Thx ASR. I'm leaning towards going with the SAW rear coils w/1.5" and a Bilstein 6112/5160 setup, or a Fox 2.5/2.0 front/rear setup. Pulling the trigger on one or the other has been a painful process.
4th Gen Suspension Options/FAQ
- Thread starter ARK_SWAMP_RIDER
- Start date
Thx ASR. I'm leaning towards going with the SAW rear coils w/1.5" and a Bilstein 6112/5160 setup, or a Fox 2.5/2.0 front/rear setup. Pulling the trigger on one or the other has been a painful process.
ARK_SWAMP_RIDER
New member
Both are good setups from what I've read. I prefer fox personally just because they're easier to adjust and you're not stuck with the specific notches.
ASR, wondering if you can help. Icon extended travel for '05 Taco on a 4th Gen 4Runner?
Sku's are slightly different on Icon's website, but MetalTech and a few others use the same SKU's. (58635)
Post Lift Alignment/LCAs
Has anyone had any issues post lift with LCAs needing replacement?
After completing the work below, I'm noticing some alignment issues, especially in the front where the wheels are \ /. I'm not much of a mechanic, but my friend who did the work told me that the LCAs were maxed out on Camber, and I might consider replacing them to achieve proper alignment? I've seen a lot on replacing the UCAs with 3+ inch lifts, but I'm not seeing anyone else with this issue on the LCAs? Does this sound right?
I have a 2007 4wd sport and the Xreas was leaking, so replaced with 2008 FJ Springs, actually threw the FJ TRD Bilstein shocks on the 4runner since they were virtually new (and sold as a package with the springs), and also added a Cornfed 2/1 lift. I am in the process of adding Spidertrax, replacing stock rims with 17" Black TRD rims, and finally tires (not sure on size yet, prob 265/70/17 or 275/70/17). I'd like to dial in any alignment issues while I'm replacing tires etc. Thanks for any info!
Has anyone had any issues post lift with LCAs needing replacement?
After completing the work below, I'm noticing some alignment issues, especially in the front where the wheels are \ /. I'm not much of a mechanic, but my friend who did the work told me that the LCAs were maxed out on Camber, and I might consider replacing them to achieve proper alignment? I've seen a lot on replacing the UCAs with 3+ inch lifts, but I'm not seeing anyone else with this issue on the LCAs? Does this sound right?
I have a 2007 4wd sport and the Xreas was leaking, so replaced with 2008 FJ Springs, actually threw the FJ TRD Bilstein shocks on the 4runner since they were virtually new (and sold as a package with the springs), and also added a Cornfed 2/1 lift. I am in the process of adding Spidertrax, replacing stock rims with 17" Black TRD rims, and finally tires (not sure on size yet, prob 265/70/17 or 275/70/17). I'd like to dial in any alignment issues while I'm replacing tires etc. Thanks for any info!
ARK_SWAMP_RIDER
New member
Most likely the difference is valving. Tacoma shocks will bolt up on the front, so it should work, just may not be spot on with valving.
Sounds like you need UCAs, not LCAs. There aren't any aftermarket LCAs that offer additional adjustment. Many vendors offer UCAs that will accomplish this.
Thanks again ASR. I did a little more digging on this issue and made a few calls and here is what I have come up with on the Icons compatibility:
SKU#58630 - 2.5" Regular Travel
05-15 TACO
03-09 4runner
SKU#58635 - 2.5" Exetended Travel
05-15 TACO
03-09 4Runner
SKU#58640 - 2.5" Regular Travel
07-09 FJ
SKU#58645 - 2.5" Extended Travel
07-09 FJ
03-09 4Runner
So the only skew that isn't recommended to be used with the 4th Gen 4Runner is the 56840 Regular travel. When I asked for the reasoning on the 56840 not working I was met with: "It will more than likely bolt up but it is not an Icon recommended product for the 4th Gen 4runner." I thought I'd pass this along for all if it hasn't been posted before.
That all being said, I will be purchasing a used set of ICON extended travel to pair with the SAW rear coils and GX conversion kit.
LPilotSmith
New member
4th Gen Lift and Rubber
Thanks ASR for the great summary. New member dialing in for the first time.
I've had my 2005 4Runner Sport Edition since 2008 and and have been progressively growing tired of its profile concurrent with the progressive sagging of the front end. Anyone remember the Triumph TR7? Similar 'wedge' profile thing going on. It's 2WD, V6, white, been mostly garaged here in Florida, and just turned 48k on the odometer. Never seen snow, never been wrecked or abused, and hasn't even a single door ding. All that being said, I think it's worthy of some reinvestment in the form of suspension, wheels, and tires. All that and a little detailing effort and I think I could be happy with it for another 48k miles or another 8 - 10 yrs or so - whichever comes first!
