"Rumble Strip" Transmission issue

[4thGenFireAndRescu]

Flush All Your Fluid

My V8/Sport 4wd still has a torque converter shudder. Had the driveshaft balanced, tried shudder fix too. We have 148k miles on it and currently planning to get a couple quotes. The first shop, which comes highly recommended said $3600-$3800 for a rebuilt trans. I’m sorry, I’m not dumping 4 grand into a truck that’s maybe worth 6-7 grand. I’m hoping I can get this problem resolved for less than 3 grand. My other issue is, what’s next? I know it needs a power steering pump. This is where my husband and I disagree. He doesn’t see anything wrong with dumping thousands into a car that is 14 years old as long as we don’t have a payment. We do tow with it and need 4wd. My feeling is, if the problem can be fixed for a few grand, fine. However, are we putting off the inevitable? At some point, we’re going to have to do something.
I work for Nissan (ironic? Isn’t it?) and I can get a titan for dealer cost with zero percent 60mo financing. I don’t want a car payment. Nobody does. But I don’t want to dump thousands into a 14, almost 15 year old car. Does anyone have a thought? Keep your fingers crossed as in a couple weeks, I should know what our options are.

I would first start with doing a full transmission fluid flush, make sure you get all of the old bad transmission fluid out of the transmission. You cant just put 2 oz of additive into completely shot fluid which at full capacity of the transmission is 102.4 oz and expect it to work. Also do not put in Toyota Type WS brand fluid in it, that fluid is garbage. Use Castrol to start and run that for the first 5,000 miles, and then dump it and put either the same stuff in or AMSOIL. A note on this so called lifetime fluid - Toyota Type WS, it's speculated that Toyota means lifetime of the powertrain warranty which is only 100k IF you fall under the normal style driving(nobody does), so that brings it down to the severe powertrain warranty which is only 60k max. So unless you have a temp guage to watch your tranny temp and know how many times the temp of your tranny fluid went above the threshold of the Type WS you should have probably changed it earlier than 60k. Now after you do this fluid change it will take a good 100 miles to work its magic by cleaning everything and get the transmission working like normal. Once that first fluid gets a chance to wash all the parts there will be residual dirty fluid leftover from cleaning everything. Then you put in the new stuff and you'll be good to go. BTW I never even used the shudder fix, just changed all of the fluid and was good to go. Goodluck!

 

[Mac78610]

Toyota WS fluid

Within the last 6 months I installed an auxiliary transmission cooler and scangauge II to monitor tranny temps. WhT is the threshold temp for the stock Toyota fluid you referenced?

 

[4thGenFireAndRescu]

Within the last 6 months I installed an auxiliary transmission cooler and scangauge II to monitor tranny temps. WhT is the threshold temp for the stock Toyota fluid you referenced?

I'm not really sure the number but there were some other guys in previous posts of this thread that were referenced. These guys are crazy smart, they're hydraulic engineers that work with hydraulics daily. Anyway they said that this WS fluid is garbage. It's good for low temps in the winter for good flow when it's cold but it can't take the heat. The fluid breaks down super fast that then creates deposits and sludge, which then coats the friction material of the clutch packs. I always say it's like a good piece of sandpaper that's clogged with paint, once you clean off the paint your good to go. I'm sure if you find a bottle of it or find it online it should say its temp range. Either way the main reason Asin made the fluid this way is for legal regulations for service life so they didn't have to pay big fees on having fluid that needed to be changed a lot. Although they found out later the fluid is junk. Kinda like dexcool where they said it'll last forever and it definitely doesn't lol.

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[07V8]

I'm not really sure the number but there were some other guys in previous posts of this thread that were referenced. These guys are crazy smart, they're hydraulic engineers that work with hydraulics daily. Anyway they said that this WS fluid is garbage. It's good for low temps in the winter for good flow when it's cold but it can't take the heat. The fluid breaks down super fast that then creates deposits and sludge, which then coats the friction material of the clutch packs. I always say it's like a good piece of sandpaper that's clogged with paint, once you clean off the paint your good to go. I'm sure if you find a bottle of it or find it online it should say its temp range. Either way the main reason Asin made the fluid this way is for legal regulations for service life so they didn't have to pay big fees on having fluid that needed to be changed a lot. Although they found out later the fluid is junk. Kinda like dexcool where they said it'll last forever and it definitely doesn't lol.

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I’m a recovering mechanical engineer and I disagree with your sentiments. What proof do you have that WS fluid gunks up transmissions? There are tons of members with high mileage vehicles with transmissions that behave like they did when new. I will agree with you that the fluid should be changed out every 100k miles but disagree that other fluid is better. I have 200k on mine and its function is as good as new.

I recall that the viscosity breakdown temperature of WS fluid is in excess of 400F and that was consistent with what Amsoil and Castrol’s products did as well. This is in alignment with the ATF light which comes on when torque converter temperatures hit 300F. I have a Scangauge and the highest temp I have seen in the torque converter has been 200F. The pan has not exceeded 175F - well within the safe operating range.

