Installing Winter Rims/Tires without TPMS

[JayceeP]

Ok, I know this has appeared before, but rather than dig up and post in old threads I was looking for quick clarification and need a little guidance on installing my winter tires and rims (tires are on rims already).

I bought 17" steelies and winter tires for winter. Is there anything I need to be aware of/cautious of/know of before and after I install these?

1) My biggest concern is no TPMS. Aside from the fact I won't have the monitoring, will there be any negative implications? Just want to make sure I don't screw up my vehicle. Toyota won't put them on for me unless they have TPMS on them. That means I do it myself.

2) I bought the rims and tires lightly used (9/32nd tread) and came off a '12 Limited. They were force balanced. My concern is that the dealer won't install them and not be able to confirm they are indeed balanced. Should I be worried about this? Given the low mileage on them and the even tread wear, I didn't see a concern. Again, I don't want to mess up my vehicle.

3) Is there anything special I need to know about mounting them? I obviously know what side of the rim should face out. Aside from that, is there anything I need to know?

To add: I have an impactor and will be buying a torque wrench to ensure proper torque on the lugs. I also know not to tighten all the way with the impactor.

Thanks everyone.

 

[jspagna1]

As long as you can live with the TPMS light being on all the time, there are no problems. I have 18" aftermarket rims & tires on my truck and have had them on all summer with no issues. I also had a 2010 Acura TL SH-AWD that I had winter rims & tires with no issues as well.

 

[Jeremy556]

You can get cheap TPMS sensors from eBay, and a cable with Techstream that will allow you to program the sensors.

 

[Jim82]

You can get cheap TPMS sensors from eBay, and a cable with Techstream that will allow you to program the sensors.

Do you or anyone else know if the Techstream works on Mac?

 

[Jeremy556]

Do you or anyone else know if the Techstream works on Mac?

It will work in VMware Fusion. I run it on a Windows XP VM in VMware Workstation on my laptop because 64 bit drivers are not (or were not a few months ago) available.

 

[JayceeP]

Thanks, I likely won't bother with the TPMS. I just want to know if there are any must-knows before swapping tires to prevent potential damage.

 

[Intruder]

2) I bought the rims and tires lightly used (9/32nd tread) and came off a '12 Limited. They were force balanced. My concern is that the dealer won't install them and not be able to confirm they are indeed balanced. Should I be worried about this? Given the low mileage on them and the even tread wear, I didn't see a concern. Again, I don't want to mess up my vehicle.

Since they aren't on the truck yet just drop the mounted wheels and tires off at any tire shop and have them check if they're balanced.

 

[philsey]

I've been running steelies w/ Blizzaks for the past 2 winters... no tpms. Sounds to me like you have everything under control with the tq wrench.

The tpms light doesn't bother me a bit. If you keep the oem wheels in the garage, the light will reset every time you park. IMO, I'd not dismount/rebalance just to add those. Drive it this winter, decide next year.

A 4WD Runner w/ snow tires is invincible baby. Better go, and better whoa.

 

[eddiebx]

3) Is there anything special I need to know about mounting them? I obviously know what side of the rim should face out. Aside from that, is there anything I need to know?

To add: I have an impactor and will be buying a torque wrench to ensure proper torque on the lugs. I also know not to tighten all the way with the impactor.

Thanks everyone.

Only thing I would check for before/during/after installation is brake clearance, since you're not sure where the 17" steelies came from right? So just keep an eye out to make sure nothing's hitting while you mount them on and right after while it's still up on jack stands, give it wheel a quick spin to make sure nothing's dragging/scraping.

You've pretty much gotten the impact wrench use and torque wrench use down cold. Here's a few further pointers to assure a smooth install:
-if you have a locking lug nut, don't take it off with the impact wrench, use hand tools
-when installing, I personally prefer to spin on all the lug nuts by hand but if you want to use the impact wrench...start threading on the lug nut by hand for at least a few turns and then zip it on very lightly with the impact wrench, right about up to where the lug washer touches the rim.
-Do the above for all 6 bolts and then after the wheel is completely flat against the hub, tighten it down partially with the impact wrench. This is because you want to make sure that the wheel is true/centered on the hub before tightening the lug nuts down. The impact wrench can mask a lot of the "feel", so you can easily cross thread, or tighten on the wheel slightly crooked.
-lower the tire to the ground only enough so that it is touching and won't spin when you do the final torquing of the lug nuts. Then torque in a criss-cross pattern.

One note about the torque wrench if you've never used one before...the torque reading is more accurate when it's reading from a bolt in motion, so basically you want torque the bolt on in one continuous motion until the torque wrench "clicks". Sooooo, plan your torque wrench swing ahead of time, and make sure you have enough range of motion left before hitting the final torque value. I hate it when I am just about to get there and the end of the torque wrench hits the ground, lol.

 

[JayceeP]

Thanks [MENTION=66300]Intruder[/MENTION], [MENTION=51186]philsey[/MENTION], [MENTION=85512]eddiebx[/MENTION]. You guys are a big help! I appreciate the reassurance.

