Spidertrax install makes me nervous...

[Gerdo]

How long have you had your Spidertrax now?

Look at the difference in size between the nuts they provided on May last year when I bought mine, compared to the nuts that came with the kit I bought yesterday for my brother...1/4" shorter this time.

That was the reason I changed my bolts, because of the longer nuts which went past the stock bolts.

If the short ones come flush with the end of the threads then I wouldn't worry about the taller ones falling short.

A general rule about thread engagement is... The thread/nut engagement should equal the width of the bolt.

 

[BrianSD_42]

Yes but in the OP's first picture it looks like he is running with *newer* (and I assume shorter) lug nuts.

So what is happening here? It seems to me that if I ordered the spacers tomorrow and installed the lugnut kit, I would have bolts that slightly stick out from the lugnuts and do not match the OPs picture.

 

[blcktpgsr]

blcktpgsr,

I'm confused. Sorry but is the good one on the left?

If Spidertrax is now shipping the shorter nuts then shouldn't the bolts be sticking out of the nuts instead of being recessed? I mean those bolts are actually still the factory wheel bolts correct?

I guess I am not really understanding the differences. If there is a suspicion that these new bolts don't cut it for us overly cautious members, perhaps we can put all-pro lug nuts on the SpiderTrax or just go with All-Pro.

I am leaning towards the SpiderTrax for 2 reasons that some people might consider stupid:
1) SpiderTrax are slightly more expensive, I assume there could be a 5-20% difference in steel quality
2) SpiderTrax are anodized blue

Sorry for confusing you but, the sets of nuts on the left are the ones that came with the kit last year. For some reason, the Spidertrax kit I recently ordered came with the shorter ones.

Yes, Installing these shorter version Spidertrax nuts on the stock bolts will result in a flush mount fit on the studs.........More accurately, there'll be a little of the stock studs sticking out.

The OP had his installed around the same time I did mine last year, and those batch of nuts were longer. The picture he provided shows those longer nuts installed on stock Toyota studs.

 

[blcktpgsr]

If the short ones come flush with the end of the threads then I wouldn't worry about the taller ones falling short.

A general rule about thread engagement is... The thread/nut engagement should equal the width of the bolt.

Ha ha:cheers:, I knew that then but I still felt more secure knowing every thread on those nuts were engaged.

 

[martini]

I took off the spacers to make sure I didn't lose a wheel weight, and I have no vibration without the spacers. I'm going to try and move them around to different locations next.

I solved my vibration problem, and it's not due to the spidertrax, it just seems that spidertrax make the ride more sensitive to vibration but doesn't cause it. Using the "finger plate" as the tire place called it (Haweka adapter) when re-balancing my tires made a huge difference. I'll never get another balance without it. Now my ride is as smooth as can be with the spacers on.

 

[theizzardking]

Ha ha:cheers:, I knew that then but I still felt more secure knowing every thread on those nuts were engaged.

my explanation of the 6-7 threads rule was crap a few pages back, better page here

Notes on Nuts and Bolts

taken from page one.
________________________________________________________________
As nuts and bolts are not perfectly rigid, but stretch slightly under load, the distribution of stress on the threads is not uniform. In fact, on a theoretically infinitely long bolt, the first thread takes a third of the load, the first three threads take three-quarters of the load, and the first six threads take essentially the whole load. Beyond the first six threads, the remaining threads are under essentially no load at all. Therefore, a nut or bolt with six threads acts very much like an infinitely long nut or bolt (and it's a lot cheaper).

Stress on threads

Note how the majority of
the stress is on the first thread to the left.
Image from Spiralock.



Thread % %Sum
1 34% 34%
2 23% 55%
3 16% 71%
4 11% 82%
5 9% 91%
6 7% 98%

There is little point in having more than six threads in anything. Nuts with National Coarse threads typically have 5 threads in them, whereas nuts with National Fine threads have about 8 threads. Nuts are usually stronger than the bolts they are on, which is to say that the bolt will usually break before the nut strips.

It is often said that two threads must be exposed above a nut. The reason for this is that the first two threads of a bolt are often poorly formed, and may not engage the nut properly. If they're not doing their share, the other threads in the nut will be overloaded, and the nut may strip.
_________________________________________________________________
end
_________________


a good rule of thumb there, that said dissimilar metals though can cause a problem though, so only use this rule when working with 2 items the same, the math to recalculate this with different metal types is in my earlier post on this thread, i know not, exactly on topic but i think this is one of those simple rules that's good to know when your wondering about things like this and when doing some work at home and you have to drill and tap something.

 

[martini]

yeah to be completely honest the first 3 threads take about 98% of the loads and after that you don't have to be worried about sheer to much

Even knowing that there was enough thread engagement as pointed out by theizzardking with the older (taller) nuts that came with spidertrax on the front studs, I decided for piece of mind to change my studs out for longer ones.

The 4th gen (possibly other generations too) have 44mm rear studs (part 90942-02079) and 40mm front studs (part 90942-02049). I ordered 12 of the longer 44mm rear studs and installed them. Here are some before and after pictures of how the nuts look when properly torqued. Again these are the large nuts not the new shorter nuts as in this post (http://www.toyota-4runner.org/870450-post59.html).

Before with the 40mm front studs:

After with the 44mm front studs:

Comparison between length of each stud:

When I had the shorter studs I never had a problem, the nuts never loosened up. Also the longer shoulder length of the rear studs was not a problem using them on the front, the rotor is flush with the hub assembly and the shoulder does not stick out past the rotor on the outward side.