4Runner alternator upgrade (gen 5)

[Diver Deuce]

How's the High Output Alternator holding up?

 

[rigtec]

How's the High Output Alternator holding up?

Hi Lou,

I'm happy to report (knock-on-wood) that the system is operating 'Better than expected' but "exactly as it should"! This is the very first time since having the truck that I felt that I've met my electrical system goal; which is to know that whatever I'm doing e.g., running ALL available accessories... all external lighting (stock and aftermarket), w/ F & R wipers going, low temp hvac (High static blower), and running the subwoofer system (110 amps avg) @135 dB, the electrical system would be capable of producing 190A/14V at curb-side idle, "While still charging the battery"...I've watched it do that: 200A at Idle? "NO SWEAT!"
DC Power Engineering 270-XP 200A Idle test Or...270XP Alternator vs 1100F Heatgun

It demonstrates a 'Very quick recovery', it's a great alternator, Best to you!

 

[rigtec]

Oh forgot to mention...

In the first video link above, if you look at the upper left hand corner of the 'Computerized Alt output machine', in the digital 'Speed' display, the RPM read-out figure represents the 'Alternator (rotor drive)' RPM (NOT the engine); which has about a 3:1 ratio (turns three ^x to one engine revolution). So when your engine is idling at 700 RPM, the alternator's pulley will turn at about 2100 RPM https://www.dcpowerinc.com/8237-270-xp.html#tab-alternator_performance_sheet and... https://www.dcpowerinc.com/articles/truth-about-idle

Cheers!

 

[noahzr]

DC Power engineering

I went to the DC Power engineering website and in the drop down list for make and model vehicle it only goes up to 2009 4runner. Which one did you get?

 

[adam.friedman.33]

I looked on their site as well as a few others and saw the same.

 

[rigtec]

I went to the DC Power engineering website and in the drop down list for make and model vehicle it only goes up to 2009 4runner. Which one did you get?

Hi noahzr,

You're right! I spoke to the people over at DC Power Engr. and told them about the fitment catalog and they explained that their product menu needs an update! Call them over the phone and order that way; they have your alternator: Toll Free: 1-888-441-0144 | Phone: 1-951-509-5617 They're 'MADE TO ORDER' so could take a few weeks to arrive at your address. NOTE: I had absolutely no trouble with my alternator fitting or charging! https://www.dcpowerinc.com/high-output-alternators.html?make=Toyota&model=4Runner

Cheers!

 

[noahzr]

Sweet

Thanks rigtec, I have been wanting to do this upgrade for awhile now but I wanted confirmation that it was worth it before I dropped that much cash and time into a new alt. I did the big 3 upgrade back when I installed my system and now that I've installed a viper remote start I have a few more options that I could add to it's functionality via relays. Plus I would like to upgrade the sub amp but I don't want to stress the stock alt too much and adding more caps or a 2nd battery wouldn't give me the peace of mind a high output alt would.

 

[rigtec]

"Thanks rigtec, I have been wanting to do this upgrade for awhile now but I wanted confirmation that it was worth it before I dropped that much cash and time into a new alt..."

Hi noahzr,

You are a 'Wise man' for taking your time and researching the process before throwing down a 'grip'! I too checked it out first; mainly because I didn't like the way the stock alternator replacement job looked even before loosening one bolt. Like many others here, I must depend on Good weather, and sunlight to work on the truck, so if I start a job it has to be finished 'BEFORE' sundown lol!

Lucky for me it snowed just before I could get to it; I had been waiting for a warmer day (40 deg or above) but instead it snowed! So I took it to my mechanic and he did it... he ended-up cussin' me out though; claims I ambushed him with this job... "my reply", :noidea: who me? hahaha! It took him about two hrs to get it done, I think the book gives you 1.5 hrs for this job! ...worked out good!

Cheers

 

[Dalko43]

I'm extremely ignorant when it comes to all things electrical.

Is the OP's alternator upgrade an alternative to doing a battery upgrade (bigger battery or dual battery setup)? Or is that a whole separate issue all together?

