5th Gen vs. 4th Gen ( Full Time 4wd etc.)

[1engineer]

When I first test drove the 5th gen (No I don't own one) it did feel like a dog but after putting at least half throttle to it, it did wake up. It does have a sluggish feel with little throttle. I think the ignition is tuned that way to get better mileage (hope it was intentional).

Koz

I totally understand and really have no issues. I just get tired of the bashing and the bs from people who don't even own it or have not spent much seat time in one. I have read quite a few posts on here and I don't recall many that definitively say "The 2010-2011 4Runner V6's are faster, better and stronger than the 4G's V8." That is simply not true yet the 4G owners keep going back to that. There are good and bad about both versions and comparisons are good and inevitable. If people want a V8 fine. Just don't go bashing the 5G guys

 

[oblivionis]

I'm here in the 5Gen section because I'm considering buying a 5Gen 4Runner but to be honest I'm finding more and more reasons not to. For me the biggest ones are no full-time 4WD (which is why I'm in this thread) and no keyless entry/push button start (Venza has it). I'm just hoping those things get added when it gets refreshed in a couple of years. I'll just have to keep my 4Gen a bit longer.

 

[Koz]

I'm here in the 5Gen section because I'm considering buying a 5Gen 4Runner but to be honest I'm finding more and more reasons not to. For me the biggest ones are no full-time 4WD (which is why I'm in this thread) and no keyless entry/push button start (Venza has it). I'm just hoping those things get added when it gets refreshed in a couple of years. I'll just have to keep my 4Gen a bit longer.

The 5th gen Limited has these features.

Koz

 

[Koz]

I totally understand and really have no issues. I just get tired of the bashing and the bs from people who don't even own it or have not spent much seat time in one. I have read quite a few posts on here and I don't recall many that definitively say "The 2010-2011 4Runner V6's are faster, better and stronger than the 4G's V8." That is simply not true yet the 4G owners keep going back to that. There are good and bad about both versions and comparisons are good and inevitable. If people want a V8 fine. Just don't go bashing the 5G guys

I fully understand about the bashing. Unfortunately there are always some people who need to throw dirt to justify their decisions. I personally feel the 5th gen is a great looking vehicle (better then the 4th) and will run right with the 4th but I was a little disappointed when they discontinued some of the features that were available in the 4th (features that spoiled me). Stuff like the V8 and rear air springs. I lost my 4th gen and HAD to replace it. The problem for me was I tow and needed more then a 5K lbs tow rating. Also my T4R had the rear air and I would not want to tow without it. I will be retiring soon (early retirement) and this vehicle will be used to tour the country with a trailer. If these features were available on the T4R I would have got one instead of the GX. With taht said, I can tell you, if you really like the T4R you would LOVE the GX. I don't think I could go back; I'm WAY too spoiled now.

Koz

 

[1engineer]

I fully understand about the bashing. Unfortunately there are always some people who need to throw dirt to justify their decisions. I personally feel the 5th gen is a great looking vehicle (better then the 4th) and will run right with the 4th but I was a little disappointed when they discontinued some of the features that were available in the 4th (features that spoiled me). Stuff like the V8 and rear air springs. I lost my 4th gen and HAD to replace it. The problem for me was I tow and needed more then a 5K lbs tow rating. Also my T4R had the rear air and I would not want to tow without it. I will be retiring soon (early retirement) and this vehicle will be used to tour the country with a trailer. If these features were available on the T4R I would have got one instead of the GX. With taht said, I can tell you, if you really like the T4R you would LOVE the GX. I don't think I could go back; I'm WAY too spoiled now.

Koz

Totally understand the luxury. I myself am from the function over form camp. While I like and appreciate all the bells and whistles I also like the simplicity and ruggedness of the 5th generation.

 

[Climb14er]

So, how long have you owned your 5thG? Don't have one? I'll ask you the same question I asked repeatedly to docMT: Why are you here in the 5th G section when you don't have one? Oh, just to talk trash...just like docMT. Ok then I can put you on the "ignore list" since you have nothing at all to offer.

My business is heavy duty engines, transmissions and differentials in the export arena. I only steeped in when there was talk about the Torsen and the V8 and V6 motors.

