What the hell just happened???

[T4R2014]

But if you are having blow by, I would guess either valve stem seals or sticking rings. My brother has had great success with freeing the later on some engines by dumping a little Marvel Mystery Oil in the crankcase a couple of hundred miles before an oil change was due.

Works well down the spark plug tubes as well. Revived a Ramcharger with flintstone floors that way once.

 

[thegipper]

Just thought I'd give a little update.

I had no issues driving up Thursday night when it was -8F (actual temp). I brought up some extra oil just in case I had any problems.

I had my buddy who lives up there stop at the cabin and turn the heat on. He parked on the road and walked up the driveway because it wasn't plowed. There was about a 4 foot snow mountain from the county plow blocking the driveway. He drives a 2010ish Wrangler Sahara and was convinced he was going to get stuck so he didn't try it.

I on the other hand, knew my 4R would make it just fine so I hit it. She laughed all over that snow mound and took me right up the driveway. We had about 15" of snow on the ground and there is a decent hill up the driveway. Once I made a path, he followed in his Jeep. I absolutely love these Falken Wildpeak AT3W tires. They are exceptionally awesome in snow (on and off road). We took a couple drives on some of our hunting trails with my truck and had zero issues. Some of the snow drifts were easily 3 feet deep.

The ice fishing trip was good but we didn't catch much (gills and crappie we ate on Friday). We mostly ate food, drank, guns, split wood and relaxed next to the wood stove. I bought a new Fiskars chopping axe when I was up there and I love it so much, it will be getting mounted in my 4R soon.

New PCV is here but still waiting on the grommet. I shook the new one and it definitely sounds smoother and shakes much easier than the bad one.

Looks like that is all it was!

Thanks again fellas

 

[thegipper]

Well guys, she puked oil out of the spark plug tube seals again today when I was leaving work. It's about 12 degrees today so it's cold, but not crazy cold like it was the first time.

PCV and grommet are brand new.

I'm not sure what the hell is going on or what else to check.

If I'm getting moisture in the vacuum lines, I don't know how to prevent that. Last time it happened, I pulled a few off and they all looked fine with no ice build up.

Anyone got any ideas?

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[thegipper]

Well, I may have the worst luck of any 3rd Gen owner.

I checked my oil level and there was some milkyness on the dipstick (streaks high up on the stick).

I then took the oil fill cap off and the underside also had some milkyness on it.

Coolant level in reservoir appears to be almost exactly where it should be.

Could I seriously be so GD unlucky to blow ANOTHER head gasket on my new/used engine within a few thousand miles of swapping it in?

Sounds like I need to do a leak down test. If I am getting coolant in my oil, how would a leak down test confirn/deny that?

When I did a leak down test on my original engine, I had bubbles coming out of the radiator. Would the same apply here?

No white smoke and no rough idle at all on cold start up. No CEL either.

Say it ain't so!

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[Kanoe]

What brand of Spark plug seals do you have in there and how old are they?

I put a certain brand of blue ones in my corolla last winter and shortly pulled them out to put in OEM. The blue ones leaked, not sure if cold was the factor, just pitched them but you can be sure we had cold here.

Do you know about the cold weather rad leak that these toyota plastic cap radiators have? In very cold, say -30 to -40 the rad seals will leak upon starting the car as soon as a little pressure biuids in the system. As soon as the rad warms up a bit the leaks stop. Very common. Maybe you have something similar with the tube seals, a cold weather start up leak until they become pliable again.

 

[Kanoe]

Whoa, slow down with the blown head gasket.

Oil on the dipstick and cap is another cold weather symptom. Drive a lot of short trips? It never gets warm enough to evaporate all that moisture away. Again, very common especially with short trip drivers. That is why the owners manual calls any commuting under like 10 miles to be "severe service".

On a related note, I bet that is what is freezing up your PCV!

 

[thegipper]

Whoa, slow down with the blown head gasket.

Oil on the dipstick and cap is another cold weather symptom. Drive a lot of short trips? It never gets warm enough to evaporate all that moisture away. Again, very common especially with short trip drivers. That is why the owners manual calls any commuting under like 10 miles to be "severe service".

On a related note, I bet that is what is freezing up your PCV!

Essentially all I do is short trips with it except for the occasional trips up north to hunt/fish every couple months (2 hour drive).

My work is only about 8 miles away and that is where I drive it to mostly. I do let it warm up for about 5 minutes before I leave in the morning. I also drive it around town to run to the store but again, that is even shorter trips than going to work.

God I hope you are right. I am not having any other signs of a blown head gasket, but this has got me all worked up now. I seriously have absolutely terrible luck.

If this moisture in the oil is causing the PCV to freeze up, is there anything else I can do to fix it other than driving it on much longer trips?

