Spare Tire Cable/Winch replacement

[seneam99]

Thanks. I’ll give it a try. I guess I’ll have to prop up the tire with some wood first so I can free it from the retainer before I can work on the winch.

 

[ArthurKotb]

Thanks. I’ll give it a try. I guess I’ll have to prop up the tire with some wood first so I can free it from the retainer before I can work on the winch.

Suggestion:
If you have a floor jack, and can get the tire back up again, put a 2X6 square on the jack and jack it up to the tire. Turn the crank as far as you can so you have loose cable. Lower the tire until you can unhook the cable, then lower the tire the rest of the way and pull it out.

 

[seneam99]

Update: after spraying the cable and winch with a bunch of wd40, I was able to crank the tire all the way down. Looks like the problem is that the cable had some frayed wires in it, causing it to get stuck in the winch. I trimmed the wires a little, but I guess the whole thing should be replaced for the long term. Lots of rust around the bolts, and I can only see two of them, so I guess the other 4 sit on top of the winch? I can’t even feel them when sticking my hand up there.

 

[AuSeeker]

They're a few posts about replacing the tire carrier on the forum, a search should turn some of them up, but if I remember correctly the rest of the bolts are on top and hard to get too, many ended up have to cut the assembly apart and then cut the bolts, it sounds like with the rust you mentioned you will have to do similar.

I do know the new Toyota replacements have a chain instead of the cable.

Edit: Some search results, only look at the ones for 4th Gens though.

https://www.toyota-4runner.org/gsea...w.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/?nojs=1&ss=

 

[rdruss]

Yep, replacing the assembly is a real PITA on rusted vehicles! Took me several hours.

 

[Dan6789]

This is what mine looked like when I finally got it out.

 

[gookies]

This is what mine looked like when I finally got it out.

What did you do to get yours out? Seems like cutting the bolt threads with a dremel until it's almost flushed with the plate and then drilling the rest out would be an approach I would take. Think someone earlier said they use an air hammer chisel and another, a multi-tool.

 

[Dan6789]

What did you do to get yours out? Seems like cutting the bolt threads with a dremel until it's almost flushed with the plate and then drilling the rest out would be an approach I would take. Think someone earlier said they use an air hammer chisel and another, a multi-tool.

If I recall correctly I tore it apart from the bottom with pry bar, hammer and angle grinder. Then used the angle grinder to dig into the bolts from underneath until enough of each bolt was gone to pry it off. After reading how hard it was going to be on rust belt vehicles I was hoping the bolts would just break off and the part fall out but I could not get anything to grab onto the head of the bolt enough to get any movement out of them.

 

[chris_tatertot]

I recently faced this issue as well. All my TPMS sensors were bad (2007 4runner). Tech at the auto shop called said they could not get the spare tire down. Said the cable was frayed. They ask if it was ok to force I said yes go ahead.
I drove home with the spare in the rear cargo hold. They quoted $400 - $500 to fix the spare tire carrier. I said no thanks I can do this. Like others mentioned the bolts are very difficult to get to. I went to harbor freight and bought this Access to this page has been denied wrench which is low profile and flexible head and it is long for lots of leverage.

Because some of the bolts were so rusted I also had to buy these bolt biters. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07PNS5QH4?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1. The bolt biters worked awesome by the way.

Also a bit of Kroil spray seemed to help loosen the rust.

I then bought a new Toyota OEM spare tire carrier on ebay for $100. I spent more then I planned for to get it fixed but still saved a significant amount.