After careful review and consideration, I've decided on the following: ICON Stage I lift (XREAS to be removed), 18 x 9 Black Rhino Sierra wheels, and 275/65 R 18 tires. I'm trying to decide between Toyo Open Country A/T II, Nitto Terra Grappler G2, or similar offerings from BFG, Hankook, Khumo, etc.. Appreciate any advice from members on the tires as I don't anticipate do much off-roading, so want a tire with fairly agressive looks, but good pavement manners. The Sierras have -12mm offset and 4.5" backspacing, which should be compatible with the ICON setup and eliminate the need for wheel spacers.
I think this would b a pretty killer setup and look forward to positng before and after pics once the projct gets started. Let me know what you think!
Thanks ASR for the great summary. New member dialing in for the first time.
I've had my 2005 4Runner Sport Edition since 2008 and and have been progressively growing tired of its profile concurrent with the progressive sagging of the front end. Anyone remember the Triumph TR7? Similar 'wedge' profile thing going on. It's 2WD, V6, white, been mostly garaged here in Florida, and just turned 48k on the odometer. Never seen snow, never been wrecked or abused, and hasn't even a single door ding. All that being said, I think it's worthy of some reinvestment in the form of suspension, wheels, and tires. All that and a little detailing effort and I think I could be happy with it for another 48k miles or another 8 - 10 yrs or so - whichever comes first!
After careful review and consideration, I've decided on the following: ICON Stage I lift (XREAS to be removed), 18 x 9 Black Rhino Sierra wheels, and 275/65 R 18 tires. I'm trying to decide between Toyo Open Country A/T II, Nitto Terra Grappler G2, or similar offerings from BFG, Hankook, Khumo, etc.. Appreciate any advice from members on the tires as I don't anticipate do much off-roading, so want a tire with fairly agressive looks, but good pavement manners. The Sierras have -12mm offset and 4.5" backspacing, which should be compatible with the ICON setup and eliminate the need for wheel spacers.
I think this would b a pretty killer setup and look forward to positng before and after pics once the projct gets started. Let me know what you think!
ARK_SWAMP_RIDER
New member
Sounds like you've done your homework! Are you planning on new UCAs? If you get standard travel Icons, you can get by without them. With extended travel, they are required.
As for tires, I think either the Toyos or Nittos are a good choice for what you describe. I run the Terra Grappler G2s on my 4runner, and put the Open Country AT2s on my dad's Tundra. Nitto and Toyo are owned by the same company, therefore the tires are very similar. I chose the G2s because they are lighter and also because I like the look better. However, they do have a small amount of road noise that I don't notice with the AT2s. The noise is only noticeable with the radio off, but it is there.
Another option to consider is the Cooper AT3. It has some great reviews as well.
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LPilotSmith
New member
Thanks for the insight! ICON standard travel coilovers. Was considering ICON tubular UCAs, but the dealer said they wouldn't necessary if I didn't need extended travel or if the lift in combination with the factory UCAs prevented getting front end alignment in spec. Also, don't have the $$$ to throw at that option if the benefits didn't justify the investment.
On the tire side of things, I think I'm leaning toward the TOYOs. Just getting around to researching whether P metric will do the job, or if LT would be the better choice from a cost/performance standpoint.
The Sierras are available in -12 and +12 offset in the 6 x 5.5 bolt patterns. Here I'm leaning toward -12 because I prefer the looks of a more deeply set wheel over one with pronounced positive offset. The -12 leaves 4.5" of backspacing which I believe is compatible with ICONs requirements. I'll keep you posted on how it goes! Thx again!
On the tire side of things, I think I'm leaning toward the TOYOs. Just getting around to researching whether P metric will do the job, or if LT would be the better choice from a cost/performance standpoint.
The Sierras are available in -12 and +12 offset in the 6 x 5.5 bolt patterns. Here I'm leaning toward -12 because I prefer the looks of a more deeply set wheel over one with pronounced positive offset. The -12 leaves 4.5" of backspacing which I believe is compatible with ICONs requirements. I'll keep you posted on how it goes! Thx again!
SkipRush71
New member
Since this is my first post please forgive me.