Look up my past posts and you will see very few of them dealing with this subject... or many others for that matter.

Personally, I don't give a rat's you-know-what if you want to ignore the minuscule amount of posts I've made after almost five years on this forum.

I offered first hand experience of my driving the 4th gen V6, V8 and the 5th gen V6.

The local general manager, a close friend at the Toyota dealership loaned me a 5th gen V6 to test drive and give him my 'opinion'.

Know what? It's under powered... simple as that.

It needs the 4.6 V8 that was supposed to go into this vehicle!

The general manager test drove the 5th gen with the 4.6 at the dealer's meeting in Los Angeles two years ago and he loved it. I was waiting for the 5th gen with the 4.6 AND Torsen but the 5th has neither except for the Limited which I do not like... and that has the Torsen.

As many might know, Toyota pulled the 4.6 V8 due to the poor economy and rising gas prices. BIG MISTAKE TOYOTA!

Like I said, ignore me because my articulated thoughts must have hit you in the gut with the truth of the matter which evidently you cannot handle. :wow:

 

[SeattleMike]

Know what? It's under powered... simple as that.

It needs the 4.6 V8 that was supposed to go into this vehicle!

The general manager test drove the 5th gen with the 4.6 at the dealer's meeting in Los Angeles two years ago and he loved it. I was waiting for the 5th gen with the 4.6 AND Torsen but the 5th has neither except for the Limited which I do not like... and that has the Torsen.

As many might know, Toyota pulled the 4.6 V8 due to the poor economy and rising gas prices. BIG MISTAKE TOYOTA!

Like I said, ignore me because my articulated thoughts must have hit you in the gut with the truth of the matter which evidently you cannot handle. :wow:

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[1engineer]

My business is heavy duty engines, transmissions and differentials in the export arena. I only steeped in when there was talk about the Torsen and the V8 and V6 motors.

Look up my past posts and you will see very few of them dealing with this subject... or many others for that matter.

Personally, I don't give a rat's you-know-what if you want to ignore the minuscule amount of posts I've made after almost five years on this forum.

I offered first hand experience of my driving the 4th gen V6, V8 and the 5th gen V6.

The local general manager, a close friend at the Toyota dealership loaned me a 5th gen V6 to test drive and give him my 'opinion'.

Know what? It's under powered... simple as that.

It needs the 4.6 V8 that was supposed to go into this vehicle!

The general manager test drove the 5th gen with the 4.6 at the dealer's meeting in Los Angeles two years ago and he loved it. I was waiting for the 5th gen with the 4.6 AND Torsen but the 5th has neither except for the Limited which I do not like... and that has the Torsen.

As many might know, Toyota pulled the 4.6 V8 due to the poor economy and rising gas prices. BIG MISTAKE TOYOTA!

Like I said, ignore me because my articulated thoughts must have hit you in the gut with the truth of the matter which evidently you cannot handle. :wow:

Whatever. I don't care if you are the Toyota lead engineer over 4WD systems and ICE. They all have their place. Point is, why come to a sub forum and knock the 5G? You offer what everyone else offers on this subject: Your opinion. Nothing else. We LIKE the 5th G 4WD system and V6 ICE. You don't. We get it. Start a thread over in the 4G side and I'm sure you will get many supporters. Wait...docMT is gone so make that one less.

 

[scanny]

The local general manager, a close friend at the Toyota dealership loaned me a 5th gen V6 to test drive and give him my 'opinion'.

Know what? It's under powered... simple as that.

It needs the 4.6 V8 that was supposed to go into this vehicle!

Numbers tell you the truth:


2011 v6 0-60 mph time of 7.7 seconds
Torque: 278 ft-lbs. @ 4400 rpm
Horsepower: 270 hp @ 5600 rpm
EPA mileage est. (cty/hwy): 17/23 mpg

2009 v8 0-60 mph time of 7.2 seconds
Torque: 306 ft-lbs. @ 3400 rpm
Horsepower: 260 hp @ 5400 rpm
EPA mileage est. (cty/hwy): 15/19 mpg


0,5 sec 0-60mph difference, 28 ft-lbs less torque and firmer push on gas pedal to get a good acceleration.

from other hand extra 10 hp and 2/4mpg better mileage comparing to v8.

