TE & SR5 have Auto Disconnecting Center Differential & Locking Center Differential

[sven]

TE & SR5 have Auto Disconnecting Center Differential & Locking Center Differential

Now I'm really confused. This PDF from Toyota says that all 2010 4Runners come standard with a Automatic Disconnecting Center Differential and a Locking Center Differential.

Does this mean that the SR5 and TE will have a center differential that unlocks automatically when in 4WD and the tires bind and don't slip, turning it into a 4WD with an open center differential? (As opposed to the limited slip Torsen center differential found in the 2010 Limited and all 4th gen 4Runners.) Does this mean you can drive the SR5 and TE in 4WD on dry pavement because it's an open center differential?

What's the difference between the Auto Disconnecting center differential and the Torsen center differential? Does the Auto Disconnecting have only two modes (locked and unlocked), while the Torsen has variable biasing between the front and rear differentials?

 

[Martinjmpr]

That is odd. If I read it correctly, the 4runner has part time 4wd, full time 4wd and multi-mode 4wd available? I understand the Limited is the full time 4wd but the part time and multi mode seem to be mutually exclusive - it's either one or the other.

Could possibly just be a typo in the chart? The 09's had multi mode, the '10's have part time?

 

[PredBlue]

That is odd. If I read it correctly, the 4runner has part time 4wd, full time 4wd and multi-mode 4wd available? I understand the Limited is the full time 4wd but the part time and multi mode seem to be mutually exclusive - it's either one or the other.

Could possibly just be a typo in the chart? The 09's had multi mode, the '10's have part time?

I agree with the typo--I caught the same thing.

The chart also shows the 4Runner has projector headlamps AND multi-reflector halo headlamps, when we know it doesn't have projector type.

 

[sven]

That is odd. If I read it correctly, the 4runner has part time 4wd, full time 4wd and multi-mode 4wd available? I understand the Limited is the full time 4wd but the part time and multi mode seem to be mutually exclusive - it's either one or the other.

Could possibly just be a typo in the chart? The 09's had multi mode, the '10's have part time?

It's beginning to make sense to me, I think. The 2010 part-time system is multi-mode 4WD with an open center differential that unlocks automatically if you drive on to dry pavement, while the 4th gen is multi-mode 4WD with a limited slip center differential that can be locked by the driver when not you're not driving on dry pavement.

 

[sven]

I agree with the typo--I caught the same thing.

The chart also shows the 4Runner has projector headlamps AND multi-reflector halo headlamps, when we know it doesn't have projector type.

Good point. Now I'm not so sure. Rather than a typo, I think the headlights were a last minute change to keep the price down. The differential/transfer case could also be a last minute change to keep the price down. I'm confused again.


Things were a lot simpler before they became complicated.

 

[JB.]

It's beginning to make sense to me, I think. The 2010 part-time system is multi-mode 4WD with an open center differential that unlocks automatically if you drive on to dry pavement...

If that were the case, they would be changing the definition of part-time.

I believe it's the same system as the 4th gen V6. Automatic differential disconnecting system connects/disconnects thefront differential to run in 2WD.

 

[sven]

If that were the case, they would be changing the definition of part-time.

I believe it's the same system as the 4th gen V6. Automatic differential disconnecting system connects/disconnects the front differential to run in 2WD.

If that were the case, they would be changing the definition of automatic.

On the 4th gen V6 don't you have to turn a dial to disconnect the front differential to run in 2WD?

 

[JB.]

If that were the case, they would be changing the definition of automatic.

On the 4th gen V6 don't you have to turn a dial to disconnect the front differential to run in 2WD?

Yes, I believe so, but I don't have the V6. The literature for the debut of the 4th gen lists the following feature of the 4WD V6: "Automatic disconnecting front differential (ADD)".

 

[JB.]

Now I'm really confused. This PDF from Toyota says that all 2010 4Runners come standard with a Automatic Disconnecting Center Differential and a Locking Center Differential.

Does this mean that the SR5 and TE will have a center differential that unlocks automatically when in 4WD and the tires bind and don't slip, turning it into a 4WD with an open center differential?

You may have discovered the source of the error in the original Edmunds article.

 

[Martinjmpr]

If that were the case, they would be changing the definition of automatic.

On the 4th gen V6 don't you have to turn a dial to disconnect the front differential to run in 2WD?

The automatic disconnecting differential (ADD) is on the front axle, not the T-case. My Tacoma with part time 4wd had an ADD as does my current part time 4runner. I believe the 4th gens have an ADD that is activated when the dial is switched from 4wd to 2wd.

