if I were buying a used or new TRD ORP is there any outward sign inside the vehicle or easily visible without crawling underneath or putting it on a lift that the vehicle was equipped with KDSS? Many dealers don't list options and a lot of people I get e-mails back from have no idea.
For those who wanted KDSS but didn't get it
- Thread starter old12valve
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MAST4R
New member
I agree. The handling advantage of KDSS may be greater on paper, but when it comes to cornering in a high center of gravity BoF SUV, an upgraded suspension is plenty good enough. The 4R will never corner like a WRX anyway.
The only argument for KDSS for people who modify their vehicles that I see is the extra flex offroad. However, that again is really a stock vs stock comparison. I do have extra travel with my 6112s/Icon 2.0 combo.
Yes, there is a "buldge" on the driver side frame rail in the middle of the vehicle which contains whatever hydraulic pump the system uses or something like that. Also, the front sway bar is completely different, much larger, and despite all the protestations of some KDSS owners, there is 1" clearance loss at the front of the factory front skid plate with KDSS vs any other model. If they are next to each other on the dealer's lot, you will easily see which has KDSS by looking frontally at the row of parked 4Rs. The KDSS have visibly less clearance at the front edge of the front skid.
Thanks. I have never driven one with KDSS but I have rented two SR5s. I found the roll to be a medium issue and the nose dive to be a minor issue. I also felt it drifted around the road quite a bit in excess of what I would expect from a vehicle that size.
Would skipping KDSS and a decent suspension upgrade solve some or all of those issues? I can certainly find ORPs for days without KDSS so it would make things a ton easier for me.
I have an Off Road without KDSS. I had an Eibach Pro Truck Lift (4 springs & 4 shocks) that cured the body roll and nose dive.
The truck still drifts in it's lane to some extent. I've gotten used to it. You'll go mad trying to make small steering corrections. Seems like there is some play in the steering wheel.
Best to just hold the steering wheel straight and make the occasional steering correction - resisting the temptation to constantly make corrections.
In comparison, I have a 2006 Nissan Frontier has a very stiff steering wheel. Switching back and forth between the Nissan and 4Runner, I find myself making more steering corrections in the Frontier when it's not needed.
MAST4R
New member
It will all depend on your exact suspension setup and your exact preferences and uses but as a rule of thumb any decent suspension will allow you to forgo KDSS on road while being better on higher speed offroad sections (no punishing monster sway bar), have lower maintenance bills if you keep it like I hope I will (20+ years), and make mods easier to execute (fewer things in the way).
In my case, with 6112/Icon 2.0 rear the vehicle is very nice to drive on road as far as an SUV can be nice to drive on road LOL. I will upgrade to 650lb springs because the front is not stiff enough offroad but it is stiff enough on pavement.
I am not at all against KDSS. I love how it works in the GX package. But on a 4R I would rather simply upgrade the suspension. I don't really see the point of having KDSS and also upgrading the suspension though it is commonly done. BY contrast, there is a ton to like about the GX total package (KDSS+suspension) and the present-day GX is not really suited for difficult trails without significant upgrades anyway (like front bumper, to start with).
I’m starting to think I’d be better off with a leveling kit and a suspension upgrade probably end up costing less than KDSS does and be less of a hassle in the long term. Which now makes me wonder do I even need the OffRoad premium.
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I test drove all the configurations before settling on the ORP with KDSS. All drove well, but the day I purchased I wanted to be certain, and so drove the SR5, the SR5P and then the ORP. Driving them all back to back made the choice very obvious (for me).
However, if I had only driven the SR5, I would not have been mad at that purchase. Great trucks.
If the limited didn’t have a body kit and 20 inch wheels, I probably would have gone that route for the ice and snow.
However, if I had only driven the SR5, I would not have been mad at that purchase. Great trucks.
If the limited didn’t have a body kit and 20 inch wheels, I probably would have gone that route for the ice and snow.
I agree on the body kit. It's that front end I love so much and the Limited ruins it for me. I did see that you can retrofit that front end.
MAST4R
New member
I guess it comes down to how much you plan to use the locker and the MTS settings. I use both a great deal, here in the West.
In FL? I have no idea. I wonder if MTS is better enough than A-trac in mud and sand to justify the price tag. OTOH, the manual lever is a plus, too. Does A-trac work in hi range on SR5 models? I do not really use Atrac at all. MTS on sand/mud works in 4H and makes a big difference in terrain that is mildly sandy or muddy but that allows speed.
