BowJanked
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I'm not to good at that kinda thing. I just enjoy taking pictures
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...got bass?
- Thread starter rigtec
- Start date
I'm not to good at that kinda thing. I just enjoy taking pictures
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rigtec
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I'm not to good at that kinda thing. I just enjoy taking pictures
"I love photo galleries... :artist2: be sure to post them whenever you're building anything interesting!!"
rig
BowJanked
New member
So I am going at it again!! Going with the JL HD1200/1 with 2 12w6's. Lol
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rigtec
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I hope you go with a Sealed alignment enclosure... much more musical! But, the vented box will be louder; if that's all you're after. I've used both and the sealed alignment is king... If you have enough power to compensate for the efficiency losses inherent in the sealed box; which you do! Your set-up will have plenty of apparent volume (in dBs) with the two 12" W6's! Not that it really matters with the HD-1200/1, but if you use Two dual 2ohm W6s then you can run the two V.Cs in series and achieve a 4ohm total impedance. Adding a second one in parallel will drop the total impedance to 2ohms!
rig
BowJanked
New member
I'll post pics when I get it done
so stoked. Going ported always loved the feel. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
rigtec
New member
I'll post pics when I get it done
Ported is good for in the trunk scenarios but an SUV contributes so much cabin gain that it may cause some erratic phase anomalies in the truck, causing the bass to become somewhat unintelligible; this is why I ended up sealing my four Ten W6 box... I had to add more power to compensate for the apparent volume losses due to the inefficiency of a sealed alignment! Good luck, and best to you!
rig
rigtec
New member
Hi audio techies'
I just remembered this thread from three years ago that I started (on another forum) when I was making some changes to my 'Subwoofer System'. I've decided to leave it here because I think there's some valuable intel throughout this thread; even my Low frequency wavefront theory may be found useful to some of you audio system enthusiasts! It was a lot of fun, gathering information, studying and preparing to start the work... hope you will find benefit in some of my research here: Thanks Gurus, for all your "Low-end" help! - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video Discussion Forum
'Best to you all'! rig
I just remembered this thread from three years ago that I started (on another forum) when I was making some changes to my 'Subwoofer System'. I've decided to leave it here because I think there's some valuable intel throughout this thread; even my Low frequency wavefront theory may be found useful to some of you audio system enthusiasts! It was a lot of fun, gathering information, studying and preparing to start the work... hope you will find benefit in some of my research here: Thanks Gurus, for all your "Low-end" help! - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video Discussion Forum
'Best to you all'! rig
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BowJanked
New member
So after a bit running the JL12w6v3 sounds amazing just doesn't have the SPL that I'd imagine for a sub in its price class 
. Not sure what I'm gonna do now. [MENTION=83083]rigtec[/MENTION] if you may have any ideas or anyone for that matter. Thanks
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. Not sure what I'm gonna do now. [MENTION=83083]rigtec[/MENTION] if you may have any ideas or anyone for that matter. ThanksSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
rigtec
New member
So after a bit running the JL12w6v3 sounds amazing just doesn't have the SPL that I'd imagine for a sub in its price class
Hey Corey,
Your build looks quite substantial and done 'The Right way' by ALL standards! If you're having trouble with SPL it's likely due to an improperly adjusted 'Gain setting' because the equipment is second to none! How did you set-up your gain sensitivity e.g., Using JL's set-up instructions, by ear, or did you just wire it and turn it on? I'm certain that your trouble is in the gain set-up!
rig
BowJanked
New member
Done to the exact specs as JL says to.
Sub tuned at 33hz at 34.6V
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rigtec
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Were you using this as a template for the : JL Audio » header » Support » Tutorials » Tutorial: Input Sensitivity (Gain) Setting?
BowJanked
New member
I have the XD600/1v2
http://mediacdn.jlaudio.com/media/mfg/9013/media_document/live_1/XD600_1v2_MAN.pdf?1398117828
Step by step did it as specified.
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rigtec
New member
Okay here's what we'll do... Forget about JL's directions for now; I use another method anyway. First, turn the amplifier's gain control "all the way down" (counter clockwise). Now find a piece of music in your collection that's represents what type of music that you like to listen to; nothing with any exaggerated bass track e.g., Rapp, Hip-Hop, Reggae... nor anything that the bass is barely audible in the track e.g., classical, opera... Okay, now with the sub's speakers connected, adjust the HU's Treble & Mid settings to the middle position: (-llll-l-llll+) and for the bass it should look like this (-llll-0-llll+); The bass is all the way in the negative!
Now turn the HU's volume control "3/4 of the way up" which has a numeric value of 42! Check and make sure that your LOC i.e. Line Output Converter is properly set; Mine is set to three quarters of it's maximum level. Now from zero, using the amp's Gain control, begin to increase the bass level just until the bass begins to dominate the sound coming the other speakers (we're doing this so that you'll have slightly more bass gain than you will actually ever need no matter what choice of music you're listening to)!