Also, I have noticed that my airflow (from A/C and heater) increases and decreases with my speed. I also always hear a whine from the engine compartment when I rev up the engine (always thought that was the intake). Is that possibly indicative of an issue with my power supply?

I normally don't run much if any electrical devices plugged in while driving. At most, I'll have an iphone with nav and streaming music and a GPS locator plugged in.

 

[rigtec]

I'm extremely ignorant when it comes to all things electrical.

Is the OP's alternator upgrade an alternative to doing a battery upgrade (bigger battery or dual battery setup)? Or is that a whole separate issue all together?

Hi Dalko,

Yes, my alternator IS an alternative to a 'Dual battery set-up'! With a dual battery set-up, one battery will provide the operator, 'Stored' electrical power for things like running lights for camping, watching tv, and running a small refrigerator', even when the truck is shut-down for the night. While the other battery is for normal starting and operation of the vehicle; these batteries can also be used together (tandem) for high current loads if need be! But a H.O. alternator is for running accessories while operating the vehicle e.g., running a winch, high-output over-head and tail-gate lighting systems, big horsepower on-board audio equipment...etc!

Also, I have noticed that my airflow (from A/C and heater) increases and decreases with my speed.

I don't know what truck you have, but it sounds like you have your 'OUTDOOR AIR DAMPER' open while cruising! This O.A. damper is for bringing 'Fresh-air' into the cabin whenever humidity/temperature are at acceptable levels, and will tend to increase the air velocity as it makes it's way through the hvac ducts and diffusers when left open. There's a Recirculate button that can 'defeat' this feature if desired.

I also always hear a whine from the engine compartment when I rev up the engine (always thought that was the intake). Is that possibly indicative of an issue with my power supply?

I don't think it's an indication of "An Issue"; although the alternator does tend to whine some when loading up (this is normal)... the power steering pump can whine too when running low on PS Fluid so you may want to check that!

I normally don't run much if any electrical devices plugged in while driving. At most, I'll have an iphone with nav and streaming music and a GPS locator plugged in.

Your 5'th generation 4Runner's electrical plant is quite capable of handling every accessory that you can throw at it, even when they're used all together! And with 130A available from the stock alternator, you shouldn't need to worry about coming up short where system charging is concerned. Toyota engineers have done an excellent job calculating just what accessories could be safely used 'simultaneously' when designing the power grid!

'Best to you'!

 

[Dalko43]

Hi Dalko,

Yes, my alternator IS an alternative to a 'Dual battery set-up'! With a dual battery set-up, one battery will provide the operator, 'Stored' electrical power for things like running lights for camping, watching tv, and running a small refrigerator', even when the truck is shut-down for the night. While the other battery is for normal starting and operation of the vehicle; these batteries can also be used together (tandem) for high current loads if need be! But a H.O. alternator is for running accessories while operating the vehicle e.g., running a winch, high-output over-head and tail-gate lighting systems, big horsepower on-board audio equipment...etc!



I don't know what truck you have, but it sounds like you have your 'OUTDOOR AIR DAMPER' open while cruising! This O.A. damper is for bringing 'Fresh-air' into the cabin whenever humidity/temperature are at acceptable levels, and will tend to increase the air velocity as it makes it's way through the hvac ducts and diffusers when left open. There's a Recirculate button that can 'defeat' this feature if desired.



I don't think it's an indication of "An Issue"; although the alternator does tend to whine some when loading up (this is normal)... the power steering pump can whine too when running low on PS Fluid so you may want to check that!



Your 5'th generation 4Runner's electrical plant is quite capable of handling every accessory that you can throw at it, even when they're used all together! And with 130A available from the stock alternator, you shouldn't need to worry about coming up short where system charging is concerned. Toyota engineers have done an excellent job calculating just what accessories could be safely used 'simultaneously' when designing the power grid!

'Best to you'!

Thanks for the feedback!