I wouldn't say this is a really bad idea to get rid of v8. Based on numbers above I would stick to new v6 if I had a choice. Mostly because I feel that v6 is adequate and gas is not going to be any cheaper. But everybody is entitled for an opinion of course.

 

[1engineer]

Numbers tell you the truth:


2011 v6 0-60 mph time of 7.7 seconds
Torque: 278 ft-lbs. @ 4400 rpm
Horsepower: 270 hp @ 5600 rpm
EPA mileage est. (cty/hwy): 17/23 mpg

2009 v8 0-60 mph time of 7.2 seconds
Torque: 306 ft-lbs. @ 3400 rpm
Horsepower: 260 hp @ 5400 rpm
EPA mileage est. (cty/hwy): 15/19 mpg


0,5 sec 0-60mph difference, 28 ft-lbs less torque and firmer push on gas pedal to get a good acceleration.

from other hand extra 10 hp and 2/4mpg better mileage comparing to v8.

I wouldn't say this is a really bad idea to get rid of v8. Based on numbers below I would stick to new v6 if I had a choice. Mostly because I feel that v6 is adequate and gas is not going to be any cheaper. But everybody is entitled for an opinion of course.

Great post! Numbers won't matter to the haters though because only what they think matters to them. Did you get a GVW for each?

 

[Jtraskell]

Here is a question, with the current 4.6 V8 fit in place of the current V-6 and Tranny config without much if any modifications? That might be the answer for some folks........

 

[Climb14er]

2011 v6 0-60 mph time of 7.7 seconds
Torque: 278 ft-lbs. @ 4400 rpm
Horsepower: 270 hp @ 5600 rpm
EPA mileage est. (cty/hwy): 17/23 mpg

2009 v8 0-60 mph time of 7.2 seconds
Torque: 306 ft-lbs. @ 3400 rpm
Horsepower: 260 hp @ 5400 rpm
EPA mileage est. (cty/hwy): 15/19 mpg

******************


Let's look at the numbers for those who care:

The V8 makes 306 torque at ONLY 3400 rpm.

The V6 has to go all the way to 4400 rpm to make 278 torque.

For those who know anything about power... the V8 is hardly turning to make much greater torque numbers.

The V6 has to work a lot harder to make much less torque.

So before some of you folks who think you know about motors, go apoplectic... ... the V8 pulls easier, at less rpm and makes far greater torque numbers.

Go ahead and try to tell me I'm upset or anything like that...

I'm totally cool where I sit and see that some of you... know very little about motors and power!

As far as I'm concerned, case closed! :beer:

Back to the markets!

 

[FlyNavy]

As far as I'm concerned, case closed! :beer:

Sweet, off you go then, back to the 4th gen section. Thanks for the input.

 

[Crit Rat]

Back to the markets!

What kind of gas mileage are you getting here at altitude with your drivetrain? Just curious as I am shopping a lightly used 4th gen vs. new 5th.
I like things about generations, there are good and bad with both. One thing I don't like about the v8 in the 4th is that it has a timing belt requiring replacement vs. a timing chain that is good for life.

OT, I know but this thread is a mess anyway.

 

[JB.]

V6 is a dog.

Let's look at the numbers....

For those who know anything about power...

Here's the thing. All you're really saying (with loaded phrasing) is "I don't like the feel of the pedal or listening to high revs". You're implying a large capability difference where it's really mostly a preference for the ease and quiet of low rpm and the expected extra longevity of the engine and transmission. Rev the V6 up and there should be very little speed difference running over mountain passes. Horsepower - torque at the wheels and all that - but you know all this already, right?

To each his own, I like the V8 too, but let's be clear about the reasons.

 

[scanny]

The V6 has to work a lot harder to make much less torque.

So before some of you folks who think you know about motors, go apoplectic... ... the V8 pulls easier, at less rpm and makes far greater torque numbers.

I think that nobody's arguing that v8 gives you more torque and pulls easier at less rpm. I'm just saying that the difference between old v8 and new v6 is not as dramatic and most people would choose new v6 because it's quite adequate for the vehicle and consumes less fuel. So far I drove on quite hilly roads in PA, NY around Lake Placid and VT around Jay Peak and I didn't feel that I needed more power. Yes, I have to push it harder going uphill but for me it's accceptable tradeoff for better fuel efficiency and lower vehicle cost.