If “sludge” deposits are a real thing, we’d have way more reported fluid induced transmission problems across Toyota’s fleet. That’s simply not the case.

 

[4thGenFireAndRescu]

I’m a recovering mechanical engineer and I disagree with your sentiments. What proof do you have that WS fluid gunks up transmissions? There are tons of members with high mileage vehicles with transmissions that behave like they did when new. I will agree with you that the fluid should be changed out every 100k miles but disagree that other fluid is better. I have 200k on mine and its function is as good as new.

I recall that the viscosity breakdown temperature of WS fluid is in excess of 400F and that was consistent with what Amsoil and Castrol’s products did as well. This is in alignment with the ATF light which comes on when torque converter temperatures hit 300F. I have a Scangauge and the highest temp I have seen in the torque converter has been 200F. The pan has not exceeded 175F - well within the safe operating range.

If “sludge” deposits are a real thing, we’d have way more reported fluid induced transmission problems across Toyota’s fleet. That’s simply not the case.

My proof is my own transmission and real life testing, but I'm just a mechanic, not mechanical engineer. I still say the fluid is junk because I have a 1997 F350 with 245k towing a 31ft trailer its whole life and the transmission fluid is still good. That fluid was tested by an oil analysis company, and they gave the report with all the specs and also stated it was still good.

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[AuSeeker]

My proof is my own transmission and real life testing, but I'm just a mechanic, not mechanical engineer. I still say the fluid is junk because I have a 1997 F350 with 245k towing a 31ft trailer its whole life and the transmission fluid is still good. That fluid was tested by an oil analysis company, and they gave the report with all the specs and also stated it was still good.

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Just curious have you had the WS fluid tested?

 

[07V8]

Just curious have you had the WS fluid tested?

Agree, do you have proof of breakdown?

 

[4thGenFireAndRescu]

Just curious have you had the WS fluid tested?

If you go to post #280 you can see why I didn't bother getting an analysis done. If they were free, sure I would have sent a sample to the lab just for the knowledge. Check out the link below and read every post and every reference in that forum if you want to learn why the WS fluid is bad. Either way I have an F350 with a 7.5L that did not have fuel efficiency in mind when it was designed. What is was designed to do was work hard, not be efficient. Ford threw in quality fluids that were meant to protect it more than be efficient. That fluid thats 10 years older, 100k more miles, worked much harder, looked way better than the 4runners.

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...e-get-it-out-of-your-transmission-now.331521/

 

[Derek]

Does anyone know what size socket is needed to remove the fill plug on the side (labeled WS)? I have a 2007 V6 2WD and it looks a little different than the pictures posted in this thread but it's in the same location.

I don't have a socket large enough so I attempted to remove it with an adjustable wrench but could not get a good enough grip. Looks like I need to purchase the proper sized socket to get it off. Thanks!

EDIT: looks like it’s 24mm

 

[rwh963]

is there a sticky on proper technique for changing this fluid?

 

[MattieBoy]

I have had the same "rumble-strip" problem with my 05 v6. Did 5 drain and fills and still didn't solve the issue. Had the local shop do a full flush of the system and still didn't solve the issue. Even with driving it for a week after the flush the problem still continued. Would HIGHLY recommend changing spark plugs. That is what solved my issue was tranny flush and spark plug change.

 

[hutchison]

I had my 05 v6 sr5 only for 3 weeks 195k. I had rumble strip + vibration from the get go, happened at gentle throttle pushing at 25 and 35, I took it in to a transmission shop had them drop the pan, fluid looked reasonably dark red. not so much crap in the pan, refilled with WS fluid, still had the issue. I dropped a tube of shudder fixx in today and took it for a spin, no shudder!. + 1 for shudder fixx.

:music:

 

[crimedog]

I do not know if WS is crap fluid. But I will tell you that I just bought an '06 V8 Limited with 235,000 miles. No rumble strip issue. The guy kept meticulous records and had owned it since it had 40k on it.

It shifted flawlessly but I am not one of those people who is scared to have a high mileage transmission flushed. Took it to the shop with instructions to be thorough and let me know of any issues.

When I picked it up, the owner of the shop said he was pretty sure that it was original fluid. It was not black, or burnt. He said it was maroon in color but didn't look bad considering the mileage.

This T4R has seen mostly highway miles, very limited towing of a small trailer but in my opinion if WS was so awful, it would not shift the way it does and it would have looked much worse than it did.

Just my $.02. Obviously doesn't mean much.

 

[07V8]

Color isn’t NOT indicative of fluid condition. Period.

 

[Hunter.Cribb]

"Rumble Strip" Transmission issue

I recently purchased a 2006 4Runner limited 4wd with 150,000 miles. I recently started to notice a slight bucking/jerking between 40-45 under slight acceleration. Now It seems to happen at lower speeds while accelerating and decelerating. I don’t know if this is related but I also have a whirring whine noise loudest at 30 mph under deceleration. Transmission fluid has been flushed at dealer and all new fluids in the front, rear diff and transfer case. Any ideas?


