Hard Finding C Range Tires

[bluecollarjock]

Hi,
Still browsing for tires as at some point this year I need new shoes. But I have 265/70-17 BFG ATs in C range and it seems they do not make them anymore. Nearly every option in this size seems either P or E. P rated threads talk about not being good for airing down and wheeling, E rated threads can go either way guys say they are fine others say they are stiff as boards. Plus they are heavier.

If I switch to 16" rim (I do like those black FJ trail special rims), it does not seem options are much better in 265/75-16.

I used to love aggressive mud tires mainly because I was an east coast mud guy, as well young and they looked cool. They still look cool, but my experience with mud tires is them being worse in rain, snow, wearing out in half the time of an AT, worse mpg, and a sound that was once cool to me hearing knobbies on the road is now annoying hah. I like a more quiet AT.

Kelly Safari makes a TSR and Cooper S/T both are C range but not very popular it seems and not available at many stores. And they do seem to border on being more a mud tread, and the TSR is super heavy.

I know there are threads on this....so I hope I do not get flamed....just wondering why there seem to be so little tire options in the C or D range in the 32" size. Maybe I will just need to try the Kelly or Safari.

Would love to hear opinions...I do mainly highway driving, but do want to trail the 4runner more and since I am in Cali there will be rocks and airing down.

Thanks

 

[Canazes9]

Hi,
Still browsing for tires as at some point this year I need new shoes. But I have 265/70-17 BFG ATs in C range and it seems they do not make them anymore. Nearly every option in this size seems either P or E. P rated threads talk about not being good for airing down and wheeling, E rated threads can go either way guys say they are fine others say they are stiff as boards. Plus they are heavier.

If I switch to 16" rim (I do like those black FJ trail special rims), it does not seem options are much better in 265/75-16.

I used to love aggressive mud tires mainly because I was an east coast mud guy, as well young and they looked cool. They still look cool, but my experience with mud tires is them being worse in rain, snow, wearing out in half the time of an AT, worse mpg, and a sound that was once cool to me hearing knobbies on the road is now annoying hah. I like a more quiet AT.

Kelly Safari makes a TSR and Cooper S/T both are C range but not very popular it seems and not available at many stores. And they do seem to border on being more a mud tread, and the TSR is super heavy.

I know there are threads on this....so I hope I do not get flamed....just wondering why there seem to be so little tire options in the C or D range in the 32" size. Maybe I will just need to try the Kelly or Safari.

Would love to hear opinions...I do mainly highway driving, but do want to trail the 4runner more and since I am in Cali there will be rocks and airing down.

Thanks

I'm an E tire guy and love them - Really think it would be wise for you try a set for yourself before you write them off. I don't find them excessively stiff at all.

Having said that, have you looked at the Cooper A/T3's ? It's a less aggressive, quiet ridding AT with great on and off road performance (except deep mud). They are available in C Range in both 265/75r16 and 265/70r17. Several members are here are running this tire and have a lot of good things to say about it.

David

 

[Canazes9]

May be a more aggressive tread than u want, but the Goodyear Duratrac also has a great reputation and is available in load range C in those sizes.

David

 

[JB.]

Hi,
But I have 265/70-17 BFG ATs in C range and it seems they do not make them anymore. Nearly every option in this size seems either P or E. E rated threads can go either way guys say they are fine others say they are stiff as boards. Plus they are heavier.

I like a more quiet AT.

....just wondering why there seem to be so little tire options in the C or D range in the 32" size.

Would love to hear opinions...I do mainly highway driving, but do want to trail the 4runner more and since I am in Cali there will be rocks and airing down.

Thanks

This 46lb Load E tire might fit your purpose. It replaced BFG AT Load C and I'm very happy with it. (The author is friggin wordy. Might work better to read it backwards)

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/engin...es/89432-ongoing-review-revo-2-lt-load-e.html

 

[bluecollarjock]

Thanks guys! I will check out the Revo for sure, had them on a Jeep WJ of mine before. I never off roaded it but they were fine on the street and that write up of them seems ok, and that is as light as a C range tire.

Cooper AT3 seem very mild, almost highway looking tire. There is a Cooper ATP Discount Tire sells that seems more aggressive but its only E range.

Dura Tracs do seem like a great AT tread and look cool too for what that is worth, but on the Jeep forums guys split the sidewalls on them frequently. Numerous threads on those tires not holding up against rocks. So that scares me away from those tires is too many bad stories and a high price tag.