The ADD takes the place of the old-fashioned locking hubs.

I've never heard of an "automatic locking center differential" on a transfer case. Do they even make those? On the 3rd and 4th gen 4runners that had the center diff, you had to manually lock the T-case, it was not automatic.

 

[dxntxn]

Now I'm really confused. This PDF from Toyota says that all 2010 4Runners come standard with a Automatic Disconnecting Center Differential and a Locking Center Differential.

Does this mean that the SR5 and TE will have a center differential that unlocks automatically when in 4WD and the tires bind and don't slip, turning it into a 4WD with an open center differential? (As opposed to the limited slip Torsen center differential found in the 2010 Limited and all 4th gen 4Runners.) Does this mean you can drive the SR5 and TE in 4WD on dry pavement because it's an open center differential?

What's the difference between the Auto Disconnecting center differential and the Torsen center differential? Does the Auto Disconnecting have only two modes (locked and unlocked), while the Torsen has variable biasing between the front and rear differentials?

When I posted that the rep at the Texas State Fair told me that the SR5 and TE had the Torsen center diff there were some, ummm, strident responses that it did not. I got on live chat earlier with Toyota just for the heck of it. The rep took quite a while to research it, but bottom line is they say it does have a Torsen center diff on SR5 and TE models and that it can be used on all surfaces.

"...The 2010 4Runner has a torsen center differential and which can be use on all surface."

"Per your inquiry on the transfer case which incorporates the torsen center diff will be utilized on both the SR5 and the Trail 4WD, in all modes, whether on improved highways or low speed crawling through mud, rocks and sand."

You can get to the live chat when you're building a 4Runner online. I encourage folks to see what answer they receive. This is the 2nd time I've asked someone from Toyota about this and they seem to be consistent with their answer. Whether or not they're correct remains to be seen.

 

[sandcrawler]

Toyota live-chat informed me: "I apologize, the Limited is now the only model equipped with the Full-time 4WD with Active Traction Control (A-TRAC) and locking center differential."

i suppose it could be argued that it was a semantic mistake re: full-time 4WD...

 

[dxntxn]

Toyota live-chat informed me: "I apologize, the Limited is now the only model equipped with the Full-time 4WD with Active Traction Control (A-TRAC) and locking center differential."

i suppose it could be argued that it was a semantic mistake re: full-time 4WD...

Yeah, the Limited is the only one w/ full-time 4wd.

 

[sven]

The automatic disconnecting differential (ADD) is on the front axle, not the T-case. My Tacoma with part time 4wd had an ADD as does my current part time 4runner. I believe the 4th gens have an ADD that is activated when the dial is switched from 4wd to 2wd.

The ADD takes the place of the old-fashioned locking hubs.

I've never heard of an "automatic locking center differential" on a transfer case. Do they even make those? On the 3rd and 4th gen 4runners that had the center diff, you had to manually lock the T-case, it was not automatic.

I understand what you're saying. By Automatic Disconnecting Differential System, Toyota means not having to put the truck in reverse and drive backwards four feet to unlock the hubs when switching from 4WD to 2WD. What threw my off was that the PDF also said there was a locking center differential on all 4WD 2010 4Runners. The part-time 4WD system on the 2010 SR5 and TE wouldn't have a center differential, only a transfer case.

It's not an "automatic locking center differential," but a "Automatic Disconnecting Differential System." So it only disconnects/unlocks automatically, but you have to connect/lock it manually.

Like I said at the start of this thread, I'm confused, very confused.

 

[PredBlue]

"All 2010 4Runners will have the Torsen Limited-Slip Center Differential" is the answer I got.

I asked for clarification and they responded that "there have been numerous questions about this and someone would have to do additional research to answer your specific question" (yeah, by numerous they mean everybody on this forum :redbrick and to call the 800-331-4331 number to discuss.

EDIT: So I called, and of course the guy I talked to confirmed what we already knew--Toyota Moving Backwards. I told him what the Livechat person had told me, and he said that he would be sure to mention to his supervisor that they are giving conflicting info about "all models having the Tor. cent. diff".

I expressed my disappointment that the SR5 and TE were no longer options with only the part time 4WD and that the Ltd. was out of my price range with leather seats that I wouldn't take if they were free (personal preference). As a result, they have lost a potential purchase with the current driveline setup.