 

[4runherpow]

If the cable is rusted in place, it is useless to try to save it. I know, because I have replaced two of them on two different vehicles. The easiest way I have found to get the spare removed, when the cable mechanism is frozen, is to cut the cable. I was able to reach the cable with a portable, battery operated reciprocating saw with a 6" metal cutting blade. Just be careful, because the tire/wheel assy., is heavy. The cable cuts fairly easily. Once the tire is out of the way, you have to remove 6 bolts that come from the top down, that hold the lift assy., to the cross member. There isn't a lot of room to get at them, and, in my case, they were badly rusted. So, I wound up cutting them with an air chisel. Once the old one is down, install the new one, with new bolts. As I understand it, Toyota no longer sells the cable style lift, the old part number is superseded to the newer chain style, which is what I got when I changed the last one about a year and a half ago.

The hardest part is removing the old one. Once off, it only takes about 15 min to install the new one.

Hey TechWrench, I'm dealing with this issue now. What's the best way to cut these bolts? I don't have an air hammer but can go to Harbor Freight and get one. I've cut bolts with cutting wheels but never an air hammer. Plus, like you said in another thread, even once I cut the bottom of the bolt off don't I then have to drill the bolt from underneath and retap the cross member?

Thanks for the advice. What an absolute PITA this dumb job (and design) is.

Jon

 

[4runherpow]

I recently faced this issue as well. All my TPMS sensors were bad (2007 4runner). Tech at the auto shop called said they could not get the spare tire down. Said the cable was frayed. They ask if it was ok to force I said yes go ahead.
I drove home with the spare in the rear cargo hold. They quoted $400 - $500 to fix the spare tire carrier. I said no thanks I can do this. Like others mentioned the bolts are very difficult to get to. I went to harbor freight and bought this Access to this page has been denied wrench which is low profile and flexible head and it is long for lots of leverage.

Because some of the bolts were so rusted I also had to buy these bolt biters. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07PNS5QH4?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1. The bolt biters worked awesome by the way.

Also a bit of Kroil spray seemed to help loosen the rust.

I then bought a new Toyota OEM spare tire carrier on ebay for $100. I spent more then I planned for to get it fixed but still saved a significant amount.

Hey Chris,

Interesting approach. So you used the bolt biter from the bottom to grab the threaded portion, some penetrating oil, then started losening from the bottom with the biters, then finished with the low profile wrench and socket from top?

Did I get that right? And what's the bolt head size? It feels like 14mm but could you confirm?

Thanks!

 

[AuSeeker]

Hey TechWrench, I'm dealing with this issue now. What's the best way to cut these bolts? I don't have an air hammer but can go to Harbor Freight and get one. I've cut bolts with cutting wheels but never an air hammer. Plus, like you said in another thread, even once I cut the bottom of the bolt off don't I then have to drill the bolt from underneath and retap the cross member?

Thanks for the advice. What an absolute PITA this dumb job (and design) is.

Jon

The member you quoted hasn't been back on the forum in 3 years.

That being said you should be able to cut the bolts with a disk.

From what I understand there are bolts and nuts attaching it, so there shouldn't be anything to have to drill out.

I would also suggest that you use a floor jack to support the tire if you have to cut the cable.

 

[MikeinNH67]

I was just typing something similar to AuSeeker, neither of the members quoted has been on the forum for well over a year. Air hammers are great as a backup tool but generally a chisel will do the job. I'm all for buying more tools though. Where an air hammer shines is if you can get a slice in a nut with a cutoff wheel, a sharp air chisel will make short but loud work of what is left. I find a dremel with a cutoff wheel works great in tight spaces. Keep us posted please a different viewpoint always help others.

 

[88Center]

TOOLS

I was able to remove mine with just a wrench, after trying for hours and several diff methods.

$21 GEARWRENCH 12mm 4 Degree Swing Arch 12 Point Flex Head Ratcheting Combination Wrench - 86712

GEARWRENCH 12mm 4 Degree Swing Arch 12 Point Flex Head Ratcheting Combination Wrench - 86712 - Amazon.com

----------------

REMOVAL

12mm wrench has 90 gear teeth and I'm not joking when I say I could only turn those outer bolts a few teeth at time. Oddly, once I loosed one of the bolts, I could turn one of the other bolts by hand from the bottom to reverse the out the top. But the other one I had to wrench out all the way. And putting them back in was equally a pain.

