Stealership Scamming in a Bad Economy

[BamaDrewski]

I took my 2000 T4R in today for a front end alignment. They aligned it and did not charge me anything as they said it was still under warranty from the last alignment. I was pretty happy about that and then the service manager handed me a list of things they “noticed” should be done to my truck. He said the “valve cover gaskets are leaking” and they can replace them for $400+. Then he said I needed to change the front and rear differential fluids and the transfer case fluid. I listened intently and said; “Let’s go take a look.” (Knowing he was full of crap). I immediately noticed the hood had not even been opened because the dust was undisturbed with no finger prints from closing it) I opened the hood and pointed to the valve covers. They were clean as a whistle with no leaks. I asked him “Do you see any leaks?” He paused for a moment and said “I am not the mechanic.” I then pulled my personal service record out of my glove box and I showed him where I replaced the valve cover gaskets less than a year ago and as it so happens, I changed all the fluids on the differentials and transfer case just last week. I told him I thought it was “strange” they would say the valve cover gaskets were leaking when there was NO SIGN OF LEAKS and when I pointed out to him no one had opened the hood before me (the dust on the hood was undisturbed) he got kind of nervous and said “Maybe we mixed up your vehicle with another one that was being serviced.” I just smiled and said “Yeah, right buddy. I know this vehicle like the back of my hand and I understand you trying to get business but don’t try that SH!T on me again.”

 

[hambob]

Way to stick it the man, man! Just think about the people that don't know their vehicles like you. The dealer seems to bank on it. Sad.

 

[Jumpkix]

I took my 2000 T4R in today for a front end alignment. They aligned it and did not charge me anything as they said it was still under warranty from the last alignment. I was pretty happy about that and then the service manager handed me a list of things they “noticed” should be done to my truck. He said the “valve cover gaskets are leaking” and they can replace them for $400+. Then he said I needed to change the front and rear differential fluids and the transfer case fluid. I listened intently and said; “Let’s go take a look.” (Knowing he was full of crap). I immediately noticed the hood had not even been opened because the dust was undisturbed with no finger prints from closing it) I opened the hood and pointed to the valve covers. They were clean as a whistle with no leaks. I asked him “Do you see any leaks?” He paused for a moment and said “I am not the mechanic.” I then pulled my personal service record out of my glove box and I showed him where I replaced the valve cover gaskets less than a year ago and as it so happens, I changed all the fluids on the differentials and transfer case just last week. I told him I thought it was “strange” they would say the valve cover gaskets were leaking when there was NO SIGN OF LEAKS and when I pointed out to him no one had opened the hood before me (the dust on the hood was undisturbed) he got kind of nervous and said “Maybe we mixed up your vehicle with another one that was being serviced.” I just smiled and said “Yeah, right buddy. I know this vehicle like the back of my hand and I understand you trying to get business but don’t try that SH!T on me again.”

Toasty.

 

[BamaDrewski]

Thanks man. I was thinking the same thing. People want to trust their mechanics and most are probably not "enthusiasts" like those of us on this website. I have to admit, I smiled as I drove away. I did wonder however, how many people fall for that kind of crap!!!!!! Sad indeed......

 

[BrianSD_42]

[MENTION=25434]BamaDrewski[/MENTION]

what Toyota dealership was this at?


Your thread title implies that you went to a dealership (stealership)

If you just went to Bob's autoland then it is kind of confusing to the reader.

 

[nevada]

I don't really think its an issue of economy. I hear stories like this about dealerships quite often.

and...also independent shops. unfortunately, its EASY to do, since MOST people are very ignorant when it comes to cars.

 

[BamaDrewski]

Not sure who "Bob's Autoland" is or how that even came up in the thread but the dealership is in Central Alabama. They have always been very good and reliable but they fired their service manager not too long ago (after he had been there some 12 years) and now they are trying to pull this. Maybe he was not milking the customers enough for the company's bottom line.....

 

[cj80cruiser]

Not sure who "Bob's Autoland" is or how that even came up in the thread but the dealership is in Central Alabama. They have always been very good and reliable but they fired their service manager not too long ago (after he had been there some 12 years) and now they are trying to pull this. Maybe he was not milking the customers enough for the company's bottom line.....

Was this in the Gump?

 

[BamaDrewski]

OK. So it seems people want me to put the finger on where this happened. I think I am going to use the old spook quote when being asked a question that requires a specific answer. Here it goes: "I can neither confirm nor deny this was in the GUMP."