I have been lurking and reading everything I can on the site so yes I have used the search function but it has only confused me a little more so I wanted to ask a simple question that probably has been asked.
I just got a 2004 and purchased the Toytec standard kit that says 3 inch and i also purchased the 1 inch body lift and the SPC upper control arms.
My confusion is what tire size will fit on my stock 17x7.5 wheels and do I or do I not need spidertax?
I would like to use the 255/75/17 or maybe the 285/70/17 tires and want to make sure I purchase spacers if I need them before I buy tires. I understand I may have to do the body chop and inner liner move if I use spacers but I wanted to know if the tires can be ran without spacers with no issues? Since I got the new UCA's I didnt know if that fixes the issues with bigger tires hitting them or not or if thats why i need spacers.
just trying to make sure I have all my stuff in advance so I dont hit any issues. Sorry if I left out any important details
I have been lurking and reading everything I can on the site so yes I have used the search function but it has only confused me a little more so I wanted to ask a simple question that probably has been asked.
I just got a 2004 and purchased the Toytec standard kit that says 3 inch and i also purchased the 1 inch body lift and the SPC upper control arms.
My confusion is what tire size will fit on my stock 17x7.5 wheels and do I or do I not need spidertax?
I would like to use the 255/75/17 or maybe the 285/70/17 tires and want to make sure I purchase spacers if I need them before I buy tires. I understand I may have to do the body chop and inner liner move if I use spacers but I wanted to know if the tires can be ran without spacers with no issues? Since I got the new UCA's I didnt know if that fixes the issues with bigger tires hitting them or not or if thats why i need spacers.
just trying to make sure I have all my stuff in advance so I dont hit any issues. Sorry if I left out any important details
LOBO79
New member
I just added the Toytec Ultimate lift to mine, and I am 275/70/18 and the only thing I had to do was remove the mud flaps and push in the inner fenders forward. I know there is quiet a few guys here running the 275/70/17 on there t4's and having very little rubbing. I would say if you run the 285's you might want spacers, but I am still learning also. Did you get the sway relocator for the front with your lift?
SkipRush71
New member
Yes i also got the Sway bar relocator. The whole tire and wheel thing really confuses me as I have never dealt with metric stuff. the offset thing and figuring out which wheel to get is why I think ill stick with my stock wheels for now. after going thru the 200 plus pages on the lift and tires my brain was so overloaded. im putting my lift on this weekend so I hope it looks as good as I am hoping.
BlueBalls
New member
quick front suspension question.. currently running 5100s and OME 884 in the front. Is it POSSIBLE (maybe not recommended but I want to know if it CAN be done) to add 1/2" top plate spacers and move the perch to 0.85" (first notch up from 0)? I also have the differential drop kit to go in. My thought is that this would net around 3.5" lift in the front, is that close? Also the 884s have around 40k on them so they are well broke in.
thanks
thanks
So after 3 months of research, scavenging for parts for the right price based upon what I wanted, I have finally installed the "new to me" suspension. It is quite the swap meet of parts, but the lift I wanted is there and the ride performance is maintained if not improved.
03' Limited V8:
old: w/XReas and RAS with 198K miles
new front - ICON 2.5 Extended Travel, Dirt King UCAs
new rear - GX470 conversion kit, SAW 1.5", Bilstein 5100s
new other: CV axles, wheel bearings, sway bar bushings and tie ends.
old: 33"/34" - 18"/19.25" (some sagging from original suspension)
new: 37"/37.75" - 22"/23" (a little rake as I usually do have weight in the back from towing or gear transport)
Ride: The ride is tight and in a good way. I can feel the road and how the truck responds to it. However the ICONs eat up every vibration and pothole thrown at it. I find the 5100s in the rear a little stiff, but nothing to the level that annoys me. If the ICON rears ever go on sale or if I find a decent used set, I will more than likely switch them out.
Note 1: The ICON's are set roughly 2.5" from their "no lift" height and I'm getting roughly 4" of lift up front from where the originals had sagged so there was a good 1" + of sag in the original suspension.
Note 2: For those who have removed RAS and have the annoying "OFF" light on or blinking, here is what I did to get rid of it. Remove 50AMP AIR SUS, 10AMP AIR SUS No.2, and Block No.5 RELAY Air SUS. Next I disconnected and terminated the wires leading to and from the AIR SUS "OFF" button on the center console. PRO - No always on or flashing "OFF" dash light and the ride height light displays as "normal" position on the dash. CON - Center console button no longer lights up at night.