Well now it seems I will be looking at Kelly Safari TSR, Cooper S/T, and the Revo E range.

 

[TNRunner99]

I was an east coast mud guy

Didn't know we were called such a thing. Maybe a southern mud guy. haha

Can you not get BFG AT's in load range D anymore? I still have a set and they have been great, rode smooth for years. They are ready to be retired now though.

 

[bluecollarjock]

I grew up in Ohio and Western PA, and all the wheeling we did was black muck or deep rutted woods driving. I had a K5 Blazer with 4 speed granny low, and lots of rocking and high wheel speed diving into big mud holes, stream crossings, etc. Was so much fun...BUT my gosh we broke things all the time, u-joints and brakes wore out fast. frames and floorboards rotted quicker than the drivetrain was lasting, etc. So if I ever do move back east, I will keep my Jeep TJ and 4runner for hunting and trails, and buy me a $4k old full size American truck, chop the fenders and throw on some mudders and just beat on it. Mud and woods with mud is fun and I love it, just destroys vehicles at least up north where they also see snow and salt.

On BFG website the C and D range are gone, you can get 285s in D range but I think they list over $300k. If it came down to $300k per tire or $190 per tire for Revo or Kelly Safari TSR I would have to to with the under $200 tires.

Too bad the Rugged Terrain is only P or E, I would not mind trying that. I have been an MT guy or aggressive AT guy, but this time around am seeing if I can be "more mature" haha and get a tire that might ride better on the road and get better mpg and longer wear, especially since I never go off roading as much as I daydream I will. And my Jeep is set up with lockers, winch, armor, so if I was going to do harder trails I have it. The 4runner is such a nice vehicle I would love to road trip and explore more, and if tires like the Revo can manage the road better and still do mild trails, I want to consider them. I am hoping to get a skid and sliders so I can try some mild trails but no mud out here so mild ATs could still do the trick.

 

[bluecollarjock]

My gosh JB, they were right you took your tire shopping serious. That other thread is pretty darn thorough. Wish I had that kind of motivation for tire shopping.

15" rims seem like the best bet for tire availability, but 15" rims are for the old 4x4s anymore so we are forced to have limited tires in C or D range.

If you know of anymore E range tires that are light please enlighten me. The Kelly Safari TSR 265/70-17 are I think 54lbs even in C range, so they are heavy. Cooper S/T are 47 lbs.

Only thing perhaps with the Revo as you show those pictures is them picking up rocks....I doubt I would be as patient as you to be cleaning out my tires all the time after wheeling! Have you done any rock climbing in them?

 

[JB.]

Only thing perhaps with the Revo as you show those pictures is them picking up rocks....I doubt I would be as patient as you to be cleaning out my tires all the time after wheeling! Have you done any rock climbing in them?

To the extent it can be done in a 4th gen with stock suspension, yes, plenty.

I don't think the rock retention is as bad as it may appear from my documentation of it. I'd guess that most ATs would produce more pebbles than expected under the same scrutiny. I remember seeing a used set of Duratracs that had quite a few pebbles in the treads.

 

[bluecollarjock]

But even with getting back at highway speeds it does not throw them out?

Seems like you wheel on a regular basis, more than I ever will unless I find some more time. Which could happen soon.

To be honest I probably never would be wheeling hard enough to need more than the Revo unless I move away from LA sometime and get to hit more mud.

I was loving the looks and reviews of the Kelly TSR, but 54 pounds sounds heavy....maybe I am back to considering the Cooper S/T because it is light but aggressive, and the Revo in E. Too bad the Cooper ATP did not come in C or D, I cannot fight the weight of it anywhere, but it looks nice. Sad to admit although I am finally over the mud tire desires, I still want something that looks somewhat "cool" and aggressive hah. But I know the Revo's were super quiet on my Jeep WJ. Imagine I would like the ride and mpg compared to the BFG ATs I have now. They are C range, plenty of tread, but have dry rotting. So if I do get my new clutch, sliders and skids I do not want to wheel with dry rotted tires.

 

[JB.]

But even with getting back at highway speeds it does not throw them out?

Not in any way that draws my attention.

 

[bluecollarjock]

I'm an E tire guy and love them - Really think it would be wise for you try a set for yourself before you write them off. I don't find them excessively stiff at all.

Having said that, have you looked at the Cooper A/T3's ? It's a less aggressive, quiet ridding AT with great on and off road performance (except deep mud). They are available in C Range in both 265/75r16 and 265/70r17. Several members are here are running this tire and have a lot of good things to say about it.

