HID Lights

Foques said:
oh right, because everyone should be following your exact steps, just like you want them to take them... I guess I missed the memo..:toilet3:
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I think wat philsey's trying to say is, putting HID kits into the factory fog lamp housing is actually detrimental to the housing itself. It will burn hotter and I've personally seen the reflector backing (the silver part) melt off. HID bulbs are longer and are very close to the lens on most factory fog lamps. I've even seen some that have "bubbled" the lense itself (GM TRUCKS).

I personally have HID 3k in the factory fog lamp housings and I know it will destroy them reasonable quicker than having regular incandecent bulbs. But, admittedly, I was going for a "look". Otherwise, I wouldn't have spent so much money on the retrofit for my headlamps to have some stoopid halos that change color when I want them to.

We all like things the way WE want them.

I think everyone here should make their truck look like mine, cuz it's bad ass!!!:jk:
 
NHinAK said:
HID's belong in a projector, not a reflector. There are tons of kits on the market that are plug n' play. Most are complete crap though in terms of compont reliability and quality. Truly a "buyer beware" market. My opinion: save your money for something else.
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No, this is incorrect. Look up a 2005 Subaru STi. HIDs in a reflector housing. Many others out there, that is just one that I know off hand because I owned the vehicle. Damn I get tired of these threads and people puking out information as fact that they have only got from others puking information as fact.
 
Ducmonsta said:
I think wat philsey's trying to say is, putting HID kits into the factory fog lamp housing is actually detrimental to the housing itself. It will burn hotter and I've personally seen the reflector backing (the silver part) melt off. HID bulbs are longer and are very close to the lens on most factory fog lamps. I've even seen some that have "bubbled" the lense itself (GM TRUCKS).

I personally have HID 3k in the factory fog lamp housings and I know it will destroy them reasonable quicker than having regular incandecent bulbs. But, admittedly, I was going for a "look". Otherwise, I wouldn't have spent so much money on the retrofit for my headlamps to have some stoopid halos that change color when I want them to.

We all like things the way WE want them.

I think everyone here should make their truck look like mine, cuz it's bad ass!!!:jk:
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Lets get one thing out of the way before too many people start taking it as wisdom. HID's do not in any way put out more heat than halogen. It is simple physics. An equivalent watt HID and Halogen have different proportions of heat output and visible light output.

I quote:

"High-intensity discharge lamps (HID lamps) are a type of electrical lamp which produces light by means of an electric arc between tungsten electrodes housed inside a translucent or transparent fused quartz or fused alumina arc tube. This tube is filled with both gas and metal salts. The gas facilitates the arc's initial strike. Once the arc is started, it heats and evaporates the metal salts forming a plasma, which greatly increases the intensity of light produced by the arc and reduces its power consumption. High-intensity discharge lamps are a type of arc lamp.

High-intensity discharge (HID) lamps make more visible light per unit of electric power consumed than fluorescent and incandescent lamps since a greater proportion of their radiation is visible light as opposed to heat."


Plenty of people run 55watt HID's with no problem whatsoever. Heck, plenty of people run 100watt halogens which you can darn near cook on and never have a problem. In the past there were issues with the higher wattage halogen bulbs straining the OEM electrical system and causing damage to the wiring harness etc. IN MOST CASES, modern cars can handle the increased load.

On the other hand, the HID bulb capsule can be slightly longer in some cases and come closer to the headlight lens and / or bulb shield which could in theory cause an issue, although it is highly unlikely. The reality of it is, in teh case of OEM halogen headlight bulbs, the HID bulb is not that much longer:

See here:
imagesCAMASDKD.jpg~original


In the case of fog lights or lights that use the little bulbs like the H3, the HID capsule is much longer and could approach the front lens and potentially cause some heat related damage, simply due to the proximity, not increased output.

See here:

foglight_hid_07.jpg~original
 
brockeverly said:
No, this is incorrect. Look up a 2005 Subaru STi. HIDs in a reflector housing. Many others out there, that is just one that I know off hand because I owned the vehicle. Damn I get tired of these threads and people puking out information as fact that they have only got from others puking information as fact.
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I agree sir.
 