 

[thegipper]

What brand of Spark plug seals do you have in there and how old are they?

I put a certain brand of blue ones in my corolla last winter and shortly pulled them out to put in OEM. The blue ones leaked, not sure if cold was the factor, just pitched them but you can be sure we had cold here.

Do you know about the cold weather rad leak that these toyota plastic cap radiators have? In very cold, say -30 to -40 the rad seals will leak upon starting the car as soon as a little pressure biuids in the system. As soon as the rad warms up a bit the leaks stop. Very common. Maybe you have something similar with the tube seals, a cold weather start up leak until they become pliable again.

I'll have to check my records but I believe all of the VC seals are OEM. The engine is from another member on here and I believe he had them done at a Yota dealership about 6 years ago. There is no oil leaking anywhere else involving the VC's, not even a drop. I don't think its the seals, there is some kind of pressure building up in the crank case.

Either its from a blown head gasket or it's from moisture freezing up like you said. Hopefully its just the latter.

I got family coming in from out of town tomorrow so I won't be able to doing any investigating until the following weekend.

Also, maybe I need to do some more research on these catch cans if that would help my situation.

 

[catrains]

so what is the coolant antifreeze temp at ?

I use 65% ANTIFREEZE and 35% distilled water . so when cold below temps hit too much antifreeze like 90-100% will cause the antifreeze to get frozen .. and if its at zero F then than can also cause a gasket to leak into the oil .

moisture under the oil fill cap is normal in winter temps. since you have sludge that says to me conventional oil used .. if the color of the sludge is the color of the antifreeze you used sure can be a head gasket .

extreme temps over time and doing many short runs the head gasket will wear out then leak .

do the pressure test on radiator and see if air comes out the oil fill tube ..block off the PCV hole and crankcase air vent ..

 

[Kanoe]

If this moisture in the oil is causing the PCV to freeze up, is there anything else I can do to fix it other than driving it on much longer trips?

I have a friend who drives a brand new car. She drives 3 miles down the hill to work and then 3 miles up the hill back home. Her oil cap looks like whipped cream. The dealer just does an oil change and tells her to drive it more. It just happens. Our winter temps sit between -10c and -40c most of the time.

You need to winter proof your truck. A block heater to pre-warm the engine helps get it warm fast.

A winter front to block some of the cold air blowing on the rad will allow it to reach operating temps faster on short trips. People use cardboard, foam rubber, old towels, canvas and of course you can just buy one. One note is that you have to remove it in the spring so you don't overheat.

And lastly you need to drive some distance more often. I can warm my 4runner up for 10 minutes, drive 12 miles to work and it is just up to operating temp when I get there. That's why I drive the corolla in the winter.

 

[thegipper]

so what is the coolant antifreeze temp at ?

I use 65% ANTIFREEZE and 35% distilled water . so when cold below temps hit too much antifreeze like 90-100% will cause the antifreeze to get frozen .. and if its at zero F then than can also cause a gasket to leak into the oil .

moisture under the oil fill cap is normal in winter temps. since you have sludge that says to me conventional oil used .. if the color of the sludge is the color of the antifreeze you used sure can be a head gasket .

extreme temps over time and doing many short runs the head gasket will wear out then leak .

do the pressure test on radiator and see if air comes out the oil fill tube ..block off the PCV hole and crankcase air vent ..

My coolant temps are about 130 after warming up in my driveway for 5ish minutes depending on how cold it is outside. My truck warms up very quick once I leave and usually hovers around 190 like it should (monitored via ultragauge). I would say it is at operating temperature for the last 3-5 minutes in that 13ish minute drive to work.

Sludge was tan in color and there wasn't a "ton" of it, but more than I've seen before. I'm thinking I'll do an oil change if I can this weekend, it was probably last done in late summer of 2018 and maybe has 1500 miles on it .

I think I'll send an oil sample to blackstone labs just to be sure.

 

[thegipper]

I have a friend who drives a brand new car. She drives 3 miles down the hill to work and then 3 miles up the hill back home. Her oil cap looks like whipped cream. The dealer just does an oil change and tells her to drive it more. It just happens. Our winter temps sit between -10c and -40c most of the time.

You need to winter proof your truck. A block heater to pre-warm the engine helps get it warm fast.

A winter front to block some of the cold air blowing on the rad will allow it to reach operating temps faster on short trips. People use cardboard, foam rubber, old towels, canvas and of course you can just buy one. One note is that you have to remove it in the spring so you don't overheat.

And lastly you need to drive some distance more often. I can warm my 4runner up for 10 minutes, drive 12 miles to work and it is just up to operating temp when I get there. That's why I drive the corolla in the winter.