Note 3: I haven't installed a front sway bar relocate yet and it is still in the stock position. I might have 1/8" to 1/16" of an inch between the coil spring and the sway bar. This will be going in soon though.
03' Limited V8:
old: w/XReas and RAS with 198K miles
new front - ICON 2.5 Extended Travel, Dirt King UCAs
new rear - GX470 conversion kit, SAW 1.5", Bilstein 5100s
new other: CV axles, wheel bearings, sway bar bushings and tie ends.
old: 33"/34" - 18"/19.25" (some sagging from original suspension)
new: 37"/37.75" - 22"/23" (a little rake as I usually do have weight in the back from towing or gear transport)
Ride: The ride is tight and in a good way. I can feel the road and how the truck responds to it. However the ICONs eat up every vibration and pothole thrown at it. I find the 5100s in the rear a little stiff, but nothing to the level that annoys me. If the ICON rears ever go on sale or if I find a decent used set, I will more than likely switch them out.
Note 1: The ICON's are set roughly 2.5" from their "no lift" height and I'm getting roughly 4" of lift up front from where the originals had sagged so there was a good 1" + of sag in the original suspension.
Note 2: For those who have removed RAS and have the annoying "OFF" light on or blinking, here is what I did to get rid of it. Remove 50AMP AIR SUS, 10AMP AIR SUS No.2, and Block No.5 RELAY Air SUS. Next I disconnected and terminated the wires leading to and from the AIR SUS "OFF" button on the center console. PRO - No always on or flashing "OFF" dash light and the ride height light displays as "normal" position on the dash. CON - Center console button no longer lights up at night.
Note 3: I haven't installed a front sway bar relocate yet and it is still in the stock position. I might have 1/8" to 1/16" of an inch between the coil spring and the sway bar. This will be going in soon though.
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05T4Rsport
New member
4th gen w/5th gen 20" limited rims
I own a 05 T4R sport edition 2wd w/stock suspension. I'm thinking of putting on a set of 5th gen 20" limited rims w/the stock tire sizes 245/60R20. Anyone know if these rims will rub if installed on a 4th gen w/stock suspension?
I own a 05 T4R sport edition 2wd w/stock suspension. I'm thinking of putting on a set of 5th gen 20" limited rims w/the stock tire sizes 245/60R20. Anyone know if these rims will rub if installed on a 4th gen w/stock suspension?
supermitchie
New member
Hi guys,
Great site here... Endless reading...
I have been lurking here for awhile. I have a 2004 limited and I would like to convert my airbags to manual like Bossman's technician did to his. My question is.... Does anybody know what size the hoses/fittings are on the bags...? And if so... Does anybody specifically know who would supply such things?
Thanks,
Mitchie
Great site here... Endless reading...
I have been lurking here for awhile. I have a 2004 limited and I would like to convert my airbags to manual like Bossman's technician did to his. My question is.... Does anybody know what size the hoses/fittings are on the bags...? And if so... Does anybody specifically know who would supply such things?
Thanks,
Mitchie
LPilotSmith
New member
Still on the hunt for largest wheel/tire size option that'll fit my 2005 2WD 4R after installation of an ICON Stage I 3"/2" lift - without requiring cutting, trimming, or removal of mud flaps. Beginning to recognize that the ultimate option will not be a function purely of size, but of geometry as well - which is probably why so many members have different experiences with rubbing even though they may have the same size tires and/or wheels. For my purposes I don't want or need to stuff the wheel wells with rubber. I also don't want the tires sticking too far out from the fenders; or tucked too far in either. Here's the geometric specs I'm sorting through...
Factory Wheels:
17" x 7.5" with a +30mm (1.18") offset
New Wheels (Black Rhino Sierra):
17" x 9" with a + 12 (.47") offset
18" x 9" with a + 12 (.47") offset
Factory Tires (Dunlop Grandtrek AT20:
265/65/R17 (30.6" diameter, 10.7" overall width)
New Tires (Nitto Terra Grappler G2 or Toyo Open Country A/T II):
265/70/R17 (31.7" diameter, 10.7" overall width)
265/65/R18 (31.5" diameter, 10.7" overall width)
275/65/R18 (32.1" diameter, 11.0" overall width)
New Tires (BFG All-Terrain T/A KO2):
275/70/R17 (32.2" diameter, 11.0" overall width)
By virtue of the decreased offset (18mm/.7") and increased width (.75" (1.5" divided by 2)), the new wheels should stick out 1.45" more than than the factory wheels. Both the factory wheels and the new wheels should provide just under 5" of backspace, which would be within the max specified by ICON. I was considering the same wheels with -12mm offset, but this would cause the wheels to stick out 2.39" more than stock, which I think may be excessive.