 

[JayceeP]

Hey [MENTION=51186]philsey[/MENTION] [MENTION=85512]eddiebx[/MENTION] [MENTION=66300]Intruder[/MENTION] [MENTION=23991]jspagna1[/MENTION], am I ok to use the wheel nuts off the 20's? The guy I bought these wheels from said he used the OEM nuts as he bought these tires and rims from the dealership. I know there are different styles of nuts. Pics attached of me mounting. You can see on the rim that the receiving hole (lol) is rounded outward and not flat. I also am also holding the OEM nut to show the rounded bottom.

 

[eddiebx]

What you are describing is a ball seat on the steelies, as shown below:

To be honest I never carefully inspected my 4runner's nuts, lol; but I think it might not have a ball seat in addition to the built in washer, since it is the washer that applies the clamping force to our wheels.

With a ball seat type wheel/nut, it is the ball seat surface that applies the clamping force, so your best bet is to get the appropriate nuts ASAP. With that said, before I knew better in my younger days, I ran tapered seat nuts on my ball seat wheels for months on end without issue. BUT, don't follow my foot steps, lol.

The problem is you risk having the lug nuts back out since only a tiny bit of the seat is being used to clamp the wheel down, instead of the full surface.

Swing by any car parts store, they should have what you need. Also, bring an OE nut inside so you can get the right thread pitch

 

[JayceeP]

What you are describing is a ball seat on the steelies, as shown below:

To be honest I never carefully inspected my 4runner's nuts, lol; but I think it might not have a ball seat in addition to the built in washer, since it is the washer that applies the clamping force to our wheels.

With a ball seat type wheel/nut, it is the ball seat surface that applies the clamping force, so your best bet is to get the appropriate nuts ASAP. With that said, before I knew better in my younger days, I ran tapered seat nuts on my ball seat wheels for months on end without issue. BUT, don't follow my foot steps, lol.

The problem is you risk having the lug nuts back out since only a tiny bit of the seat is being used to clamp the wheel down, instead of the full surface.

Swing by any car parts store, they should have what you need. Also, bring an OE nut inside so you can get the right thread pitch

Thanks. So now I'm on my 2nd tire and not sure whether to keep going or put the OEM wheel back on and get a shop to do it. So much for this being easy lol.

 

[eddiebx]

Just run to the store and get a set of appropriate lug nuts, what's so hard about that, lol.

 

[JayceeP]

Cause it's a pia lol. I called the dealership and the guy in parts said it is ok and yes the bottom of the lugs would fit against the rim, the washer will have no contact. He said the only issue is I may hear a bit of rattling. He said that's how he runs his. I feel confident in his recommendation because he described the fitment to me and knew exactly how it is set up without me having to explain it and him just agreeing with my unprofessional opinion. I'll keep going and continue putting the winters on and like you said, see about getting some proper nuts to fit.

 

[eddiebx]

As I had said earlier, it is most likely fine to run it with those nuts if you are in a pinch, in the sense that you're not likely to end up with a wheel flying off instantaneously; I used tapered seat nuts (which are probably pretty similar to out OE nuts) on a set of ball seat wheels and was fine for the longest time (before I knew better).

BUT, it's a very good idea to get the right lug nuts as soon as practical; reason being, with the wrong nut you're only clamping down with a tiny fraction of the actual seat surface so it's much easier for the nut to loosen up. Plus if you keep putting them on and taking it off with the wrong nut, you eventually ruin the radius of the ball seat.

Look at it this way, It's literally like trying to mate a round ball with a cone or vice versa, lol.


Anyhow, remember to recheck torque periodically if you're going to use the OE nuts for now!

 

[eddiebx]

[MENTION=92682]JayceeP[/MENTION], it just occurred to me, did you look carefully at the steel wheel's lug nut seat? It could very well be that they are tapered seats and not ball seat, no way to tell from the picture you posted. See if there is a slight arc in the seat (ball seat), as opposed to being completely flat but conical (tapered seat). The OE nuts might work out just fine if it's a tapered seat, maybe that's what the parts guy meant

 

[JayceeP]

[MENTION=92682]JayceeP[/MENTION], it just occurred to me, did you look carefully at the steel wheel's lug nut seat? It could very well be that they are tapered seats and not ball seat, no way to tell from the picture you posted. See if there is a slight arc in the seat (ball seat), as opposed to being completely flat but conical (tapered seat). The OE nuts might work out just fine if it's a tapered seat, maybe that's what the parts guy meant

I put them on, hard to say. I'll double check. I just took a quick rip down the highway and everything felt fine. I'm surprised... I figured here would be a more noticeable difference between the OEM 20 Yokohoma's and these 17 Michelin x-ice xi2's.

 

[JayceeP]

[MENTION=85512]eddiebx[/MENTION], I haven't taken off a nut yet but here is a pic I snapped yesterday. If you zoom in a bit, it does sort of look tapered so that the rounded/tapered end of the bolt can sit in it. The bolt itself wasn't tapered very much.

Anyway, thanks for the help!

 

[RobDek]

I found black Gorilla lug nuts at Costco in Moncton yesterday. They cost 98 cents each.