Yeah my 4R only see's freeway driving maybe once a month. It's all back country roads to work (45-55 mph) with some minor "city" driving in that 8 mile trip.

God I hope you guys are right. Never had this happen before with any of my vehicles. My Camry does a lot of short trips to work also but it does get driven about 30 miles twice a week when I have to pick up my kids from the in laws.

 

[Kanoe]

Here's my pretty winter front. With the weather we have been having the last couple of weeks, it really helps. Makes a big difference in cabin heat and by extension engine temps. Been -30 F some mornings. No 4runner pic. She's hibernating.

Just a thought. I rarely start up in the cold weather without plugging in. My engine (and PCV) is above freezing before I turn the key. Do you have a block heater installed?

 

[thegipper]

I don't have a block heater but I'll definitely consider adding one this spring.

 

[thegipper]

Update:

So last weekend I was able to change the oil. It looked like oil, nothing more nothing less. I didn't see anything alarming. I drove it for a good 15 minutes before changing the oil.

I drove it to work on Monday and when I got home, I checked under my oil fill cap and sure enough, there was white milky stuff under the cap, maybe .5mm thick.

So my assumption that changing the oil would remove this moisture was wrong. I guess that makes sense since the moisture/water will not be in the oil itself but in the crankcase.

Today, I decided to take my 4R to work. It's 3 degrees this morning and about 5 minutes into my drive, I smell burning oil....again. I get to work and sure enough, oil puked out of the spark plug tube seals again.

My plan was to take it for a long 1+ hour drive today on the freeway after work so I can finally try to burn off this excess moisture. I still plan on doing that, it's just going to be a little stinky for awhile.

Other thoughts:

I've driven this truck in Wisconsin here for 3 winters now, this is the first time it's ever done this. It has always been used on "short trips" with the occasional long trips up north to hunt/fish.

I'm thinking I should try a catch can next. I also plan on taking it on an extended drive (1 hour plus) at least once every couple weeks.

Does anyone have a link to a catch can on Amazon they would recommend?

Still no signs of a bad head gasket. It runs great, no CEL, no misfires, no known coolant loss, no excessive white smoke on cold start up.

What has me puzzled is why is this all of sudden happening now? Has the weather this winter been particularly "moist" or something? It has been an insane winter this year with massive swings in temperature. We had essentially zero snow all January then all of a sudden we had the polar vortex followed by one snow storm after another. Like I said, this truck has been driven the same way every winter yet now all of a sudden this moisture in the crankcase is becoming an issue.

The search continues....

 

[jgue467]

I almost want to add the block heater for you.....can't wait... :cowboy:

 

[thegipper]

I almost want to add the block heater for you.....can't wait... :cowboy:

That's on the list too but that doesn't explain why it's been fine for the last several years and all of a sudden now, it's having these moisture issues.

 

[Mudeprived]

Update:

So last weekend I was able to change the oil. It looked like oil, nothing more nothing less. I didn't see anything alarming. I drove it for a good 15 minutes before changing the oil.

I drove it to work on Monday and when I got home, I checked under my oil fill cap and sure enough, there was white milky stuff under the cap, maybe .5mm thick.

So my assumption that changing the oil would remove this moisture was wrong. I guess that makes sense since the moisture/water will not be in the oil itself but in the crankcase.

Today, I decided to take my 4R to work. It's 3 degrees this morning and about 5 minutes into my drive, I smell burning oil....again. I get to work and sure enough, oil puked out of the spark plug tube seals again.

My plan was to take it for a long 1+ hour drive today on the freeway after work so I can finally try to burn off this excess moisture. I still plan on doing that, it's just going to be a little stinky for awhile.

Other thoughts:

I've driven this truck in Wisconsin here for 3 winters now, this is the first time it's ever done this. It has always been used on "short trips" with the occasional long trips up north to hunt/fish.

I'm thinking I should try a catch can next. I also plan on taking it on an extended drive (1 hour plus) at least once every couple weeks.

Does anyone have a link to a catch can on Amazon they would recommend?

Still no signs of a bad head gasket. It runs great, no CEL, no misfires, no known coolant loss, no excessive white smoke on cold start up.

What has me puzzled is why is this all of sudden happening now? Has the weather this winter been particularly "moist" or something? It has been an insane winter this year with massive swings in temperature. We had essentially zero snow all January then all of a sudden we had the polar vortex followed by one snow storm after another. Like I said, this truck has been driven the same way every winter yet now all of a sudden this moisture in the crankcase is becoming an issue.

The search continues....

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B072KD96WK?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_pd_title

Just got that a few weeks ago. Nicely made and comes with two different size fittings. The hose is junk though so plan on going to your parts store for vacuum hose.