What I'm saying is that 5th gen T4R engine is actually quite capable and I'm glad I didn't have to go for v8 : )

 

[Ripsnort]

:lol::lol::lol::lol:



























(I'm sorry. I found this thread funny. I mean, I've been on forums basically since the text only web days of Telnet...and have been in many auto forums and discussions, but never have I ever seen a Dic* measuring contest between forum members that own the same model of an automobile. I find that EXTREMELY hilarious. Now, if you'll forgive me, I'll clean up my monitor and you may resume your in-fighting over who's is better.)

 

[oblivionis]

The 5th gen Limited has these features.

Koz

Nope, it has AWD and not FT 4WD which what I would want. Also, push button start should be standard for all trims.

 

[JB.]

Nope, it (5th gen LE) has AWD and not FT 4WD which what I would want. Also, push button start should be standard for all trims.

The two transfer cases are virtually identical and perform exactly the same in high range (low range unlocked is unavailable in the 5th gen).

The presence of low range gearing traditionally favors the term FT4WD instead of AWD so, yes, it has it.

 

[Ghost Runner]

driven both

Factor not often considered: 4th gens generally have 65's not 70 sized tires. This will rob power inherently from the system. Lets put the exact same tires on for any kind of real testing.

My brother in law has a 4th gen limited V8. I have a 2010 TE. He thought it was pretty gutless pulling his huge boat unlike what other v8 owners claim so he got a tundra to do the job - big difference. People talk like the V8 4th gen can supply the power of a 6 litre diesel or something...this is a myth for sure. I will do a head to head towing comparison next time I'm home visiting.... I want to settle this as scientfically as possible because personally I think the power difference is way overblown.

I had a 1997 Jeep GC V6. Wow is the new V6 ever light years ahead - which it should be. To me off the line at low RPM the new 4runner's v6 is JUST LIKE A V8 - amost identical in sound to an older durrango V8 i've drivven in a lot. Then there is the fact that the gas milage is strides ahead of older v6's and the older v8. Look at the Jeeps V6's now...still crap IMO.

Basically what I notice is what everyone notices. Drive the V6 at a higher RPM to get very similar pull (torque) up passes - yes I've driven big passes this summer including the Coqhuillaha east bound while towing 1500 lb tent trailer. I find people that are used to V8's are scared of higher rpm - man you need to drive a smaller car for a bit! And guess what your tranny isn't going to fail you, they actually do have mountains in japan! You should see how high I would rev my 91 pickup...its not a big deal! I guess some just want to be at a lower rpm...its an ego thing I think for some.

I like the less sensitive throttle. I want to save gas, the enviroment and money. Plus my wife absolutely haits jackrabit starts. Makes her car sick.

I find towing a moderate trailer to be absolutely fine with the 6 despite what otehrs claim. I am also used to towing 1500 lbs with a subaru forester - everyone told me the engine couldn't handle it and all that crap and I towed for 7 years straight no gaskett issues, same clutch and everything. Personally I think this V6 is going to have great longenvity and if you use the right power band, then you should have ample power. Don't be a wuss, get her in a lower gear and enjoy the ride!

Personally I think the average truck and car is overpowered for daily driving and leads to dangerous driving overall. Even the attitudes people have are dangerious: "I need more power to get to the ski hill and pass other families"...yikes! Most people don't need so much power!!!

I found the AWD in the subaru a silly waste of gas. Try going around a corner fast in AWD/full time 4wd versus two wheel drive - doesn't make a darn difference, what you need is good tires and weight in the rear.

Millions of tacoma owners drive around in 4wd all winter long and you will find minimal mechanical issues - sure it would have provided buyers more choice to offer the torsen in the TE but honestly its not necessary as proven by tacoma oweners. I had a 1991 pickup (pretacoma) and drove it around in 4wd all the time (had been used for over 20 winters) and not once did the drivetrain have any issues regardless of abusing it by turing on relatively dry pavement.

Sorry for the unedited book...just had to let it all flow out after an incredible summer in our new ride...love it!!!!!