Suspension Mods: What you did and what it did for you

[badhabits]

Coming from a off-roading background in the 70s and early 80s I am not familiar with the new suspension technology. My experience consists of how high you could raise the leaf springs.

What I would to know is what mods you have done and the results from that mod, such as handling, ride, and overall feel of the 4runner. I own an SR5 but it would be nice to have this for all three models. I have looked at build threads and they tell what has been done but usually not the results.

I am familiar with the technical details of the different options but this is like knowing the technical details of sex, but until you have done it you do not really know how it feels.:frog:

The answers to this can save people a lot of money trying out different things to get the feel that they want out of their ride. For example I know that I want a firmer ride and a small amount of lift and after a lot of searching I found that the 5100s would probably do all I need, but it would be nice to have other solutions for comparison.
So if you do not mind a simple: This is what was done and this is how it affected the ride, handling, and feel.
BTW I already know what tires I am getting the Cooper AT/3 having used Coopers before I think they are a good choice.

Thank you in advance for helping.

 

[FatTiresRollin]

someone is going to ask...so it might as well be me...

What is your budget?????

How often and how tehcincal will your off-roading be?

 

[badhabits]

I am at the planning stage at this time, so what I am looking to find out is what the result of the different mods will be so I can plan what I need to do to spend all my money. So basically I am looking for different options at this time.
My offloading probably will not be that extensive but you never know.

 

[homeyclaus]

4Runner Suspension FAQ:

1. Why is my truck nose-diving?

It's softly sprung, softly damped, and really nose-heavy when empty.

2. Why does my neck hurt after driving it around alone for a few hours?

Because your suspension is fully extended when the 4Runner is unloaded. Understand that an empty, short, and narrow truck suspension is going to whip around at full extension. Put two other people and a few hundred pounds of stuff in the back, and your 4runner will drive like a car by comparsion.

3. How do I fix the above?

The easiest fix it to replace the shocks, either with Bilstein Heavy Duty shocks or the 5100 series, especially up front. 5100's also have the benefit of a longer stroke, so they provide effective damping over a wider load range.

4. I want to level my 4Runner.

This is a personal preference, but when you level an empty truck and then put stuff in it (which is a truck's job, take lots of heavy stuff places), it'll look like its butt is dragging. Also realize that you can significantly impact your vehicle's drag coefficient by changing the rake of the vehicle.

But if you want to, there are spacer kits available on the market that work, as well as using Bilstein 5100 shocks set to one or two settings above stock height.

5. I want to go "hard core" and lift it, what are my options?

If you lift for looks, spacers are generally fine.

5. I want a lift that's actually useful off-road, options?

Both Icon and Old Man Emu suspensions are available. The suspension of the 5th gen has not changed drastically from the 4th gen (or the 4th/5th gen FJ for that matter) so that parts "in general" are somewhat interchangeable.

Suspension Systems

2010+ Toyota 4Runner Coil Over Shocks, Uniball Arms, Suspension Systems

Total Chaos also makes coil-over suspensions for 4Runners.

TOTAL CHAOS FABRICATION

A favorite vendor of this forum is Toytec: Home - Toytec Lifts: Toyota Lift Kits: FJ Cruiser Lift Kits, Tacoma Lift Kits, Tundra Lift Kits, 4 Runner Lift Kits, Sequoia Lift Kits, Toyota Truck Lift Kits

6. The shop installing my new 5100 shocks into my trail edition says they need to (or disconnected the lines) for the KDSS system. Did they need to do that?

For a shock and minor lift install, only the sway bar needs to be un-bolted from the lower A arm mounts, the KDSS cylinder, and the other retaining mount. If they say they have to, go to another shop. Getting a toyota dealer to bleed and re-fill the KDSS system is expensive, if they can do it. Should they not be able to help, a Lexus dealer will have more experience with KDSS systems, as it has come with the GX and LX models for quite some time.

7. Do I lose my X-REAS on my limited if I install a suspension?

Unless it's just spacers, yes. X-REAS are hydraulically cross-connected shocks, so anything that replaces those shocks will also effectively disable X-REAS.

8. What does KDSS do?

It allows for a thicker sway bar to be used for better on-road handling, without affecting off-road wheel articulation. Wheel articulation between KDSS-equipped and non-KDSS 4runners is essentially the same, but the KDSS-equipped unit will have better on-road dynamics with less lean.

It does this using a pressure valve between two hydraulic cylinders and a relief valve. In corners, the load on the sway bars is the same, so the load on the cylinders is the same, and the sway bars are held fast. Off-road, one wheel being pushed to articulate while the other one is not, the pressure valve will allow the sway bar to yield, therefore allowing more suspension flex.

 

[homeyclaus]

Oh, and 5100's all around make the 4Runner drive the way it was supposed to. The only thing I regret about it is not doing it sooner.

 

[Randyman...]

Oh, and 5100's all around make the 4Runner drive the way it was supposed to. The only thing I regret about it is not doing it sooner.

And all the above stuff, too!