Foques said:
Duc, I know what he says.. I also know the type of people he is.. gotta be an IL thing.. I'm that way to an extent myself.

However, his "expert" opinion needs not to be pushed down people's throats. I am not new to HID components.. after installing well over several dozens, working closely with major sales offices (I worked very closely with two stores), I know what to expect from HID, what temperature to light relationship is, what wattage i'm looking for.

Plan for now is to get HIDs installed, align headlights, and then, possibly, get projectors...

There is no way that i'm spending ~1200 on a retrofit right now - I need a third camera body. ;)
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Check out The Retrofit Source. That is where I bought my kit, it was less than $300. I did the install myself, but it was easy. There are many vids and great install instructions on how to do it. The new Morimoto Mini's allow you to install in factory housing and are actually pretty simple. Not nearly as involved as using Acura or Honda factory projectors.

Just saying you can get it done for a lot less than $1200. They turn out exactly the same, if you take your time and follow the lead and instructions that others have done. Nothing wrong with putting HID's in either. That is what I did before I retrofitted with projectors and I was very happy. I am happier with projectors but nothing wrong with just slapping in some HID's. As long as they are aimed properly you will not blind anyone and you will be happy with the results.

Its funny how some people out there feel like its there right to tell people what they can and can't do to their own vehicles. Its yours man, do whatever the hell you want to it....isn't that the beauty of the good of USofA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
^
Hey chief, I absolutely hear that. Of many things in the car world, retrofits never worked out well for me when I would do them myself. :) so I may just have to get someone to do it. Plan is long term no matter what since I want to paint headlights inside as well.
do you happen to have links to your retrofit? i'm really curious to check it out.
 
Foques said:
^
Hey chief, I absolutely hear that. Of many things in the car world, retrofits never worked out well for me when I would do them myself. :) so I may just have to get someone to do it. Plan is long term no matter what since I want to paint headlights inside as well.
do you happen to have links to your retrofit? i'm really curious to check it out.
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I dont. I am bad about taking pics when I do the work. I always say before I start I am going to document it but I never do. I can take some pics though and post up so you can see the final product and here is a link from TRS on installing on those Morimotos.


Helpful information on upgrading headlights from The Retrofit Source Inc

I bought the D2S kit I believe. They are super helpful and have no problems answering questions about what would be the best/easiest kit to install in our 4runners.
 
I've cleaned the thread, even though I shouldn't have to over such a stupid fight. Please let it go or go argue on a HID forum. :ybrick:
 
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CookieRoe said:
Fair question.

Here are all your posts on this thread. I still see "no crime" that necessitates you flying off the handle. Foques, you need to chill dude. If you don't agree with what others are saying, fine. State you case and we will all debate. That's what a forum is for. If others can OBJECTIVELY state their case (and they have), then the debate is over. You come across as a crying 12 year old who insists he is correct. Again, if you don't accept others information, then say "fine, I'm getting the kit b/c I can't afford it" Saving grace here is you recognize that retros are the way to go (leads me to believe). That much is fine. Retros are expensive, I understand why many don't go this route. Attitude is everyone man.

I honestly think a "sticky" or tutorial on HID lighting would be useful to educate and indirectly avoid this kind of threads that go out of control. I'm sure we scared off the OP (or he is laughing his @ss off)
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Foques said:
let me break it down to you..
1) It is internet. sarcasm is everywhere.
2) I know exactly what I am looking at with the temperatures/available light (as stated in one of the comments you so graciously, yet needlessly quoted).
3) I use a general rule of "don't tell me what to do, and I won't tell you where you can shove it", unless a person speaking actually shows the knowledge of the subject.
4) I cannot stand when people run their mouth barely having any experience on the subject, yet try to make everyone take their words as the law.
5) If you have nothing useful to say ON TOPIC, then how about you'll either STFU or PM me if you want me to tell you off, eh?


now, I really do think a mod needs to clean up this thread.
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I agree Foques is full or sarcasm and is not staying on TOPIC and is attacking just about everyone. Foques will be banned for 10 days. Then it is up to him what he wants to do.
 