David

Canazes9 what tires are you running?

 

[bluecollarjock]

I never thought to check the weight of the E range tires....since the General Grabber AT2 is cheap at $170 (only $157 in 265/75-16 if I did change rims), I looked it up in 265/70-17 E and its 48.5 pounds....

Hmmm....so maybe more of these E range tires are comparable in weight to the old C BFG tires...

JB you may have opened my eyes to consider more options, and Bridgestone should give you a darn free set of tires for all the guys you probably influenced to get a set!

 

[Canazes9]

Canazes9 what tires are you running?

I'm running Mickey Thompson MTZ's on my wife's 4runner and my Tacoma. E rated, heavily siped MT tire. Prob the quietest MT tire I've ever run. Fantastic traction on the trail and on the street.

Not pushing 'me, I know they're not what you're looking for....





Did pretty darn good here also!




David

 

[bluecollarjock]

No I love those things....the kid in me loves them every time I see them....a Jeep buddy of mine has 35s on his TJ and he drove it from Cali to PA and claims they are quiet (but he is nearly 20 years younger than me so maybe has not gotten to point where I am with liking more quiet tires).

Those look fantastic. They are a bit expensive and heavier, but if I knew I had no cash problems and was going to have anotehr street vehicle I would pounce on them.

I have a TJ Rubican and this 4runner. No room for more parking. If I leave LA eventually and get a driveway and more parking, most likely I will buy a new or newer pickup for commuting and Church on Sundays. Then I will throw mud tires on the 4runner.

Good to know you feel the E rated tire and one that is heavier with an MT tread are not that bad.

I have been dead set on C range for months as I have been pondering this, but just posting this thread, reading JB thread and being open to more feedback has me thinking I may end up with E range. I might even try to go cheap like those Generals and see how they do. I tend to like getting more name brand expensive parts for my Jeep, but is it always really worth it I do not know. Maybe some $150 E ATs from General will do what I need or Revos.

 

[Canazes9]

I've had Revo's and they are very good tires. I almost suggested them, but they weren't't C rated and I don't put the research time into tires that [MENTION=2798]JB.[/MENTION] does!

For my needs, I was willing to put up with a little more noise for some better off road traction. I was impressed with just how well the Revo's did on my '07 Tacoma - more traction off road than I expected, highway ride was phenomenal!

David

 

[bluecollarjock]

I've had Revo's and they are very good tires. I almost suggested them, but they weren't't C rated and I don't put the research time into tires that [MENTION=2798]JB.[/MENTION] does!

For my needs, I was willing to put up with a little more noise for some better off road traction. I was impressed with just how well the Revo's did on my '07 Tacoma - more traction off road than I expected, highway ride was phenomenal!

David

Patiently awaiting a big decision in my medical retirement case....if and when my money gets turned back on, will be pulling the trigger on some tires. Now I am more open minded to a few options. Also tempted for 16" rims, either the TRD black FJ Trail Edition rims or some old school black Outlaw IIs from Rebel Racing. Maybe I could recoup some of the costs by selling my Tundra rims with BFG ATs with good tread left.

Then it will be on to possibly a Marlin heavy duty clutch, and sliders and skids (tempted to do both from Savage or maybe a Budbuilt skid and sliders from whomever). Then I will be ready to wheel this bad boy finally! I bought it as a commuter for grad school since it was an 80 mile round trip, and my Jeep Rubicon with armor, winch, etc was like $150 week in gas the first few weeks of grad school yikes. So I sold a cherry lifted 87 shortbed GMC, and the 4runner was my first foreign 4x4 ever...and I bought it as a "practical commuter" with a 3" lift and rear locker haha, knowing I wanted to wheel it once grad school was over!

I think I will eye ball the Revo, General Grabber AT2 (since its light even in E load and cheap), maybe still toy with Cooper S/T, and I did love the look and reviews on the Kelly Safari TSR but 54 pounds for C range seems heavy. That is a solid 7 pounds per wheel more, which sounds like a lot to me despite me not really having a clue. If weight was not a factor I might go with some black steelies but they probably add a chunk of change as well.

Thanks so much for the input guys. Who knows if I go E range maybe I will not notice anything, I am pushing 40 years old and never owned a car in my life. The only thing I have driven is 4x4s, primarily full size American trucks with V8s, Jeep TJs with lifts, etc. So I am used to driving rougher riding vehicles. The 4runner is actually a luxury vehicle even with a 5 speed and a lift compared to a Jeep!