 

[SV_Dude]

I hate the way how some service centers do their business. My wife has a friend in Washington that works as a service manager at a dealership. Most of her paycheck comes from commission. They are paid extra to up-sell maintenance whether it is needed or not.

 

[Justin727]

I hate the way how some service centers do their business. My wife has a friend in Washington that works as a service manager at a dealership. Most of her paycheck comes from commission. They are paid extra to up-sell maintenance whether it is needed or not.

It's easy to blame the service advisers and managers for things like this. Usually they'll sell you on smaller items that may not need to be done rather than larger items.

What this appears to be is that a lazy technician made recommendations based on age or mileage of the vehicle.. A lot of techs do this in every automotive field that I've worked in. From dealerships, privates, and franchises.

Yes the managers and advisers make commission off of sales but the techs get paid off the hours sold as well. We've got a new system in place the makes the techs actually inspect the vehicles that come in whether it be an oil change or any other kind of service.

When it comes to things like this it frustrates me being because I myself had been an adviser when a lazy A$$ tech made assumptions of service because the age/mileage of a vehicle. Some even actually spend their time writing up detailed explanations of phantom issue's. For as long as it takes them to write this crap up they could have easily popped the hood and wrote things up as they were looking or not as it may have been recently done.

As an adviser this makes me look like an A$$ trying to sell you something you don't need that I even thought you needed and when a CSI survey comes in I get burned because of a tech not doing his job. I either A) take a pay cut B) get wrote up C) could cost me my job.

So please keep in mind that almost most of the time it's not the advisers fault (although sometimes it can be) ask them to walk out with you to the vehicle like the OP. If they try to rectify the situation please don't think it's them taking advantage of you.

I'd ask them to also pull the tech out and let him try to find the problems HE noted. You'll know by then who's trying to screw you.

I bet that adviser/manager felt like crap and got onto his tech for making him look like a thief.


There are some good advisers out there that have been burnt this way on many occasions.

 

[LittleCaesar]

The reason why the former service manager was fired was because he/she did not make the stealership enough business.

The reason I got my 4runner is that the previous couple who owned it since day one had to get the auto A/C unit replaced back in 2006 out of warranty for over $1100. They decided the 4runner was too expensive to keep. I have the receipt. Labor was $682.

It is pretty sad when people have to stoop to such a low level of greed. It is great that Bama Drewski is capable of recognizing it. Kinda of similar to what is playing out in DC at the moment.

 

[SV_Dude]

[MENTION=46141]Justin727[/MENTION]

I'm not saying they're all bad, but there are some people regardless of which side of the desk they're on that will try to get whatever they can out of you.

I think that if you're going to spend any large sum of money you need to do your research or get multiple opinions. Just because one person says you need to do something doesn't mean it's necessarily true.

 

[Justin727]

[MENTION=46141]Justin727[/MENTION]

I'm not saying they're all bad, but there are some people regardless of which side of the desk they're on that will try to get whatever they can out of you.

I think that if you're going to spend any large sum of money you need to do your research or get multiple opinions. Just because one person says you need to do something doesn't mean it's necessarily true.

Oh I know. I just wanted to put it out there some for the people that do not understand how it all works. Usually the first thing comes to mind is the advisers making commission off the sale when of course the tech is just if not more so guilty.

But also people that aren't mechanically knowledgeable do not be afraid to not only ask the adviser to point out the problems but the tech as well.

Being as I've been an adviser before and have been burnt by a lazy tech I don't want the perception to be that the adviser is always trying to screw you. I use to fight for my customers when it came to things that needed attention now. I use to get laundry list from techs on some cars. I would only sell them what they needed and advised them that in the future they may want or will be needing to do this etc.

I just look at them as they were my personal friends and what I would do personally. I can't begin to tell you how much my own business with these customers grew and how I became a great adviser(never had low CSI and had the most hours per RO). I was making almost as much as the manager in a region where the median income was 36k. An easy 6 figure yearly job for me.

I've had people offer me breakfast, lunch, dinner, presents, etc. I would usually personally buy gift cards to my most loyal customers that would always spend money on big repairs. It was always about helping people for me. Usually these people weren't happy to come in because they have to spend money they don't have. But over time these people were happy coming in because they knew the level of service and friendship I had with them that I would take care of them to the best of my abilities.

I loved it. Now I'm a lonely parts manager @ a Nissan dealership that gets hounded on why I drive nothing but Toyota's lol

 

[EatonKyleH]

As a tech for a living and having worked in both the dealer and independent repair shop environments I've always considered my repairs and diagnostic work to be directly related to my name and reputation.

