Don't buy from shrockworks

[BlackWorksInc]

Like I said, my experience with SW was bittersweet. Mark was very quick to respond to my emails regarding delays and to try and explain the causes of the delay and I felt that as a customer my complaints were being genuinely heard. He also threw in a Snatch Strap for free as a thank you for my patience and overnighted missing D-Rings I ordered when they didn't show up with my bumper at his cost. I am very happy with the quality of the bumper and the product I paid for and recieved and on a customer service level I felt that he did a good job. The bitter part was having to wait so long to get it which I understand irks a lot of people and did me as well.

I agree that SW's biggest flaw is in their delivering their actual product on time without constant delay, which hurts their reputation and credibility. But I wouldn't label them a "bad company" because of it, I reserve that label for things like Chrysler, BMW, EA, BP Oil, Enron, ect. It doesn't excuse their current standard of service, but I just don't seem them in the same bed as say EBay sellers who sell crap products and take your money for them.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

While most companies might cringe at a thread like this I think it acctually helps us out. Its always nice to be able to see what our shop looks like through the customers eyes.

I more than anyone am the worst when it comes to waiting. I even have a hard time waiting on an item that ships next day that takes 5 days UPS ground! For this reason I can truly appreciate the patience our customers offer us. Some have less than others and those names we certainly remember, but 99% of the time when the wait is over we have a return customer once they actually get a chance to put their hands on one of our products.

Im sure that everyone knows it does not take us 4 months to build a single bumper. The problem is that on this day today, our order list is literally 10 pages long, and we have take care of everyone on a first come first serve basis. Our quoted lead times are based on what those products shipping times have been on average in recent history. We never intend to be deceiving, but some times our quotes can be a bit off and sometimes material back orders can happen periodically come time for that particular order to hit the build tables. I cant tell you how many calls I take a day that I loose when we relay our lead times. Its certainly an issue we are aware of and would no doubt benenfit us to resolve.

We have made many attempts at catching up on it. It seems like everytime we do, more business comes. We have hired more people, moved shops, hired even more people, and invested massive amounts of $$$ in our on cnc equipment to bring almost all of our production processes in house. If business were coming in at the same rate it was when we first opened this place, we would be absolutly KILLING it. Story is though, that our shop is constantly growing. When I first came in back in 2006 our we used to order 30 pallets every couple of months, now we are ordering the same order of pallets almost every week.

Long story short, we are always glad to have your feedback and unless the doors shut on this place(which is far from likely at this point) we will always be pushing to bring down our lead times and improve our customer satisfaction.

Was posted by TxBxSx (SW Rep or owner I forget which) in the http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-g...-business-shrockworks-losing.html#post1317960 thread.

 

[macoyle]

I love my bumper and get compliments on it all the time. BUT......The wait sucked. I knew it, everyone that owns one or who has heard of them knows it. But I dont like the ARB bumper, I like the CBI rear bumper but I think the front bumper is hideous IMO. The other front bumpers I have seen are ok, Im not a fan of tube bumpers on newer vehicles, just my opinion again. Shrockworks was the only one that really followed the flow and lines of the 4runner and looked "finished". So thats the only reason I put up with the wait. I think I waited like 3 months or something like that. I just ordered it and tried to forget about it.

 

[93toy]

Even though it's about all been covered here, I'll throw in my 2 cents worth since my first and ONLY dealings with SW has just completed.

Ordered my 13 Trail in mid-December 2012. Searched some in the 5th gen forums to get reviews on sliders so I could get some ordered and have them here when the new 4Runner finally showed up. Having bought armor (for other Toyotas) from Demello, 4xInnovations, All Pro Off Road and Stubbs in the past, I have had very good experiences with all of those companies as far as product quality and customer service. I read alot about SW and determined quality was second to none and turn time was slow. I underestimated how slow and didn't research the customer service enough.

Finally received the sliders a full 17 weeks (to the day) after I ordered them. I was billed in full the day that I ordered them. On the phone with them I was lied to on at least 4 occassions.

Quality appears to be first rate. Fitment was perfect, which is GREAT considering I cringe to think what follow up would have been like if there had been a problem.

Once I got them installed and was quite happy with my Trail with sliders, the wife asks, "So aren't you happy now? Wouldn't you do it the same all over again to have such a good product?". To which I replied "No".

I would not order from Shrockworks ever again simply because of the dishonesty and deception. I am the most anal, detail oriented person you'll ever meet, but I also expect honesty. There are too many other good, small businesses out there who are straightforward. I will never recommend SW. Ever.