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Toyota for some reason tends to use both reflector and projector types. 07 Avalon for example has a reflector with auto-leveling.

For everyone's info:

What it comes down to is bulb and the housing designed for the bulb (duh). In the OEM HID world (the legal DOT approved way to have HIDs) there are two bulbs, D2S and D2R or at least up until recent, these were the primary bulbs in HID projectors and reflector housings respectively. (Now have D3, D4 bulbs i think, mercury free, wattage, whatever...) These bulbs OEM are generally 4300k temperature rating - (white colored light)

You can find the D2R and D2S re-based bulbs to fit you application, and IMO that is the easiest way to get HIDs without a proper retro. In my Scion tC for example, I purchased D2R (reflector type) HID bulbs, rebased for 9006 connection, and Toyota slim ballasts. Wired them properly, relays, fuse, etc. If I ever got in trouble for them, which was unlikely, I could pop the hood, and everything was "OEM/DOT/Toyota" until you look at the exterior lens of the headlamp and see 9006 bulb type. Cutoff was close, "close" to the 9006, with a little sloppier cutoff/scatter. Just aimed them a tad lower from stock, never got pinged for misalignment. Beautiful.

In the 4runner, I would be concerned with cutoff being such a high vehicle. I would use projectors. I have some TL projectors laying around for the project i wanted to start soon, reusing my Toyota ballasts, and have new D2S bulbs.

After all that, I guess I just have to say, even though it's still improper to have HIDs in a vehicle (or housing) not designed to have them, I would still stay as close to OEM products as I can. Anything that doesn't power a 35w D2S/D2R bulb, IMO, is not a true HID setup. Take it or leave it.
 
I have experience with both setups on our truck, rebased HID bulbs in the halogen reflector housing then installing a legitimate projector retrofit.

As stated, the rebased bulbs in our halogen reflectors produce quite a glare and have to be aimed down quite a bit to not blind other drivers. They did however provide the look I was after (6000K bulb) but I lost what's most important - lumens - which triggered me to retrofit projectors into my headlamps.

Needless to say, the projector light output is night and day compared to the rebased HID bulbs in the halogen reflectors. A large part due to the D2S 4300K bulbs I'm using but also because the projector bowl focuses, aims, and spreads the light output of an HID bulb correctly to give the driver the most usable light on the road while preventing light scatter and glare for the other drivers. Additionally, the cutoff is so sharp that I do not blind other drivers even though my truck is lifted.

Now, I'm not telling anyone what to do, that's your choice. I can only provide my experience so use it FWIW to you.
 
snow&surf said:
I have experience with both setups on our truck, rebased HID bulbs in the halogen reflector housing then installing a legitimate projector retrofit.

As stated, the rebased bulbs in our halogen reflectors produce quite a glare and have to be aimed down quite a bit to not blind other drivers. They did however provide the look I was after (6000K bulb) but I lost what's most important - lumens - which triggered me to retrofit projectors into my headlamps.

Needless to say, the projector light output is night and day compared to the rebased HID bulbs in the halogen reflectors. A large part due to the D2S 4300K bulbs I'm using but also because the projector bowl focuses, aims, and spreads the light output of an HID bulb correctly to give the driver the most usable light on the road while preventing light scatter and glare for the other drivers. Additionally, the cutoff is so sharp that I do not blind other drivers even though my truck is lifted.

Now, I'm not telling anyone what to do, that's your choice. I can only provide my experience so use it FWIW to you.
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Perfectly stated S&S. This was my experience exactly.

:thumb3:
 
Good thread, now that the emotion is gone. Lighting can be complex — I've read tons about it and am still learning. Thanks to those who have shared their wisdom.
 
i have a 2010 limited 4runner and i bought a plug and play HID kit, but they do not turn on. I've switched the polarity and still nothing. if anyone has a solution to this please let me know it would be much appriciated !
 
Nedd21 said:
i have a 2010 limited 4runner and i bought a plug and play HID kit, but they do not turn on. I've switched the polarity and still nothing. if anyone has a solution to this please let me know it would be much appriciated !
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While it's great you searched, it appears you didn't actually bother to read the thread.
 
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