I also have a 4x4 SR5, and don't get too crazy with my off-road requirements beyond the T4R's factory capable feats (assuming you swap on some descent tires ). I did, however, have a huge desire to lessen my nose-dive and firm up the ride just a little, and lessen the rake.

Increasing the spring rate was not likely something that would benefit my expectations, and the 5100's seemed to be the ideal solution (with the 0.85" front lift to correct the rake a little). I have a permanent 300lbs of audio gear sitting on the rear axle, and could tell the rear shocks were more Cadillac than TRD. Stock SR5 cornering and braking was sloshy to say the least. I've had the truck since November, and this was just screaming to be addressed...

I installed a full set of 5100's this past Friday (had it aligned on Monday), set the fronts to 0.85" (the second slot), and added a 10mm Rear Driver's Coil Spacer to correct for my driver's side lean, and I'm tickled to death with the results.

It's not night and day by any means (have to take these things in context), but did get me where I want to be in terms of handling and nose-dive for this 2+ Ton beast

Next step would likely involve stiffer springs and additional lift w/285's, maybe a full set of poly bushings (do any exist for our 5th gen's?), new UCA's to allow better alignment specs "at height", and a diff drop if you go much beyond 1.5"-2" on the front IFS.

I think I'm cool with where I'm at for now WRT suspension and handling ($420 in parts plus my labor and $40 for Midas to compress the front springs).

Once the 5th Gen 4.0l TRD Supercharger comes out later this year - my stance on this might change (once I pay the supercharger off) :frog:

 

[badhabits]

Thank you gentlemen this is what I was looking for, It has given me more ideas on how to spend my money and set my truck up the way I would like.
I think that I will probably go with the 5100;s because of the lift and the heavy dampening, and the fact that at this time I not be doing any rock crawling.
:trophy:

 

[badhabits]

And all the above stuff, too!

Next step would likely involve stiffer springs and additional lift w/285's, maybe a full set of poly bushings (do any exist for our 5th gen's?), new UCA's to allow better alignment specs "at height", and a diff drop if you go much beyond 1.5"-2" on the front IFS.

What do you suggest for the spring replacement, FJ springs or what.

 

[Okki]

What do you suggest for the spring replacement, FJ springs or what.

There are various springs available for the FJ just like there are for the 4Runner, so the statement isn't as straight forward as that.

Depending on how much weight you are adding, or plan to be adding, the spring rate/weight will be different. Depending on where you are adding that weight, there will be different answers as well.

A 600lbs seems to be what most people settle on here (that usually covers skids and bumpers and winches that will be adding weight), although 650lbs are discussed as well if I recall correctly. the 650 is likely overkill.

Give the guys at Metal tech a call to talk through your specific needs.

Okki

 

[badhabits]

There are various springs available for the FJ just like there are for the 4Runner, so the statement isn't as straight forward as that.

Depending on how much weight you are adding, or plan to be adding, the spring rate/weight will be different. Depending on where you are adding that weight, there will be different answers as well.

A 600lbs seems to be what most people settle on here (that usually covers skids and bumpers and winches that will be adding weight), although 650lbs are discussed as well if I recall correctly. the 650 is likely overkill.

Give the guys at Metal tech a call to talk through your specific needs.

Okki

Very good point I did not think of the variables such as added weight due to mods. The question I have about this is there any thing that can be added with the 5100's that can help with the changing loads or is there another way to do stiffen the supension, or will the 5100s be enough?

I am new to all this high tech suspension equipment so any suggestions will help The answer from homeyclaus gave me a good start on what I might want to do.

 

[homeyclaus]

Very good point I did not think of the variables such as added weight due to mods. The question I have about this is there any thing that can be added with the 5100's that can help with the changing loads or is there another way to do stiffen the supension, or will the 5100s be enough?

I am new to all this high tech suspension equipment so any suggestions will help The answer from homeyclaus gave me a good start on what I might want to do.

The 5100's will tighten things up, and over extended use under load not degrade the same way. When the 4runner is packed to the max in terms of weight, it'll drive like a car. When empty, it'll suck less with 5100's but still feel like a truck.

As far as suspension tech goes, it's still springs, spring rate, and damping. Shocks have gotten much much better, and coil springs give you variable spring rates, but other than how they're installed, nothing has changed. And seriously, 2WD big three trucks have used a very similar front suspension setup since the 70's. It ain't new.

 

[badhabits]

The 5100's will tighten things up, and over extended use under load not degrade the same way. When the 4runner is packed to the max in terms of weight, it'll drive like a car. When empty, it'll suck less with 5100's but still feel like a truck.

As far as suspension tech goes, it's still springs, spring rate, and damping. Shocks have gotten much much better, and coil springs give you variable spring rates, but other than how they're installed, nothing has changed. And seriously, 2WD big three trucks have used a very similar front suspension setup since the 70's. It ain't new.

The more it changes the more it stays the same.

I do not mind the truck ride as I have owned older Ford F series trucks, but the 4runner wallows and I need to correct that aspect of the handling. Every one mentions the 5100's so this seems to be a start to solve this problem and I will investigate other mods to compliment the shocks.

Thank you for your help.