The truth of the matter is I've never off-road it but I'm starting to get to the age now where I don't take family vacations with the kids anymore because they're grown and I want to go places with my wife off the grid off the beaten path. I sort of feel like if I ever got to the point where the SR5 premium wasn't enough of a four-wheel drive vehicle to do what I need to do then I could just upgrade at that point.
That being said I think that the ride on the base SR5 premium can use some work and it's my understanding that the TRD off-road premium and the TRD pro both drive much differently.
I'm just going to keep it real here though and say that aesthetics matter too. I love the hood scoop fake even though it is.
so with that in mind how does the TRD pro drive compared to the TRD off-road premium with kdss? Is it a softer ride or a firmer ride I would imagine it would be softer on the road.
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MAST4R
New member
Well, that gets a bit subjective. I would not say that the Offroad Premium rides any differently from SR5 unless you have KDSS, in which case it handles much better but the ride may suffer over choppy terrain at speed.
My setup is kinda close to the old Pro and I have also driven the old Pro, with the Bilsteins. The new Pro with the Fox suspension is WAY ahead in that it uses position sensitive bypass shocks. You will not want to lift or modify that suspension and you won't really need to do so either, especially east of Denver.
So if you want to have it all, just get the Pro with the Fox and do not get at all into the mods game because there is absolutely no such thing as "I will only...." Once you start, it never ends. I have never been a mod guy but on my previous vehicle and now this one I am constantly tweaking something. Once you start...there is no end....
Right now, I am about to order 650lb springs for my 6112s, which will be my fourth set of front springs in less than 24 months (stock, Dobinsons, 6112 with 600, 6112 with 650). The Dobinsons were perfect but cannot work with the large dm Bilstein shocks.
A little off topic but not. ...
I think I got the kdss switch figured out. I’ll be messing with it this whole week as my kids are off from school. Being able to have the kdss in soft mode over 12mph is crazy good until you hit a nice turn at speeds or need to make a quick move. So being able to put it on a switch to activate that would be perfect. Basically I have been driving around town dropping my kids off to school and running local errands with the kdss unplugged. It’s 1000% noticeable that the 4Runner can hit certain cross section and dips that normally would jolt the 4Runner pretty hard ( kdss in stiff mode) but with it being off ( soft mode) , it soaks it up. I’m pretty comfortable driving around like this and then having the ability to go stiff with a flip of a switch is win win in my book.
If you plan to go long travel then I’d opt out of kdss. Leveling kit and or mid travel , is get the kdss
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I think I got the kdss switch figured out. I’ll be messing with it this whole week as my kids are off from school. Being able to have the kdss in soft mode over 12mph is crazy good until you hit a nice turn at speeds or need to make a quick move. So being able to put it on a switch to activate that would be perfect. Basically I have been driving around town dropping my kids off to school and running local errands with the kdss unplugged. It’s 1000% noticeable that the 4Runner can hit certain cross section and dips that normally would jolt the 4Runner pretty hard ( kdss in stiff mode) but with it being off ( soft mode) , it soaks it up. I’m pretty comfortable driving around like this and then having the ability to go stiff with a flip of a switch is win win in my book.
If you plan to go long travel then I’d opt out of kdss. Leveling kit and or mid travel , is get the kdss
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SpeedyKevin
New member
Please...tell me more about this switch
EddieV4runnin
New member
I for one love KDSS, I was heading to Downtown LA on Saturday doing about 75 mph on the 101, when some dumb broad decided to permanently stop right in front of me to assess her location. I slammed on the brakes then swerved to the left. I didn’t feel any body roll nor did the stability control warning lights came on. KDSS truly is an amazing system, and I’m happy it’s on my wagon of an SUV.
CharlesNellis
New member
I regretted it at first, but as soon as I upgraded to bilsteins I didn't. Took care of all the body roll and nose diving.
Would I like having it? Sure, but they were pretty rare in my area and I ended up getting an awesome deal on a non kdss trd offroad premium.
Would I like having it? Sure, but they were pretty rare in my area and I ended up getting an awesome deal on a non kdss trd offroad premium.
blackened_offroad
New member
if you live and/or drive in the mountains a lot, the KDSS is mandatory, imo. People who say their trucks with no kdss or no sway bars don't body roll are either used to much worse trucks before or don't live where there's curvy roads. I test drove both in the mountains in CO and it's night and day, IMO.
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