NOTE: It's 'EXTREMELY' important that you're feeding the mono-block enough voltage from the HU's Left and Right FRONT speaker channels to drive the amp to it's full rated output; if you're not connecting both the left and the right FRONT speaker channels your amp can only produce Half of it's full rated output! BTW: that amplifier has a selector switch on it's front control panel (Low & High); The high setting is there just in case you need to use the speaker out wires from a very high wattage HU i.e., (50W each channel or more!); but assumming that you're still using the stock HU, this feature does not apply!
And then there's the low level input switch mode, which is to be used to accommodate an RCA low voltage line signal outputs from the HU's pre-amp stages; which is measured in mA (for milliamps) less than one volt. You will want to select that option because of the very low power levels that the stock 'Panasonic' hu produces! (I'll bet that's your problem!) IMPORTANT: If you're not using a 'Remote bass level volume control' near the driver seat be sure to install one because all program material is very different, and so the sub's gain level is constantly in need of adjustment; it's impossible to find one setting that will work on every piece of music program at all volume levels.
You can either use (if available) the JL Audio's 'integrated' remote level control phone jack on the amp's control panel (Left photo) https://www.amazon.com/JL-Audio-HD-...&sr=8-2&keywords=jl+audio+remote+bass+control, or you can use what I've had to use with my Alpine PDX-M12 Series mono-block subwoofer amp; which is a conventional line level voltage control like the one on the right:https://www.amazon.com/Skar-Audio-G...14&sr=1-11&keywords=remote+bass+level+control
Corey... I'm certain that the problem is only that the amp is being starved for proper program signal; either you're not combining both the L & R channels, in which case you're only utilizing one half of the needed signal, or, the LOC is not adjusted properly and trimmed back too much: If you look at the LOC device closely you'll see two holes; that's where the two adjustment potentiometers are located. Simply insert a small pocket flathead screwdriver and turn the two screwheads clockwise to the three quarter position to increase the signal feeding the power amp. Please be sure to let me know how you make out with this so we can officially cross this off as a Problem solved file!
Best to you'!
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BowJanked
New member
Okay here's what we'll do... Forget about JL's directions for now; I use another method anyway. First, turn the amplifier's gain control "all the way down" (counter clockwise). Now find a piece of music in your collection that's represents what type of music that you like to listen to; nothing with any exaggerated bass track e.g., Rapp, Hip-Hop, Reggae... nor anything that the bass is barely audible in the track e.g., classical, opera... Okay, now with the sub's speakers connected, adjust the HU's Treble & Mid settings to the middle position: (-llll-l-llll+) and for the bass it should look like this (-llll-0-llll+); The bass is all the way in the negative!
Now turn the HU's volume control "3/4 of the way up" which has a numeric value of 42! Check and make sure that your LOC i.e. Line Output Converter is properly set; Mine is set to three quarters of it's maximum level. Now from zero, using the amp's Gain control, begin to increase the bass level just until the bass begins to dominate the sound coming the other speakers (we're doing this so that you'll have slightly more bass gain than you will actually ever need no matter what choice of music you're listening to)!
NOTE: It's 'EXTREMELY' important that you're feeding the mono-block enough voltage from the HU's Left and Right FRONT speaker channels to drive the amp to it's full rated output; if you're not connecting both the left and the right FRONT speaker channels your amp can only produce Half of it's full rated output! BTW: that amplifier has a selector switch on it's front control panel (Low & High); The high setting is there just in case you need to use the speaker out wires from a very high wattage HU i.e., (50W each channel or more!); but assumming that you're still using the stock HU, this feature does not apply!
And then there's the low level input switch mode, which is to be used to accommodate an RCA low voltage line signal outputs from the HU's pre-amp stages; which is measured in mA (for milliamps) less than one volt. You will want to select that option because of the very low power levels that the stock 'Panasonic' hu produces! (I'll bet that's your problem!) IMPORTANT: If you're not using a 'Remote bass level volume control' near the driver seat be sure to install one because all program material is very different, and so the sub's gain level is constantly in need of adjustment; it's impossible to find one setting that will work on every piece of music program at all volume levels.
You can either use (if available) the JL Audio's 'integrated' remote level control phone jack on the amp's control panel (Left) https://www.amazon.com/JL-Audio-HD-...&sr=8-2&keywords=jl+audio+remote+bass+control, or you can use what I've had to use with my Alpine PDX-M12 Series mono-block subwoofer amp; which is a conventional line level voltage control like the one on the right:https://www.amazon.com/Skar-Audio-G...14&sr=1-11&keywords=remote+bass+level+control
Corey... I'm certain that the problem is only that the amp is being starved for proper program signal; either you're not combining both the L & R channels, in which case you're only utilizing one half of the needed signal, or, the LOC is not adjusted properly and trimmed back too much: If you look at the LOC device closely you'll see two holes; that's where the two adjustment potentiometers are located. Simply insert a small pocket flathead screwdriver and turn the two screwheads clockwise to the three quarter position to increase the signal feeding the power amp. Please be sure to let me know how you make out with this so we can officially cross this off as a Problem solved file!
Best to you'!
#1 with this amp I do not use a LOC the amp does itself.