Though a .3" difference in overall tire width (just .15" each side) may not seems substantial from a mathematical perspective, it may be substantial from a geometric/clearance perspective relative to wheel size, offset, and backspace. Theoretically, more backspace would mean less clearance from the UCA and inner wheel well, and less backspace would mean less clearance from the outer wheel well, fender, and mud flap. Additionally, any increase in tire diameter above the factory 30.6" (even by only 1.1 to 1.6" (.55 to .80" each side)) would further decrease clearance and increase the likelihood that something is going to rub somewhere!
Given all these dimensions and the 3"/2" lift, there must be one configuration that will permit some minimal upsizing without creating a rubbing issue that will require cutting, trimming, or mud flap removal. Yes, I have read other threads where members claim being able to run 33" tires without 'butchering', but tire size is only one factor. The pieces to the clearance puzzle must include wheel width, offset, and backspace to have any meaning at all. For example, just switching to 9" wide wheels with -12mm offset would be equivalent to running factory wheels with 1.25" to 1.5" spacers. It sure would be helpful if members' build threads included the offset specs of their wheels and described whether any areas of tire rubbing were further inward or outward.
Though I'd like to upsize to 275/65/R18, I'm not sure the .6" in diameter or .3 in overall width over the 265/65/R18 to justify the increased risk of rubbing or the affects on gearing and speedo calibration. In contrast, the .9" increase (.45" each side) over the 30.6" factory provided by the 31.5" diameter 265/65/R18 may be the most logical option. Look forward to getting feedback from members who've approached this issue from a similar angle and what decision they came to!
Factory Wheels:
17" x 7.5" with a +30mm (1.18") offset
New Wheels (Black Rhino Sierra):
17" x 9" with a + 12 (.47") offset
18" x 9" with a + 12 (.47") offset
Factory Tires (Dunlop Grandtrek AT20:
265/65/R17 (30.6" diameter, 10.7" overall width)
New Tires (Nitto Terra Grappler G2 or Toyo Open Country A/T II):
265/70/R17 (31.7" diameter, 10.7" overall width)
265/65/R18 (31.5" diameter, 10.7" overall width)
275/65/R18 (32.1" diameter, 11.0" overall width)
New Tires (BFG All-Terrain T/A KO2):
275/70/R17 (32.2" diameter, 11.0" overall width)
By virtue of the decreased offset (18mm/.7") and increased width (.75" (1.5" divided by 2)), the new wheels should stick out 1.45" more than than the factory wheels. Both the factory wheels and the new wheels should provide just under 5" of backspace, which would be within the max specified by ICON. I was considering the same wheels with -12mm offset, but this would cause the wheels to stick out 2.39" more than stock, which I think may be excessive.
Though a .3" difference in overall tire width (just .15" each side) may not seems substantial from a mathematical perspective, it may be substantial from a geometric/clearance perspective relative to wheel size, offset, and backspace. Theoretically, more backspace would mean less clearance from the UCA and inner wheel well, and less backspace would mean less clearance from the outer wheel well, fender, and mud flap. Additionally, any increase in tire diameter above the factory 30.6" (even by only 1.1 to 1.6" (.55 to .80" each side)) would further decrease clearance and increase the likelihood that something is going to rub somewhere!
Given all these dimensions and the 3"/2" lift, there must be one configuration that will permit some minimal upsizing without creating a rubbing issue that will require cutting, trimming, or mud flap removal. Yes, I have read other threads where members claim being able to run 33" tires without 'butchering', but tire size is only one factor. The pieces to the clearance puzzle must include wheel width, offset, and backspace to have any meaning at all. For example, just switching to 9" wide wheels with -12mm offset would be equivalent to running factory wheels with 1.25" to 1.5" spacers. It sure would be helpful if members' build threads included the offset specs of their wheels and described whether any areas of tire rubbing were further inward or outward.
Though I'd like to upsize to 275/65/R18, I'm not sure the .6" in diameter or .3 in overall width over the 265/65/R18 to justify the increased risk of rubbing or the affects on gearing and speedo calibration. In contrast, the .9" increase (.45" each side) over the 30.6" factory provided by the 31.5" diameter 265/65/R18 may be the most logical option. Look forward to getting feedback from members who've approached this issue from a similar angle and what decision they came to!
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