 

[97hb]

I always try to support local but this has me thinking. Looking to order my bumper this June but I can't wait 6 months lol. Is this the same shockworks that makes long tube turbo manifolds???

 

[macoyle]

No I don't think so, we are talking about shrockworks, not shockworks

 

[Martinjmpr]

Yikes! What an ordeal!

My opinion is that while delays are excusable (because stuff happens, and in this economy, I can understand a builder not wanting to stock inventory that's unsold) but lies are never excusable.

Unfortunately I think some people simply have never learned the art of giving bad news to customers. They tell the customers what they think the customers want to hear ("it's in production, we'll have it done by Friday") when in fact they haven't even gotten in the steel or scheduled it.

The only solution I can think of is to try to find a (hopefully local) builder who can do your project on time.

 

[EdmundGTP]

Even though it's about all been covered here, I'll throw in my 2 cents worth since my first and ONLY dealings with SW has just completed.

Ordered my 13 Trail in mid-December 2012. Searched some in the 5th gen forums to get reviews on sliders so I could get some ordered and have them here when the new 4Runner finally showed up. Having bought armor (for other Toyotas) from Demello, 4xInnovations, All Pro Off Road and Stubbs in the past, I have had very good experiences with all of those companies as far as product quality and customer service. I read alot about SW and determined quality was second to none and turn time was slow. I underestimated how slow and didn't research the customer service enough.

Finally received the sliders a full 17 weeks (to the day) after I ordered them. I was billed in full the day that I ordered them. On the phone with them I was lied to on at least 4 occassions.

Quality appears to be first rate. Fitment was perfect, which is GREAT considering I cringe to think what follow up would have been like if there had been a problem.

Once I got them installed and was quite happy with my Trail with sliders, the wife asks, "So aren't you happy now? Wouldn't you do it the same all over again to have such a good product?". To which I replied "No".

I would not order from Shrockworks ever again simply because of the dishonesty and deception. I am the most anal, detail oriented person you'll ever meet, but I also expect honesty. There are too many other good, small businesses out there who are straightforward. I will never recommend SW. Ever.

I'm sorry, but 17 weeks for a component as relatively "simple" as a set of sliders, is ridiculous.. There's no other word for it. Out of curiosity, what was the lead time you were quoted?

 

[93toy]

I'm sorry, but 17 weeks for a component as relatively "simple" as a set of sliders, is ridiculous.. There's no other word for it. Out of curiosity, what was the lead time you were quoted?

10-12 weeks is what I was originally told. 5 additional weeks may not sound like much (although it is in my opinion), but the lying to me is what poured salt in the wound along with the additional wait.

Ordered December 17 2012, received April 15 2013.

 

[A_HuL]

Not flaming, but reading stories like this makes me happier and happier I bought CBI

Haha makes me happier and happier I got mine custom made

 

[wadle5]

Again what everyone is voicing is opinion. The truth of the matter is, his case is an extenuating circumstance. If researched it is known they have a larger production window. Also people keep comparing it to ARB or DO or CBI. The truth is the difference. Sure I can get one of the quicker, but A. what is the point of expediting a service on an item I dont fully like aesthetically and B. if I'm not in need of instant gratification and have planned my trips in advance I know that the allotted timeframe wont interfere with my use of the bumper. Also they charged me half the amount and will charge the final half upon powerdercoating and shipping. Is his situation horrible. . .yes. But to say every bumper that EVERYONE has ordered from SW has gone this way is an exaggerated statement. Again not saying you can't get another bumper quicker, but IMHO why settle. I chose and waited for the SW, because it is my money and that is what I want to buy. Also all the others but one dont offer an extra skid included which for me also paid for itself in the price difference. :frusty:

 

[OffRoadGuy]

Tough crowd here - but understandable.

The OP is correct, If a company is going to quote you date they should stick with it. For future orders ask them for a guarantee date of delivery, and If you don't receive your order on that date. What is the recourse? 5% OFF? Something of that nature. No guarantee date.. pick another company.

Thats why I try to stick with local companies. I guess I'll go bug the hell out of them. :lol:

 

[93toy]

"Again what everyone is voicing is opinion..." - wadle5

Wadle, I have no beef with you, but in an effort to make myself clear, my posts are fact, not opinion.

Here are a few facts about my order so that no one thinks I am randomly flaming for no reason:

Ordered Dec. 17 2012. Told I would have my order in 10-12 weeks.