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[AuSeeker]

I recently purchased a 2006 4Runner limited 4wd with 150,000 miles. I recently started to notice a slight bucking/jerking between 40-45 under slight acceleration. Now It seems to happen at lower speeds while accelerating and decelerating. I don’t know if this is related but I also have a whirring whine noise loudest at 30 mph under deceleration. Transmission fluid has been flushed at dealer and all new fluids in the front, rear diff and transfer case. Any ideas?


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Add a tube of Shudder Fixx in your transmission and see if that helps with the shudder, great stuff most of the time it solves the common shudder issue if that is truly the cause of your issue, you can find it at most auto parts stores.

https://www.amazon.com/Lubegard-196...8&qid=1544308722&sr=8-1&keywords=shudder+fixx

The whining I don't think is related to the common shudder most experience so I doubt the Shudder Fixx will help that

 

[4thGenFireAndRescu]

I recently purchased a 2006 4Runner limited 4wd with 150,000 miles. I recently started to notice a slight bucking/jerking between 40-45 under slight acceleration. Now It seems to happen at lower speeds while accelerating and decelerating. I don’t know if this is related but I also have a whirring whine noise loudest at 30 mph under deceleration. Transmission fluid has been flushed at dealer and all new fluids in the front, rear diff and transfer case. Any ideas?


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It took me about 100 miles worth of driving for it to stop shuttering. The more miles I put on it the better it got. The new fluid is literally cleaning sludge/deposits/crap whatever you want to call it off of the internal parts of the transmission and depending on how "dirty" your internals are it might take a while. Try throwing the transmission in neutral while decelerating, and if the noise goes away then it probably is the transmission. Pay attention to the RPM to and try to locate at what RPM it is the loudest, also see if it happens more when it is cold or hot, sometimes the noise can be the power steering. First start of the morning when the engine is cold, pop the hood open, start it, and start turning the wheel that will tell you if it's power steering or not. I also have a slight noise in the rear diff I think I've seen other people state this but never heard anything about it blowing up. I change my fluid to some heavy weight AMSOIL diff fluid, and I put on new tires the noise didn't go away. I also don't have any driveability issues so I'm not to worried about it. If your shuttering goes away, my personal recommendation is to drain all the fluid one more time, change the mesh filter, flush the tranny cooler, add the tranmission fluid, then add the shutter fix. This way all the "dirty" fluid used to clean the internals is out of the transmission, the old mesh filter is out, and then the shutter fix can "condition" all the parts with the new fluid. This will make sure the shutter fix isn't coating old/dirty fluid. My background is 30 years automotive, 11 years heavy overhaul aircraft mechanic, 12 years AMSOIL dealer, 5 years Mechanical Engineer.

 

[Hunter.Cribb]

"Rumble Strip" Transmission issue

Thanks for all the tips! I have noticed the shuddering does seem to be getting better the more I drive. Its gotten to the point where I can barely replicate it. As for the whirr noise I did put the car in neutral and the noise does go away. When I’m in drive right when it downshifts at 30 it’s loud while decelerating. When I am accelerating it sounds like a rotational noise at 30. 55-70 the humming goes away for like 2 seconds after I let off gas then returns. I put Royal purple synthetic in the diffs and transfer case. It doesn’t bother me but what’s unfortunate is I just went through this with my last car (Nissan Xterra) and ended up having to rebuild the rear Diff. Also whether it’s cold or hot noise is still present and same sounds.


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[00GTvert]

Hey guys -
My 2005 has the same symptoms as described in this thread. I'm going to do a drain/fill and add a tube of shudder fix.

It seems pretty straight forward. My only question is that the pictures of the trans pan in this thread show a fill bolt with a hex head. It seems my fill is like the one in my attachment. I was able to get a 22mm med well socket on it and turn it quite easily so I'm confident it'll come right out.

Can someone please confirm this is indeed the fill bolt/port for my SR5 V6?

thanks

 

[AuSeeker]

Hey guys -
My 2005 has the same symptoms as described in this thread. I'm going to do a drain/fill and add a tube of shudder fix.

It seems pretty straight forward. My only question is that the pictures of the trans pan in this thread show a fill bolt with a hex head. It seems my fill is like the one in my attachment. I was able to get a 22mm med well socket on it and turn it quite easily so I'm confident it'll come right out.

Can someone please confirm this is indeed the fill bolt/port for my SR5 V6?

thanks

That is not the fill plug, the fill plug is about half way up from the pan and the top of the transmisson body.

You can see it in this PDF document about halfway down the page, it shows the fill plug is on a 4WD/750F and the 2WD/750E, both are on the tail section.

https://shop.ukrtrans.biz/wp-content/uploads/catalogs/A750E.pdf