3VZE Mystery Rotational Noise

[brettniles]

Hey all. Disclaimer: I'm about to dump a whole pile of information on you guys, so feel free to respond to any part of it with your two cents. I'm fairly new to this 4Runner building, I'm not a mechanic by trade, but I've done my research and I'm not mechanically retarded. ANY help here is appreciated.

Started a while ago with some slightly excessive belt noise, as well as belt related whirring when throttle was applied. Some clicking, not even quite a chirp, but just louder than it should have been. Then started picking up a rotational sound that got worse over time. At first only when cold and eventually constant. Sounds almost like a washing machine spin cycle thats out of balance. No loss of power at all. Logically, everything I know says belts/pulleys. But no glaring misalignments.

1. Replaced belts that felt kind of loose. Installed/tightened the new ones. This revealed a shitty fan clutch bearing.

2. Replaced fan clutch bearing. This fixed the clicking, but still rotational sound and belt whir.

3. Fixed a previously discovered issue where the harmonic balancer/crank pulley were set out forward further than they should be by about 1/8", due to not being seated properly in key way. (My wording may be off, I only partially understand what it looks like internally.) I'd say this is likely the cause of the whirring. Rotational sound still present.

4. Tore down all the way to the timing belt to find a bad idler pulley. Replaced. Put back together. Rotational sound just as bad. New sound: valve-like clicking that used to occur only when gassing in 5th gear while driving too slow for it now present during all throttling.

5. Tore down to timing belt again. Cannot find rotational sound when running at this point. All the other belts are off though so motor is partially "unloaded."

At this point my mechanic believes the problem is inside one of the heads. I'd agree on the valve sound, but not sure of the rotational sound. At this point we are looking at taking it all down and rebuilding the heads, or dropping in a reman motor. I had considered a 3.4 swap, but the cost is about twice as much, and I'm already pretty deep into this 3.0. I've already replaced a lot of stuff strapped to the motor, so I feel like it would be a shame to lose all those new parts and pay more to put a 3.4 in.

I'm gonna throw out the cheaper price breakdown I've been given, and you guys let me know what you think about it. Again, advice on any part of this is appreciated.

Reman engine: 2 year unlimited warranty $1865
Spark Plugs $21.54
Air Filter $16.59
Fuel Filter $28.49
Distributor Cap $23.62
Distributor Rotor Button $10.17
PCV Valve $4.71
Oil $15
Misc Shop Supplies $32.79
Labor, 16.9hrs @$75/hr $1267.50
Core $290

Total: $3579.91

 

[Bad_Vision]

For that you could buy a 3.4l.
Did you replace the timing belt?

 

[flyinhawaiian01]

One more of my shot in the dark theories, as I'm not quite sure of the sound exactly, but if you both agree its coming from the heads, and possibly just one head maybe, could it be a galled camshaft?

I also recall reading something about the camshaft thrust clearance when the cap wasn't taken apart correctly, causing the end of the cam to gall or seize up or something, but I have no clue where I saw that at.

That's a good chunk of money to rebuild it, and as badvision said, you could probably get a 3.4l engine for less, although you'll be a bit more than that in the end to do a swap with extra parts and labor.

Check with the guys here who have already done this swap, they will give you more insight on what they spent to do the whole thing and just how much work it was to complete.

Of course, if you plan on having someone else do all the work, you will be spending a LOT more money on this than just rebuilding the 3vze! I only recommend doing a swap if you either have lots of money or you are capable of doing it yourself! Been there, done that, hate to think about the next one coming up for my supra!

 

[brettniles]

One more of my shot in the dark theories, as I'm not quite sure of the sound exactly, but if you both agree its coming from the heads, and possibly just one head maybe, could it be a galled camshaft?

I also recall reading something about the camshaft thrust clearance when the cap wasn't taken apart correctly, causing the end of the cam to gall or seize up or something, but I have no clue where I saw that at.

That's a good chunk of money to rebuild it, and as badvision said, you could probably get a 3.4l engine for less, although you'll be a bit more than that in the end to do a swap with extra parts and labor.

Check with the guys here who have already done this swap, they will give you more insight on what they spent to do the whole thing and just how much work it was to complete.

Of course, if you plan on having someone else do all the work, you will be spending a LOT more money on this than just rebuilding the 3vze! I only recommend doing a swap if you either have lots of money or you are capable of doing it yourself! Been there, done that, hate to think about the next one coming up for my supra!

That's just it. I'm not entirely convinced its in the head. The sound can't be heard running it with it stripped down to the timing belt (which has been replaced, btw.) My main issue with the 3.4 swap is the cost. I could buy a plug and play swap kit with the few fabricated necessities for not much more than that, but I would also need donor parts from the 3.4 truck, many of which I have replaced in the past three years on the 3.0. And labor would be a lot because I don't have the means to do this mostly myself. Otherwise, I'd be all up in it.

 

[flyinhawaiian01]

I totally understand that! Doing a swap isn't super-hard, and with the amount of the 3.4 swaps out there, there wouldn't be any guesswork, but it is expensive and to keep the costs down to a sane level, you would have to do most of it yourself.

I've done a few in my past, one that never did get finished (my '80 truck with a 350 swap), and my supra with a japanese motor, which was a LOT of guesswork and custom one-off parts, and now I've decided to do a 1UZ swap to replace that motor. Its not for someone who needs their rig driveable quickly, and its hard to justify a several grand motor swap on a vehicle that may not be worth the expense.

I wish ya luck though, with whatever route you go. And if you do go for the 3.4 swap, this community, as well as a few other forums online, has more than enough folks around to help with the technical stuff when you get stuck!

 

[Scalded_Dawg]

So you had all the accesories stripped off, ran it and it made no rotational sound or it still did?
If it still did, how is the harmonic balancer's condition? You described the noise as a washing machine out of balance... See where I'm going here.
Let me check my parts stash, May have an extra.

 

[Scalded_Dawg]

And check you're PMs...

 

[Scalded_Dawg]

Another thought, now I've re-read your posts... No noise with no belts hooked up to the crank. Possible thrust bearing failure on the crank.

 

[Scalded_Dawg]

I got a spare

Need a little clean up with a wire brush and some steel wool but otherwise great condition.
Give me a ring if you want it... Free .99!

 

[brettniles]

And check you're PMs...

Thanks dude! Just gave you a call.

 

[brettniles]

Took it to another place. Turned out to be the A/C compressor. Which I feel like my mechanic should have been able to figure out. But thats another subject. ANYWAY.

Shopping around Rock Auto. Opinions about buying all the OEM Denso parts over a kit by a company called GPD? The price difference is about $80. Is it worth the extra $$$?