After you remove the two outer bolts, you can remove the dumb protective plate which gives better access to the remaining four bolts.

----------------

NOTES

Maybe the dumbest design I've ever seen from Toyota. The two outer bolts are nearly inaccessible.

Dremel tool did not work because it couldn't fit in the space. Too many things in the way.

Spare tire should go underneath with the valve stem facing up.

New chain-style winch is smooth as silk, but the chain links hang down through the spare tire. I tried tucking it back up into the rim but it fell back out. So I decided to use a zip tie to take up the slack so it doesn't flop around while I'm driving.

----------------

 

[4runherpow]

TOOLS

I was able to remove mine with just a wrench, after trying for hours and several diff methods.

$21 GEARWRENCH 12mm 4 Degree Swing Arch 12 Point Flex Head Ratcheting Combination Wrench - 86712

GEARWRENCH 12mm 4 Degree Swing Arch 12 Point Flex Head Ratcheting Combination Wrench - 86712 - Amazon.com

----------------

REMOVAL

12mm wrench has 90 gear teeth and I'm not joking when I say I could only turn those outer bolts a few teeth at time. Oddly, once I loosed one of the bolts, I could turn one of the other bolts by hand from the bottom to reverse the out the top. But the other one I had to wrench out all the way. And putting them back in was equally a pain.

After you remove the two outer bolts, you can remove the dumb protective plate which gives better access to the remaining four bolts.

----------------

NOTES

Maybe the dumbest design I've ever seen from Toyota. The two outer bolts are nearly inaccessible.

Dremel tool did not work because it couldn't fit in the space. Too many things in the way.

Spare tire should go underneath with the valve stem facing up.

New chain-style winch is smooth as silk, but the chain links hang down through the spare tire. I tried tucking it back up into the rim but it fell back out. So I decided to use a zip tie to take up the slack so it doesn't flop around while I'm driving.

----------------

Lol, you have like NO RUST. Very nice and super jealous.

I can see how the dremel will be challenging. I wish there was a way to just open up the hoist and remove the cable, replace and lube. Taking this thing apart looks horrendous. Plus see my rust!

On another note: my plan is to use strong steel mesh, JB iron weld puddy, and por15 gap filler to recreate the rear bumper and reinforce these holes, especially the ones around the body mount. What do you guys think of those holes around the mount? It makes me feel sketchy that the rust rot is all the way up to the welds. I did a patch job with the method above on a hole in the front and it seems to have stopped the rust and a year later the JB weld (which is super hard) is still intact. I know it's not the proper fix, but I figured if I can literally recreate the rear bumper and fill all of those massive holes, the structural integrity should hopefully be enough to stop the rust and keep the truck going another 2-3 years. Thanks for any thoughts. I'll post pictures of the progress. I already wire wheeled and used the rust neutralizer (nasty stuff) soaked it and washed it. Next is a few coats of rustoleum spray, then the fix I described, then por-15 the hole thing.

I was just typing something similar to AuSeeker, neither of the members quoted has been on the forum for well over a year. Air hammers are great as a backup tool but generally a chisel will do the job. I'm all for buying more tools though. Where an air hammer shines is if you can get a slice in a nut with a cutoff wheel, a sharp air chisel will make short but loud work of what is left. I find a dremel with a cutoff wheel works great in tight spaces. Keep us posted please a different viewpoint always help others.

Appreciate the help. I'm not confident and cutoff wheel will fit. I'd almost the point where I'm cool paying someone $400-500 to get it off and new one in. The tire is already out I cut the cord. I have the parts oem. I bet my Toyota dealer wouldnt touch it, and I need someone to work on it that has done this before.

The member you quoted hasn't been back on the forum in 3 years.

That being said you should be able to cut the bolts with a disk.