 

[WXman]

The Kelly Safari TSR, Goodyear Duratrac, Fierce Attitude MT, and Goodyear Wrangler Authority are all the same carcass with different tread design. The load range C tires in all of these brands will run about 45 lbs. or so. They are very lightweight for their size.

You will be surprised at how much gasoline you will save by running P or LT C tires. The P tires have more load carrying ability and the same sidewall thickness for less money...but the LT C has deeper tread and lasts longer. So pick depending on your needs.

I don't recommend buying LT E unless you are absolutely dead set on a particular tire and it's only available in LT E. Contrary to popular opinion, there is a huge difference in ride quality and efficiency between C and E tires.

 

[bluecollarjock]

The Kelly Safari TSR, Goodyear Duratrac, Fierce Attitude MT, and Goodyear Wrangler Authority are all the same carcass with different tread design. The load range C tires in all of these brands will run about 45 lbs. or so. They are very lightweight for their size.

You will be surprised at how much gasoline you will save by running P or LT C tires. The P tires have more load carrying ability and the same sidewall thickness for less money...but the LT C has deeper tread and lasts longer. So pick depending on your needs.

I don't recommend buying LT E unless you are absolutely dead set on a particular tire and it's only available in LT E. Contrary to popular opinion, there is a huge difference in ride quality and efficiency between C and E tires.

Well these are the kinds of things that have made this tire browsing the past few months confusing. The Kelly Safari TSR is 54lbs actually, so its darn heavy for a C load tire. I cannot find the weight, I think I had to email them but it was mid 50s. P rated I thought was NOT for load carrying capacity, and the tread depth thing about E tires I thought was debunked.

There really are no C load tires in an aggressive All Terrain in these sizes. Just P or E. Kelly Safari TSR and Cooper S/T are the only ones I can find, BFG AT has discontinued their C and D range in these sizes.

The Cooper is light, so might be a go, but I do wonder why its not a more popular tire as its affordable and aggressive. Not so sure how good its road manners might be though as it leans more towards a mudder. The Kelly is getting good reviews in the magazines lately, but is heavy. Even the Toyota 4x4 Owner magazine did a review and commented on how the 285 is as heavy as most 35" tires. But reviews still good as far as on road and off.

If the sidewall is same as the Dura Trac that confuses me, as Jeep forums there are threads full of stories of guys with same problem, airing down and hitting rocks or trees they easily puncture sidewalls. Reviews are limited on the Authority, but I did see those once and thought they looked cool so did some digging and found reviews they supposedly have a thin sidewall. There is a write up on Pirate 4x4 about those tires handling like garbage on the highway, chunking, and over all being pretty lame. That Fierce tire looks cool, but I almost wonder if thats the purpose of the design and name is to attract teenagers to buy them, just eye balling them looks like they might be not the greatest highway tire.

Again I am no mechanic, I only drive 4x4s and daydream of 4 wheeling more than I actually do...but I was always under the impression P rated tires are just asking for trouble if you air down and hit the woods. I am fine with putting P rated tires on my dad's trucks for snow driving and deer hunting trips, but with any chance I might be going in 4 low with the rear locked and airing down tires I thought C load or higher is safer. God forbid I am miles back into Big Bear wheeling with a bunch of folks and pop a tire or two, and there are stories on the Jeep forums of guys blowing out more than one P rated tire or Dura Trac on the same wheeling trip.

What this thread has opened my eyes to, is that some of these E range tires like the Revo and Grabber AT2 are just a light as C range tires. Which might make the mpg good, and if E range means sidewall is tougher than might be better insurance off road.

If the Kelly Safari TSR was only 45lbs I think its affordable, good looking, and getting good reviews so I would be going for it. I did like the Cooper S/T as well, but not sure how its road manners will be 10k-20k down the road.

So I do not want an E range, never set out to get them, but even if I swapped rims to 16" the selection is just really limited. If I come into some money I am half tempted to grab some of those black TRD FJ rims, seems like they would be a tad wider and look bad a$$, and I initially thought it might open up tire choices but it does not seem so. C and D range tires seem to be for the 15" rim oldie but goodie trucks.

 

[JB.]

Contrary to popular opinion, there is a huge difference in ride quality and efficiency between C and E tires.

It's good to hear that popular opinion has finally reversed. If it has, it's progress.

The main issue between C and E is weight. Take that out of the equation and efficiency normally doesn't change much, and C vs E, by itself, makes very little difference in ride harshness.