Yeah, I know about the recirculate air button. The only reason I asked about the power issue was because my air quality (hot/cold) and quantity seems to increase once I get the engine warmed up and up to speed, but Im guessing that's normal.

As for what you were saying about the stock alternator being sufficient for charging devices, in your opinion, what amount of mods/electronics do you think the stock power setup can handle before it starts to run into issues?

I don't envision upgrading the sound system or adding a fridge or anything. At most, I might have a 9.5k winch, maybe an extra lightbar, in addition to my nav and iphone devices. Do you think it would make sense to look at a different alternator for that kind of setup?

 

[rigtec]

Thanks for the feedback!

Yeah, I know about the recirculate air button. The only reason I asked about the power issue was because my air quality (hot/cold) and quantity seems to increase once I get the engine warmed up and up to speed, but Im guessing that's normal.

Some 4runner hvac systems have Automatic Temp Controls which prevent the blower and O.A. damper from operating before the engine reaches a predetermined temperature. If your hvac system incorporates A.T.C technology, then this is perfectly normal.

As for what you were saying about the stock alternator being sufficient for charging devices, in your opinion, what amount of mods/electronics do you think the stock power setup can handle before it starts to run into issues?

To use my own experience... I didn't have any issues with the electrical system when I installed the first 750w/55A subwoofer amplifier. It wasn't until I dropped in 'the second' 750 that I started noticing a lack of available current e.g., lighting system dimming, wipers AND hvac blower slowing down...etc. After that I ran a few tests to verify the trouble and that's what it was!

I don't envision upgrading the sound system or adding a fridge or anything. At most, I might have a 9.5k winch, maybe an extra lightbar, in addition to my nav and iphone devices. Do you think it would make sense to look at a different alternator for that kind of setup?

I'd say if you're planning to install an accessory that draws '50 amps Full load', or several accessories who's combined power consumption equals 50 amps or more then you've crossed that line and should consider an alternator, main power supply cables (BIG Three), and a large capacity battery upgrade; preferably an AGM battery for quick recovery!

Cheers!

 

[noahzr]

On the topic of dual batteries

I think I'm sold on the DC Power Engineering alternator (as soon as I get my tax return in a week or 2 :thumb3 but say later on I wanted to add a dual battery setup, hooked up in parallel would they need to be the same batteries, as far as ratings go?
:thanks:

 

[rigtec]

Originally Posted by Dalko43:

"...Is the OP's alternator upgrade an alternative to doing a battery upgrade (bigger battery or dual battery setup)? Or is that a whole separate issue all together?"

Originally Posted by rigtec

Hi Dalko,

Yes, my alternator IS an alternative to a 'Dual battery set-up'!

I thought I needed to visit upon my previous statement. My H.O. alternator 'IS NOT' an alternative to a Dual battery set-up. For that to be true, a high output alternator would have to be capable of doing the very same job as a dual battery set-up, but cannot!

Contra-wise, a dual battery set-up can't do what a H.O. alternator can do either because batteries don't generate current, but store it, and you'll still need a generator to keep them charged (at least) at the very same rate that you're discharging them or they will eventually discharge completely!

"Just for clarification!"

 

[rigtec]

I think I'm sold on the DC Power Engineering alternator (as soon as I get my tax return in a week or 2 :thumb3 but say later on I wanted to add a dual battery setup, hooked up in parallel would they need to be the same batteries, as far as ratings go?
:thanks:

I might opt to use the exact same batteries in my own truck if I were building a dual battery grid, but... as far as I know there is no law under which you are obligated to use identical batteries in this set-up. These batteries will be designated 'Two' completely different assignments, so you decide how to distribute the work load.

Cheers!

 

[noahzr]

Thanks!

I was thinking that if I fabricated a parallel dual battery "grid" without a battery isolator, just to double amp-hours then it would make sense to make sure that the batteries were at least the same rating so they would charge and discharge at the same rate. I think though, that if I do ever do that I will install an isolator and relay switch (still need to do a lot more homework on that subject).