Billed in full the day I ordered.

At 10 weeks I called to check on order status. I was not upset as they still had 2 weeks, but they said everything was right on time and I'd have it by 12 weeks.

Week 13 I called, was told by an employee (I have all names/times/dates documented) that even though we were a week late already, the sliders had been built and were headed out to powdercoat TODAY.

Week 15 I spoke with same employee. I was not happy. He wasn't sure of my order status, said he'd check that day and call me back before the close of business that day. I waited 26 hours, never heard from him. Called back, spoke to same employee. I asked why he never called me back to give me the status update like he promised, he said "I got busy". I asked to speak with the owner. Later that day the owner did call me back. He said my sliders had been built and were headed out to powdercoat TODAY. (Same thing I had been told 2 weeks prior)

Week 17 they arrived.

I'll spare everyone all of the details, but that hits the high spots. But these are FACTS, not OPINIONS as was suggested.

Now that I shared what I consider to be facts, here is a thought that is an opinion. Even if they do say 10-12 weeks, why do they bill when you order? I can't think of any other company I've ever ordered from (and I order alot of parts) that bills the moment you order. Typically they bill when they ship. And if the product is back ordered or has an extended wait, most companies wouldn't dream of billing until it ships.

Yes there are materials/labor costs from the minute they started building my sliders. I understand that. But that's the cost of doing business. A company should have enough financial backing behind them that they can weather that expense until the product ships and is paid for. You don't go into McDonalds to order a burger and then they take your money up front and then head out back to kill the cow. I detail cars as a source of side income. I don't bill when you drop your car off even though I'm using materials/labor from the time I start working. You pay for your detail when the work is complete.

Again, I'm not flaming. My dealings with SW is over on this order and forever. You will likely never hear me discuss them again in any thread other than this. But I don't want anyone to think I am posting my wild personal opinions. I want to share the facts so others can form their own opinions before they make a decision as to whether or not to buy from SW.

 

[superman3043]

Again what everyone is voicing is opinion. The truth of the matter is, his case is an extenuating circumstance. If researched it is known they have a larger production window. Also people keep comparing it to ARB or DO or CBI. The truth is the difference. Sure I can get one of the quicker, but A. what is the point of expediting a service on an item I dont fully like aesthetically and B. if I'm not in need of instant gratification and have planned my trips in advance I know that the allotted timeframe wont interfere with my use of the bumper. Also they charged me half the amount and will charge the final half upon powerdercoating and shipping. Is his situation horrible. . .yes. But to say every bumper that EVERYONE has ordered from SW has gone this way is an exaggerated statement. Again not saying you can't get another bumper quicker, but IMHO why settle. I chose and waited for the SW, because it is my money and that is what I want to buy. Also all the others but one dont offer an extra skid included which for me also paid for itself in the price difference. :frusty:

Yeah man, I think you lost us on this one Nick. Please help us understand what you're reffering to as "opinion". I'll try to recap a lot of the "facts" stated here:

- Those of us that did not order from Shrockworks are extremely happy that we didn't... Fact

- Shrockworks makes a good product, but they don't make the only good product... Fact

- Shrockworks practices shitty business by lying to people and giving them the run around... Fact

The OP's case is not unique. If you'd have done your research like you say, you'd see that they repeatedly shit on customers, as is evident by the multiple threads like this as well as the folks like 93Toy that have chimed in here. Once again, the complaint isn't about long lead times... Everyone knows that when they order from Shrockworks, they're not gonna get there shit for a long time. It's about saying one thing and doing another, please try and understand that.

Nobody ever stated that they lie to everyone, but one customer is one lie too many. If they truly did lie to everyone, I'd think they would have an even smaller fan-base as well as less people trying to defend them thinking they're the best thing since sliced bread. Now who's trying to justify their purchase (as you were insinuating in post #22)? If multiple people have felt passionate enough about how wrong they've been done to post threads about this, to me that's enough. If it were just one lone customer with a single bad experience, that was known around the forum as a constant whiner or complainer, that's one thing... But that's NOT the case.

But since we ARE stating opinions, here's mine. I think Shrockworks bumpers are bulky and hideous. They look like something any 6 year old could design. Couple that with the fact that every modded 4th gen has them and they charge you more than everyone else to get in a 6 month long line and possibly lied to, you can keep that.

TBH IMO, Demello probably has the nicer looking offering since it seems aesthitics (which is a highly opinion driven metric) seems so important to you.