#2 the signal I'm using from both R+L rear speakers.
#3 I set the amp the exact way you stated to get the V that JL specified.
The sub sounds amazing just does not have the punch in the chest I was hoping for. May need to go to a 15" sundown sub in another custom box.
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Just cause I like to get in the middle of these conversations :dance:
If you are using the stock head unit and are not using a signal controller with some type of bass restoration processing, there are certain frequencies that you might lose as you turn up the head unit.
[MENTION=118444]flyinhawaiian01[/MENTION] did some extensive testing with frequencies and found a severe dropout at low frequencies at high volumes, presumable a protection built in to keep from damaging the stock speakers.
If the suggestions that [MENTION=83083]rigtec[/MENTION] is giving aren't helping, that may be something to look into. Or maybe you just need 3 more woofers :fear:
If you are using the stock head unit and are not using a signal controller with some type of bass restoration processing, there are certain frequencies that you might lose as you turn up the head unit.
[MENTION=118444]flyinhawaiian01[/MENTION] did some extensive testing with frequencies and found a severe dropout at low frequencies at high volumes, presumable a protection built in to keep from damaging the stock speakers.
If the suggestions that [MENTION=83083]rigtec[/MENTION] is giving aren't helping, that may be something to look into. Or maybe you just need 3 more woofers :fear:
rigtec
New member
I'm assuming you're using the LOW input setting on the amp?
When you asked me for my thoughts on why you're not getting a proper output from your subwoofer system, I advised you based on the things that I saw as being problematic in your set-up. There was a reason that I gave you specific detail as to setting up this system structure (I have my system set-up that way)... The front driver and passenger seats are much closer to the four front speakers (Tweeters and Mids) and so the sub needs to get it's signal from the HU's front channels to be able to keep up with what the front position listeners are hearing; the rear speakers (IMHO) are difficult to hear from the front listing positionings, so the subwoofer' gain will be much stronger using the HU's front channels .
Based on my previous observations that statement isn't true!
A 12' driver has one third more surface area than two tens, so adding a 15" will not resolve your problem because a lack of S.A. isn't your problem! Listen Corey... you've already had about three or four different subs in that truck and none have worked out. My objective is to eradicate the BIG RED FLAG issues and get to the bottom of what the problems are; I'm not guessing at this (and certainly not at your expense, god forbid), but what I know will happen if certain rules are not followed.
Just one more thing that I would like to mention: The reason that I said to you that the 'Sealed box is king' in an SUV cabin is because of the great potential for phase anomalies to be created in a vehicle that has a hyper-resonant environment already (a catastrophic echo chamber waiting for an opportunity to reinterpret the true sound)... got to be careful there! So I recommended that you go with a sealed cabinet (1) because the group delay inherent in a reflex cab; though it is far more efficient and will give far more output, I knew that the group delay would become a major factor in the 4R; which was why I had to change my four ten BR (Bass reflex/vented) cabinet into a IB (Infinite baffle/sealed) cabinet.
And (2) The sealed box will produce far more punch (High transient Impact) because the driver is subject to the tight, springy air behind the cone; so it's able to respond to those hard transients 'instantaneously' as compared to a bass reflex enclosure which is slow and comes with it's own delay! Please don't get me wrong, I'm here to help you or anyone else who asks for help with the areas that I consider myself 'competent', but if I provide the information and they choose to go a different way with it, I don't take that personally, but wish them the very best none the less! I hope you will read this audio essay 'A Second time' because it discusses (not too long ago in '13) a time when I was in your shoes, and what I had to do to correct the problems: Thanks Gurus, for all your "Low-end" help! - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video Discussion Forum
Best to you Corey, Greg!
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jgs9455
New member
Hey everyone, just pickedup my 2016 SR5 Premium today with Nav but no JBL. I'd like to try and reuse the subwoofer and sub amp I had in my 2000 4R.
Hertz 10" HX 250D
Arc Audio XDi600.1
1. I've learned that I probably need a Audio Control LC2i line out converter.
2. I'll need to tap into the rear stereo speakers to send a full range input to the LC2i. The best place to do this is the drivers side door sill or rear passenger dor sill?? I hate cutting/splicing into my factory wires
3. I've seen confusing wiring diagrams but what color wires am I looking for?
4. I'll need to run power from the battery to the LC2i and the amplifier down door sill. This won't cause noise right nect to speaker wires?
5. The LC2i can sense a speaker signal and then remote signal to turn on the amplifier.
TIA!
Hertz 10" HX 250D
Arc Audio XDi600.1
1. I've learned that I probably need a Audio Control LC2i line out converter.
2. I'll need to tap into the rear stereo speakers to send a full range input to the LC2i. The best place to do this is the drivers side door sill or rear passenger dor sill?? I hate cutting/splicing into my factory wires
3. I've seen confusing wiring diagrams but what color wires am I looking for?
4. I'll need to run power from the battery to the LC2i and the amplifier down door sill. This won't cause noise right nect to speaker wires?
5. The LC2i can sense a speaker signal and then remote signal to turn on the amplifier.
TIA!
