I've already dropped out of another 4Runner group on FB because of similar judgmental people. I am SO glad we don't have anybody like that in here...... :behindsofa:

Im so happy I don't even have a FaKebook account.:vader:

 

[Old Muley]

Clearly had his license plate read "UPRIGHT" this wouldn't have happened.

 

[Jeremy556]

Yeah good luck with that, especially with all the digital evidence of what happened. This is similar to a guy/girl who puts their car into a wall on a racetrack and has their wreck towed to a highway for insurance scam action.

I did $7K+ damage to my 4runner when it was a few weeks old and filed an insurance claim. I was totally forthcoming with where it happened and how (in an off road park) and insurance never questioned it.

 

[FunBobby]

Seeing things like this make me wish I could find an off road course near me. I've looked but since I live in "mudding" area instead of a "rock" area I've had no luck

 

[wcjeep]

I saw a little more info on facebook about this. It is definitely a total loss. The motor seized up.

Like I said before in an earlier post. If this ever happens you have to turn it off ASAP. Then when you get it up on all 4s. Pull the plugs and crank to get oil out of the cylinders. I'm always shocked by how many people seize the motor on a flop when that is so easy to avoid. It is very inconvenient.. but so is a flop... You take it from repairable to a total loss with one crank of the ignition. I know it is hard to think when rolling... but try to do a drill so you will remember what to do if it does happen.

If it happens really fast and you end back up on all 4s... you may be able to keep it running. Ask me how I know. LOL

When I flopped my Offroad Jeep I immediately turned off the engine. Pulled the plugs. Crank the engine. Reinstall the plugs. Takes a few minutes. Somewhat embarrassing with a large group of people peppering me with questions about whatever. Engine still runs strong. Definitely pull the plugs. Saw another flop years later. Many people tried telling him to pull the plugs. He refused to listen. He destroyed the engine some distance from the Fire road.

 

[PK930]

Six pages and the owner still hasn't popped up. Hell, its 87 ways on Facebook, 4 or so pages on Arfcom GD, and who knows where else. Yet in every thread I've seen nothing but speculation and asshattery. I wouldn't pop up either -- no use explainiing myself to those who have never done wrong their life...

 

[LandCruiser]

Freak CO hailstorm materialized in the engine bay and hydrolocked it. This was not due to driver error and this was a highly technical trail--the Renegade pictured actually exploded when it tried to pass this obstacle.

 

[LandCruiser]

Poor line choice on what is a super easy section. These things also pose a risk for first responders. Traffic can't move up black bear. Only down. And it risks people and equipment.

People generally are the worst, and we're losing these jewels of the natural world to our access due to stupid mistakes or behavior. Look at the fires we're dealing with in Oregon. Amazing terrain lost for our lifetimes.

All the whiz bang features in our trucks, mods, etc and people forget to admit they don't know what they don't know. If a trail is above your skill level, have a spotter. There is no trail out there where you can't stop and walk it.

It's sad that these are what have to be teachable moments especially if they also serve to close down trails.

I don't think we'll have any of the trails stay open the way things are going. BB is a traffic jam on most weekends, and I always hear about some tard riding a SXS down a mountain or flopping on a totally innocent section of the trail. I haven't been out this year because I've been busy, but I wasn't surprised when I heard about the increasing amount of accidents on our trails.

When I was younger, a 4x4 excursion into the mountains usually involved several people, with at least one really good driver to supervise any noobs or those unfamiliar with the best lines to take. Everyone went slow, everyone looked out for each other. We didn't have cell phones, just CB radios and seemingly had more healthy respect compared to today when off the shelf 4x4s have so many features that someone with zero off roading experience takes a truck on a trail and drives lines and speeds that are grossly inappropriate for the trail and conditions.

I really don't like to get stuck in a mountain traffic jam or take sketchy ass lines around a disabled/flopped vehicle in the middle of the trail. It's getting to the point that I don't bother going out anymore because I know there's at least a 50% chance I'll be idling on a rock for hours as someone tries to right their brand new truck while violating every single rule of safe winch operation.

I'd really like to know what the hell happened, because if this was driver error, this guy shouldn't have been out on that mountain in what are essentially excellent weather conditions and a mildly technical trail at best that can be easily handled by most crossovers.

And my 2013 still has the RCSA disable switch, but it sucks and I'll admit I've forgotten to toggle it once or twice.

Edit 2: and the next time you have the bright idea to put heavy ass shit on the roof rack, don't.

 

[LandCruiser]

You assume people are thinking correctly when that moment of the flop passes.

You and I don't agree on a lot of things, but we've also done enough off-roading to know that off-roading is actually a thinking mans game. The vehicle wants to stay on the ground, shiny side up, until we as drivers do a stupid input on a bad line.

I don't think you ever STOP being nervous. Being nervous is a good thing because it means you care. You're taking at the minimum, a 40K vehicle, and putting it into a situation where it can very easily be totaled. If that doesn't tickle your butthole and make you nervous, you're doomed to screwing up.

Maybe it's because Black Bear is so well documented that people think it's not a challenge. It's really NOT a challenge as long as your head is screwed on.

I think the biggest take away is that complacency and institutional inertia kill. The minute you think something is easy and ignore the ramifications, the easiest stuff will get you. It's always human error.

It's also about having a 'feel' for the vehicle, that only comes after a lot of hours of wheel time.

I actually take my 80 out more not because it's better on trails, but I have a much better feel for where all the wheels and corners of that thing are vs my T4R.

This becomes critical when you don't have a spotter or your spotter is a dumbass. Nothing worse than trying to set up a line or follow the guy in front of you and not being sure where your damn wheels are on the trail. Best case scenario you've just scraped the shit out of your skids or sliders, worst case you're lined up with a giant hole you thought you were going to go around.

It's actually amazing how a trail you can easily walk can cause a 4x4 enough lean to tip if you floor the brake or jerk the wheel.