Oh and here's another fun fact for you. Everyone in the industry (as far as I know) uses the same material thickness as Shrockworks with the exception of DO, who use 1/8" vs 3/16" (1/16" or .0625" delta) steel on the skin. The trade off is you get a lighter weight and a little lesser expensive bumper.

I also feel that ARB and CBI bumpers are pretty ugly as well (also only my opinion). Which is why I had mine customized. That's always an option with most of the shops as they're custom fab shops. I could have easily told CBI to make my bumper look exactly like a Shrockworks and I could have still gotten it in the same lead time and less expensive.

Here's my experience. I had a 2 week shipping delay on a custom bumper from CBI because they shut the shop down to go to SEMA last year. Nathan at CBI contacted me to let me know what was going on and why my bumper wasn't gonna make it in my original window. Cool, I understand! He didn't tell me , "yeah it's on the truck" and leave me sitting in the driveway waiting for two weeks. THAT's how you do business!

Unless you are getting paid by them to make excuses on forums for them, please stop trying to justify why they do business the way they do. It's NOT excusable, period.

 

[wadle5]

Yeah man, I think you lost us on this one Nick. Please help us understand what you're reffering to as "opinion". I'll try to recap a lot of the "facts" stated here:

- Those of us that did not order from Shrockworks are extremely happy that we didn't... Fact

- Shrockworks makes a good product, but they don't make the only good product... Fact

- Shrockworks practices shitty business by lying to people and giving them the run around... Fact

The OP's case is not unique. If you'd have done your research like you say, you'd see that they repeatedly shit on customers, as is evident by the multiple threads like this as well as the folks like 93Toy that have chimed in here. Once again, the complaint isn't about long lead times... Everyone knows that when they order from Shrockworks, they're not gonna get there shit for a long time. It's about saying one thing and doing another, please try and understand that.

Nobody ever stated that they lie to everyone, but one customer is one lie too many. If they truly did lie to everyone, I'd think they would have an even smaller fan-base as well as less people trying to defend them thinking they're the best thing since sliced bread. Now who's trying to justify their purchase (as you were insinuating in post #22)? If multiple people have felt passionate enough about how wrong they've been done to post threads about this, to me that's enough. If it were just one lone customer with a single bad experience, that was known around the forum as a constant whiner or complainer, that's one thing... But that's NOT the case.

But since we ARE stating opinions, here's mine. I think Shrockworks bumpers are bulky and hideous. They look like something any 6 year old could design. Couple that with the fact that every modded 4th gen has them and they charge you more than everyone else to get in a 6 month long line and possibly lied to, you can keep that.

TBH IMO, Demello probably has the nicer looking offering since it seems aesthitics (which is a highly opinion driven metric) seems so important to you.

Oh and here's another fun fact for you. Everyone in the industry (as far as I know) uses the same material thickness as Shrockworks with the exception of DO, who use 1/8" vs 3/16" (1/16" or .0625" delta) steel on the skin. The trade off is you get a lighter weight and a little lesser expensive bumper.

I also feel that ARB and CBI bumpers are pretty ugly as well (also only my opinion). Which is why I had mine customized. That's always an option with most of the shops as they're custom fab shops. I could have easily told CBI to make my bumper look exactly like a Shrockworks and I could have still gotten it in the same lead time and less expensive.

Here's my experience. I had a 2 week shipping delay on a custom bumper from CBI because they shut the shop down to go to SEMA last year. Nathan at CBI contacted me to let me know what was going on and why my bumper wasn't gonna make it in my original window. Cool, I understand! He didn't tell me , "yeah it's on the truck" and leave me sitting in the driveway waiting for two weeks. THAT's how you do business!

Unless you are getting paid by them to make excuses on forums for them, please stop trying to justify why they do business the way they do. It's NOT excusable, period.

To purchase an off road bumper for safety why would you buy one that is lighter. After being in an accident I preferred the heavier duty bumper. So again why settle for less. Thats the only point your argument I will counter because this tapatalk app sucks. But yes enjoy your "much better looking bumper" that you got amazingly quick and hope ya use it to its full potential!

 

[aha2988]

. But yes enjoy your "much better looking bumper" that you got amazingly quick and hope ya use it to its full potential!

oh he has! and seeing it's potential first hand intrigued me to purchase from CBI. I've seen his bumper carry the entire front load of the vehicle with both front wheels unloaded. I've seen it pull massive logs to make custom trails in local spots to ride in. There isn't anything about the quality of a CBI bumper you can shake a stick at. There a custom fab shop with just as many orders as shrockworks and capable of a shorter lead time. On top of that they're continuously building custom 4 link and 3 link setups on tacomas, Fj's and 4runners, custom exoskeletons, tube buggies, lift installations, and all other types of 4x4 shop work.