I am one that will, if given the option, do research for weeks before I start on a project and like you I am limited to day light (i.e. days off work working 3rd shift) and good weather when it comes to work on my rig so I like to have all my ducks in a row, predict and preempt potential pitfalls and get'er done in one sweep. I also have to limit time, budget and cargo space with a wife and two growing boys.

I just wanted to say thanks again to you and others (you know who you are and how much you help) on this forum for taking the time to post what you have done and learned. I might have some learnin's of my own to share but I can't yet start threads and I refuse to go posting silly comments on pages that don't add anything to the forum but space in the database. I thought this comment was worth it's weight if you and other contributors see how much people appreciate what you do, even to the large percentage that never join and thus can't say thanks. Keep it up!

:clap2: :thanks: :nicethread:

 

[Randyman...]

Generally speaking, if you want to simply parallel 2 batteries and leave them paralleled 24/7, they should be identical and of same age/cycles to ensure one won't drain into the other when not being charged.

This is easily mitigated by using a PAC200 type relay that disconnects the two batteries from each other when the vehicle is turned off. When vehicle is on (or relay closed), you would sum the total reserve capacity of the two batteries since they are paralleled.

A batter isolator will give you two distinct banks/circuits (bank #1's reserve capacity has no effect on bank #2) - but both still charge from a common alternator (basically back-to-back diodes with the Alternator tap in the middle and a battery hanging off each diode). This can be a great idea for a fridge or what not as you can literally drain your "Aux" battery dead, but the Starting/Vehicle battery was completely isolated from the fridge's draw, and will crank your truck right up. The Alternator generally reads voltage from one of the two banks (generally your primary/starting battery) - and can sometimes cause issues getting the aux battery charged quickly if needed (or possibly overcharging your Starting Battery if reading voltage from your dead Aux battery).

You can get similar "dead battery" protection from just using a relay (and having the Fridge or whatever only connected to the 2nd "floating" battery). But again, when the relay is closed all circuits are basically in parallel - and I always prefer identical batteries in that scenario...

 

[rigtec]

!!!!

Originally posted by noahzr

I thought this comment was worth it's weight if you and other contributors see how much people appreciate what you do, even to the large percentage that never join and thus can't say thanks. Keep it up!

:clap2: :thanks: :nicethread:

First let me just say that your 'expressed' appreciation above is the reason that I continue to share some of my observations and discoveries with this forum; so thanks so much for that!! It's always so good to know that someone here "gets it" and is finding some benefit in the subject(s) at hand, and the time it takes to post some of these threads 'with pictorial accompaniment'! Thanks again sincerely, Greg!

"...I was thinking that if I fabricated a parallel dual battery "grid" without a battery isolator, just to double amp-hours then it would make sense to make sure that the batteries were at least the same rating so they would charge and discharge at the same rate..."

In your above statement you did acknowledge one of the drawbacks of 'NOT' incorporating an isolation device in that circuit. One huge drawback would be if one of the batteries developed an 'Internal short' circuit between two of it's own (2 volt) cells.

The electrical drainage that takes place in a typical battery partition breach would then reach 'BOTH' batteries and create a need to test each one of them individually just to locate the one with the problem... to say nothing of the inconvenience of having two dead batteries to deal with instead of just one; so I'm glad you would include an ISO switch!

I am one that will, if given the option, do research for weeks before I start on a project..."

"That's the RIGHT WAY to do it!" It leaves you time to come up with better ways of getting it done, things you may never have thought of when yielding to impulsivity! :usa2: Cheers!

 

[noahzr]

Up to 5 weeks

Did it actually take that long to get your 270 XP?

 

[rigtec]

Did it actually take that long to get your 270 XP?

Hi noah,

Yes it did... remember they have a very high quality 'Build-to-order' objective (forge their own billet alum heat-sinks/cast end-frames...), and then took several more months to get it installed; as a result of the subsequent 'layering of snowfall!' "...But well worth the wait!"

Cheers