From what I understand there are bolts and nuts attaching it, so there shouldn't be anything to have to drill out.

I would also suggest that you use a floor jack to support the tire if you have to cut the cable.

Yea, lol. When that tire dropped, it dropped quick.

 

[4runherpow]

By the lack of response seems like people don't like my idea lol :toilet3:

 

[ArthurKotb]

Mine seized up several years ago and I was able to shoot lube into the cranking mechanism and after an hour it was working again. Since then it's an annual maintenance item to lower the tire, grease the cable and shoot more lube into that take up reel.

Before I got lucky I looked at some YouTube videos and didn't find much for my 2004 4Runner. I did find one for either a GX460 or Land Cruiser of the same year. On the Lexus models the cross members were bolted to the frame on each side, whereas the 4Runners were welded. I thought if I couldn't free it I would somehow cut my cross member on one side (if that would work) and access the bolts that were on top, make the repair, then weld the cross member back to the frame.

With as much rust as you have (mine is really clean and almost no rust) you might consider cutting the cross member. I couldn't see any other way to get to those bolts. You might find a better one at a junk yard and just replace it by welding it back.

Of course, the $500 option for a body shop might be the easiest and least painful.

 

[MikeinNH67]

Ooof, that's more rusty than my truck is but I try to patch mine with welded on metal every year. I'm at the point of passing the truck on to the next guy though. In your case, the only thing I recommend for the frame is welding on Safe-t-caps. You really have very little structural integrity left back there and I bet you have more holes in other areas. On mine, I am currently repairing the driver's side front frame where the bumper bracket attaches. At least the brackets are cheap.

As for the spare tire, like ArthurKotb, I was able to get my tire winch to free up by working it back and forth gently with tons of penetrant and lubing it at least once a year. It took quite awhile to free up.

I am also a bit jealous of 4runherpow's rust free truck. Dang.

One more thing to add, looking at the pictures, if I had to replace the winch I would contemplate cutting through the floor above but I have the gear to weld it back together.

 

[4runherpow]

Ooof, that's more rusty than my truck is but I try to patch mine with welded on metal every year. I'm at the point of passing the truck on to the next guy though. In your case, the only thing I recommend for the frame is welding on Safe-t-caps. You really have very little structural integrity left back there and I bet you have more holes in other areas. On mine, I am currently repairing the driver's side front frame where the bumper bracket attaches. At least the brackets are cheap.

As for the spare tire, like ArthurKotb, I was able to get my tire winch to free up by working it back and forth gently with tons of penetrant and lubing it at least once a year. It took quite awhile to free up.

I am also a bit jealous of 4runherpow's rust free truck. Dang.

One more thing to add, looking at the pictures, if I had to replace the winch I would contemplate cutting through the floor above but I have the gear to weld it back together.

Yea, I wish "4runherpow's" truck was rust free. That's me lol.

You think the structural integrity is shot? I wasn't crazy concerned about the holes in the back but the gashes leading up to the rear driver's side body mount is what bothered me. I figured it looks still ok enough where if I get all the rust out and respray (which I did) and pack the cracks with a bunch of JB weld and high strength crack sealant it might preserve what I have which would maybe be enough?

I don't know how to weld, but I replaced the exhaust manifolds and did the job right in point - no broken bolts, runs perfect. Give you an idea I'm decent with a wrench but is welding a big step up skill, money wise?

The truck otherwise has a lot of good qualities. Very routine maintenance, new suspension - most every where now and very well taken care of.

How much could I even get for her with all the rust?

 

[4runherpow]

Also, dumb question but the more I think about it - a body mount isn't exactly "structural" right? What would happen if one of those rotten out? Because my front passenger side has a big hole inside the frame where the mount is attached, kind of hidden by the mount. I bet if a lot of owners pushed inside that space they'd notice the same thing - metal crumbling away.

Like the rear looks really bad but as long as I'm not towing, is it a massive issue?