Nathan at CBI contacted me last week when my bumper was supposed to ship and apologetically informed me of there order increase and how they've hit some bumps in the road. They got my bumper finished over the weekend and shipped it out monday. I got that response without even asking or checking up on it. Then to no avail he refunded my money for the shackels to get them to me free, threw in a free recovery strap and discounted my shipping cost for just missing the lead time by a week. you can't beat that period.

 

[superman3043]

To purchase an off road bumper for safety why would you buy one that is lighter. After being in an accident I preferred the heavier duty bumper. So again why settle for less. Thats the only point your argument I will counter because this tapatalk app sucks. But yes enjoy your "much better looking bumper" that you got amazingly quick and hope ya use it to its full potential!

Thanks! I do use it and will continue to use it and love it.

But once again, your statement is just skewed. I don't think anybody that has purchased a DO bumper considers their decision "settling", and to call it that is an inaccurate insinuation. People that bought them probably did their research and made an educated purchase just like you. They got a bumper that was aesthetically appealing to them, priced right with an acceptable lead time. Probably knowing their intents and purposes of use and knowing that there are other offerings that use heavier materials, but opted for a lighter, less expensive package. Hell, DO has an aluminum bumper as well and for some consumers, THAT will be the right purchase for them. Lighter weight at an added cost. Come to think of it, you know how man threads I've seen posted by a DO bumper owner that has "tin canned" it and said "shoulda bought a shrockworks?"... ZERO

We buy these for added protection yes, but we're not building battering rams here. The main benefits from off-road bumpers is added protection over the factory plastic (or at least easier to repair), winch mounting, improved approach angles and tire clearance. I think most everybody fits that formula.

I've been designing machines with steel for the past 10 years and have used everything from sheet metal on construction equipment to 5/16" to 1" thick armor plate on bomb proof military vehicles. I'd really like to see the window of difference between an impact that would destroy a 1/8" plate that would not destroy a 3/16" plate. I bet the result would surprise you. I'd do the analysis, but don't really care to. The fact is, you can use overly beefy materials all day and build things as stout as you'd like, but there is a cost impact that will be associated with overbuilding. On the flip side, a good engineer can design something using lighter materials that can function just as well as a part built with heavy materials and make it lighter and cheaper.

Anyway yeah, enjoy your Shrockworks when you finally get it. I'm sure you'll be very happy with the purchase. Just don't ask them for a status update and don't come here to rant about it if they shit on you (which I hope they don't).

 

[wadle5]

Yes.

 

[KidVermicious]

oh he has! and seeing it's potential first hand intrigued me to purchase from CBI. I've seen his bumper carry the entire front load of the vehicle with both front wheels unloaded. I've seen it pull massive logs to make custom trails in local spots to ride in. There isn't anything about the quality of a CBI bumper you can shake a stick at. There a custom fab shop with just as many orders as shrockworks and capable of a shorter lead time. On top of that they're continuously building custom 4 link and 3 link setups on tacomas, Fj's and 4runners, custom exoskeletons, tube buggies, lift installations, and all other types of 4x4 shop work.

Nathan at CBI contacted me last week when my bumper was supposed to ship and apologetically informed me of there order increase and how they've hit some bumps in the road. They got my bumper finished over the weekend and shipped it out monday. I got that response without even asking or checking up on it. Then to no avail he refunded my money for the shackels to get them to me free, threw in a free recovery strap and discounted my shipping cost for just missing the lead time by a week. you can't beat that period.

But you didn't get a Shrockworks. None of that matters, because you can't be cool unless you have a Shrockworks.

On a more realistic note, [MENTION=64712]CBI OffRoad Fab[/MENTION] is awesome. I love this sort of customer service, and it makes me wanna go buy something I don't need from them just because they're awesome.

 

[aha2988]

But you didn't get a Shrockworks. None of that matters, because you can't be cool unless you have a Shrockworks.

On a more realistic note, [MENTION=64712]CBI OffRoad Fab[/MENTION] is awesome. I love this sort of customer service, and it makes me wanna go buy something I don't need from them just because they're awesome.

eh I was trying to be a hipster but superman and the other CBI owners beat me to it lol.