My adviser always asks the customer the following as an offer.:
1: Do you want to come see what the technician is talking about?
2: Do you want to speak with/meet the technician?
3: Do you want your old parts back?

And if someone is still skeptical I'll welcome them to get a second opinion elsewhere.

Honestly finding the right shop/dealer/technician is about the relationship. When you have a good experience get his name/card, meet him even, and request him by name from then on. If he moves to another local shop follow with your business.

The technician that sees your vehicle makes more difference than the shop he/she works at. There are plenty of bad techs in the dealer world as there are in the independent. The same goes for the good ones.

 

[wc11]

Most service advisers are commission so they will always try to sell you some other service over & above what you need.

Having said that, I had one service adviser for my 89 and now 98 Runner.
Built a great relationship for 20+ years with him and he never screwed me. I was even getting the 15% seniors discount!
And I just turned 50.
Then he retired. Oh crap!

New adviser tried to screw me right away by selling me service I didn't need.
I wrote a complaint on the dealer website and 2 days later I get a call from the retired adviser apologizing. Like wow!
28 years he worked there so I guess he still has some pull.
He introduced me to the new team leader and assured me I'd be taken care of.
That was a year ago and all is well now.

 

[02SE]

As a tech for a living and having worked in both the dealer and independent repair shop environments I've always considered my repairs and diagnostic work to be directly related to my name and reputation.

My adviser always asks the customer the following as an offer.:
1: Do you want to come see what the technician is talking about?
2: Do you want to speak with/meet the technician?
3: Do you want your old parts back?

And if someone is still skeptical I'll welcome them to get a second opinion elsewhere.

Honestly finding the right shop/dealer/technician is about the relationship. When you have a good experience get his name/card, meet him even, and request him by name from then on. If he moves to another local shop follow with your business.

The technician that sees your vehicle makes more difference than the shop he/she works at. There are plenty of bad techs in the dealer world as there are in the independent. The same goes for the good ones.

Just reading your posts on here, it's obvious to me that you are honest in your dealings.

Twenty plus years ago as a Master Tech, I became disgusted with the lack of ethics, and got out of consumer auto repair business. The places I had worked (dealer and private shops) had the old up-sell routine down pat. If you didn't play ball with their 'scam every customer that comes through the door' philosophy, you quickly found yourself looking for another job.

At some point in that situation you need to ask yourself if your own integrity and character means anything.

I decided that it did, and got out of the biz to pursue starting my own business. The best and hardest decision I ever made.

Not too long after that, State Consumer Protection agencies really began cracking down on dishonest repair shops.

I had hoped the rampant up-selling of unnecessary repairs, had ended years ago. Apparently it still happens to some extent.



There are some preventive maintenance procedures that aren't always mentioned in a maintenance schedule, that I think are important for a vehicles longevity.

Mostly those are the so-called lifetime fluids, that some manufacturers promote. What they really should call them is short-lifetime fluids, because that is almost inevitably what happens to the components containing those fluids.

 

[Nelsonmd]

Props to Bama for calling them out on their dishonesty, though I am not sure why you are hesitant to say their name. What's the point of warning us if you won't tell us who is being dishonest? This is how they feel the consequences of their dishonesty, by their name getting out and people not going there as a result.

Secondly, for the guys that have worked at shops before, should't a customer that gets treated like Bama escalate up the dealer's management chain right then and there (not sure where the "advisor" is in the management chain, but I am thinking you should speak to whoever is the advisor's boss)? It seems to me that the biggest impact would be right there in the moment, to a manager that might actually have some influence in the "up-sell or lose your job" policy that might be in place, letting them know directly that the policy is losing them a customer (though obviously do it calmly, courteously, and firmly). If said manager doesn't have such a policy in place, then they should be made directly aware of their tech's behavior, and be allowed to deal with it as they see fit.

 

[BlazeRunner]

^^^ what nelson said... I used to be a service advisor at a Honda stealership, and if you would have went straight to my service manager about anything like that it would have been taken care of. If the service manager can't help, I'd go right to the general manager of that dealership. That was the direct management chain for where I worked, as service advisors were also called 'assistant service managers,' and answered directly to the service manager who only answered to the general manager.
Also, I agree with needing to name this dealership for others to know.

 

[BlackCat914]

just an fyi, if they were doing an alignment, they had it up in the air. Most valve cover gasket leaks are really only visible from the underside.