The only bright side, and the reason I'm adding this, is when I said I guess I would have to wait until a mid-model refresh in 2-3 years when maybe this was addressed, he said "hopefully sooner". I asked "really?". He said that "of course I don't make that decision, but we have heard several comments from current 4Runner owners that the 2010 is less capable and flexible in terms of the drive train setup than what they currently have. If people are saying my old 4Runner is better than the new one and hurting sales,, that's not good" I asked "so you've heard similar comments?" and he said "oh yeah".

I'm not saying he said something was for sure going to be done and I know he's trying not to lose me as a customer. I'm only saying that at least enough people are calling/emailing that it at least is making a blip. I would normally call BS on the guy, but as soon as I asked for a clarification of the 4WD system, he had an immediate response even before I asked the full question. That tells me he has legitimately had this exact same question a few times before as they normally have to type in the question and look up a response.

I'm totally not a "call, you can make a difference!!" guy, but it DOES seem like they've been hearing it about the 4WD.

 

[JB.]

What threw my off was that the PDF also said there was a locking center differential on all 4WD 2010 4Runners. The part-time 4WD system on the 2010 SR5 and TE wouldn't have a center differential, only a transfer case.

There's a line that reads "locking differential" that lists all the models in the 4Runner box. That must be the rear locker.

The description line that reads "Torsen limited slip differential (center/rear)" has in the 4Runner box, "S (4X4 Ctr, LTD)"

It's a goofy way to list the description since none of the vehicles have a rear Torsen. Not an easy PDF to decipher.

 

[LyteFly]

This would be a great place for one of those "popcorn" smilies :biggrin2:

:snacker::snacker::snacker:

Ahhhhh, the snacker!

 

[sandcrawler]

The only bright side, and the reason I'm adding this, is when I said I guess I would have to wait until a mid-model refresh in 2-3 years when maybe this was addressed, he said "hopefully sooner". I asked "really?". He said that "of course I don't make that decision, but we have heard several comments from current 4Runner owners that the 2010 is less capable and flexible in terms of the drive train setup than what they currently have. If people are saying my old 4Runner is better than the new one and hurting sales,, that's not good" I asked "so you've heard similar comments?" and he said "oh yeah".

I'm totally not a "call, you can make a difference!!" guy, but it DOES seem like they've been hearing it about the 4WD.

well, that's at least a bit of a bright spot. i've live-chatted and emailed Toyota already about this issue. and the editor at Edmunds seemed to think a letter-writing campaign was a good idea.

keep it up, folks. no one has anything to lose by sending an email/making a call. and, potentially, we all have something to gain.

 

[sven]

There's a line that reads "locking differential" that lists all the models in the 4Runner box. That must be the rear locker.

The description line that reads "Torsen limited slip differential (center/rear)" has in the 4Runner box, "S (4X4 Ctr, LTD)"

It's a goofy way to list the description since none of the vehicles have a rear Torsen. Not an easy PDF to decipher.

No, that's incorrect. I think you read the wrong line/box. The line that reads "Locking Differential" lists the following in the 4Runner column: S(4x4 Ctr)(Rr Trail). This means that on 2010 4Runners with 4WD a center locking differential is standard on all three trim levels, and a rear locking differential is standard on the Trail Edition only.

But on further review, I noticed this PDF is filled with typos and inaccuracies. It says the four-cylinder 4Runner is available with part-time 4WD, which is absolutely wrong (2WD only). It also says the manual transmission FJ Cruiser with full-time 4WD has no Torsen limited slip center differential, which is absolutely wrong. We should disregard all the info in this PDF. It's garbage.

I'm with PredBlue. I'm going to call Toyota and complain about them getting rid of the Torsen LS center differential in the new 4Runner. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

 

[JB.]

No, that's incorrect. I think you read the wrong line/box. The line that reads "Locking Differential" lists the following in the 4Runner column: S(4x4 Ctr)(Rr Trail). This means that on 2010 4Runners with 4WD a center locking differential is standard on all three trim levels, and a rear locking differential is standard on the Trail Edition only.

But on further review, I noticed this PDF is filled with typos and inaccuracies. It says the four-cylinder 4Runner is available with part-time 4WD, which is absolutely wrong (2WD only). It also says the manual transmission FJ Cruiser with full-time 4WD has no Torsen limited slip center differential, which is absolutely wrong. We should disregard all the info in this PDF. It's garbage.

I'm with PredBlue. I'm going to call Toyota and complain about them getting rid of the Torsen LS center differential in the new 4Runner. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

Doh!

You're right. My apologies for the unnecessary clutter. :redbrick: