I've never seen the highways up in the mountains open in R3 conditions. Caltrans/CHP play it safe and shut down the roads. People can barely drive safely in R2 conditions. R3 would be a disaster.
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Owners 200+ miles from snow: Do you have snow tires?
- Thread starter mistervague
- Start date
I've never seen the highways up in the mountains open in R3 conditions. Caltrans/CHP play it safe and shut down the roads. People can barely drive safely in R2 conditions. R3 would be a disaster.
wallytoo
Member
true snow tires work excellent on snow-covered roads; better than all season tires, better than mud tires, better than all terrains. off-road winter driving is a different animal, and the best tire varies by type of snow, depth, and slope.
the advantage with snows is stopping and steering ability, they blow away other tire designs for those purposes. if you claim otherwise, you haven't driven in varied enough snow conditions or bad enough snow conditions that warrant using them. it isn't anecdotal, either; it has been tested and proven over decades.
if you live in places that see regular snowfall, where the snow sticks around after the storm, they are a smart choice. i carry a set of four chains, too, and use them a few times every winter, although mostly for driving unplowed or unmaintained roads.
the advantage with snows is stopping and steering ability, they blow away other tire designs for those purposes. if you claim otherwise, you haven't driven in varied enough snow conditions or bad enough snow conditions that warrant using them. it isn't anecdotal, either; it has been tested and proven over decades.
if you live in places that see regular snowfall, where the snow sticks around after the storm, they are a smart choice. i carry a set of four chains, too, and use them a few times every winter, although mostly for driving unplowed or unmaintained roads.
Snow Tires
I live in Minnesota and picked up a 2019 4Runner TRD - Off Road about two months ago. No snow tires here, owning a 4Runner I don't need snow tires, I just throw it into 4WD.
I used to live in Southern California until 2015. Had a cabin in the mountains, a cool spot called Arrowbear, We got obnoxious amounts of snow there. When you're taking two feet plus of snow and little to no plowing, a set of chain on all four corners added the grip I needed to mob through the snow.
My personal opinion, snow tires are for those that don't have 4WD. And having ice/snow snow driving skills will go a long way as well. There are a few tricks of the trade one can use to help you out when you're stuck. Such as a small bag if kitty litter in your vehicle. Sprinkle liberal amounts on the drive tires so you can grip. I carry tow straps in my 4Runner and my '17 Tacoma TRD-OR as well. Comes in handy to help people out. Not much worse than being stuck in the snow or ice. Much good Karma to gain by helping people out that are screwed and stuck.
I live in Minnesota and picked up a 2019 4Runner TRD - Off Road about two months ago. No snow tires here, owning a 4Runner I don't need snow tires, I just throw it into 4WD.
I used to live in Southern California until 2015. Had a cabin in the mountains, a cool spot called Arrowbear, We got obnoxious amounts of snow there. When you're taking two feet plus of snow and little to no plowing, a set of chain on all four corners added the grip I needed to mob through the snow.
My personal opinion, snow tires are for those that don't have 4WD. And having ice/snow snow driving skills will go a long way as well. There are a few tricks of the trade one can use to help you out when you're stuck. Such as a small bag if kitty litter in your vehicle. Sprinkle liberal amounts on the drive tires so you can grip. I carry tow straps in my 4Runner and my '17 Tacoma TRD-OR as well. Comes in handy to help people out. Not much worse than being stuck in the snow or ice. Much good Karma to gain by helping people out that are screwed and stuck.
mistervague
New member
Awesome tip. I’m doing this.
Side note — was in the Sierra yesterday and rescued a Range Rover. He had AWD but regular all season tires. Nothing doing. I gave him my chains to borrow, so he could drive up a nasty sheet of ice for like thirty feet and not slide back into me. Not a great fit but it it worked. Couldn’t find a good place on the front of his car to attach a snatch strap. My Nitto Terra Grapplers went up in 4Lo like it was dry pavement.
Tires make a huuuuge difference but after that I’m thinking maybe I don’t really need true winter tires? Still not sure. You don’t need them until you do?
Spending most of the winter in the CO Rockies, our situation is different, and we have snows on both wagons. Stopping and turning both clearly enhanced.
My comment to the OP is an economic one... for each month you are run snows you are keeping miles off your A/S tires, so you extend the life of your normal tires and delay having to replace them. Sure, snows don't last as long on dry roads, but you will likely not wear them out, they will die of old age first. Just a thought worth the ink!
My comment to the OP is an economic one... for each month you are run snows you are keeping miles off your A/S tires, so you extend the life of your normal tires and delay having to replace them. Sure, snows don't last as long on dry roads, but you will likely not wear them out, they will die of old age first. Just a thought worth the ink!
mistervague
New member
Yes I have wrestled with the math argument too. It's basically: If you buy two of X, they'll both last twice as long, so it doesn't actually cost you more. I don't think it quite works out that way (certainly not if you include separate wheels too so you don't mess up your nice rims swapping tires twice a year . . . plus money in your pocket is worth more than money already spent), but it helps justify.
I will say that while my Nitto Terra Grapplers generally did well on my last Sierra trip, they definitely did slip a bit backing down my icy driveway, and a little bit when I was stopped on an icy incline behind a stuck Range Rover. And as I mentioned in another thread, they routinely slip (really badly) when backing down my perpetually wet mossy driveway. So . . .
ElZilcho
New member
My $.02 is if you live in a place or have a lifestyle that allows you to look at the weather forecast and you can decide to simply not drive if the conditions are bad then you can avoid the snow tires. The first time you're disappointed that you're not making the trip you wanted you can comfort yourself in the knowledge that that decision effectively kept ~$1000 in your pocket.
I have Mountain/snowflake rated tires. I rarely "need" them in Chicago, but I travel pretty frequently to places that, may not see as much snow as others, but also may not see a plow for days after a snowstorm. In those situations the previously mentioned ~20% traction difference can make the difference of driving out today...or next week.
In my opinion, on well serviced roads (i.e. interstates and state highways) snow tires are less of a necessity than good judgment and practice. I've pulled a lot of 4wd vehicles with snow tires out of ditches after a snowstorm. The equipment was up to the task, but the driver wasn't.
I have Mountain/snowflake rated tires. I rarely "need" them in Chicago, but I travel pretty frequently to places that, may not see as much snow as others, but also may not see a plow for days after a snowstorm. In those situations the previously mentioned ~20% traction difference can make the difference of driving out today...or next week.
In my opinion, on well serviced roads (i.e. interstates and state highways) snow tires are less of a necessity than good judgment and practice. I've pulled a lot of 4wd vehicles with snow tires out of ditches after a snowstorm. The equipment was up to the task, but the driver wasn't.
Another thing to consider (for the penny pinchers that face snow on somewhat regular basis):
You: no snows:
If you are attentive enough to note if the driver in front of you is equipped with snows, great, you'll leave normal + a few more seconds buffer. All good.
If you are not attentive, leave marginal gaps to the car ahead, and the driver in front has snows, damn. Now you're at fault for rear ending them, and your $500-1000 saving just netted you double that in repairs, tows and bruise on your insurance record.
Clear to me.
Jetboy
New member
I did manage to get around in the snow okay last weekend on all terrain tires. (No that's not a commercial plow - Western Pro plows were my go-to for commercial use, but I don't think a 4Runner could handle 5-700lbs of plow up there. I only do it for my own driveway now.)
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