BTW, in that piece you quoted from me, I should have been more clear that I'm referring to buying a NEW TRD Pro (not bolting one on) versus going with something like a Bilstein or Icon lift.
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Is it possible to add TRD PRO suspension?
- Thread starter TOYOTA 09
- Start date
BTW, in that piece you quoted from me, I should have been more clear that I'm referring to buying a NEW TRD Pro (not bolting one on) versus going with something like a Bilstein or Icon lift.
BLACK-FL4RUNNER
Member
I thought it was pretty clear to me what you were saying.
Saker
Senior Member
If you research your TRD Parts you are referring to, you will find out that Toyota had some input, but did not design and engineer the TRD/Bilstein front and rears.
As stated, they had input with Bilstein on the shock and use a different coil on the TRD.... the coil is specific to TRD and made by Eibach.
Look at the 6112 Bilstein and the 5160 Bilstein....for the T4R, they were metered for each vehicle they are designed for and have been tested on T4R's prior to release....
Chas [MENTION=120150]TotalAutomotiveLV[/MENTION] = www.totalautomotiveperformance.com did some of the testing on his Tundra prior to Bilstein releasing them... just giving one example
just trying to clear up some misinformation here...
You can also contact Bilstein and check for yourself.
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Dude, gimme a break. We're talking about both, back and forth on this thread - everything needs to be taken in context. I'm not sure what your comment is intended to achieve other than to be sarcastic. :frusty:
Please see my earlier comment about the parts being produced by third parties. You and I are in 100% agreement. Just to be clear. When I say "designed and engineered" I specifically left out the word "manufactured" intentionally. In other words, as you've pointed out in your own post, Toyota gathered up parts from various 3rd parties and put them together to create a system (I refer to this as "designing") which they then tested.
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Saker
Senior Member
I guess the words, "designed and engineered", meant something different to me than you.
Must have misunderstood what you were trying to convey...enjoy the TRD Pro Suspension
But, you can get more adjustment with 6112's than the TRD Pro setup.... for less $$$
Oh, they are made by Bilstein as well as the TRD ones........
Heh, thanks, yes - you're right. And that takes us full circle to the question central to this thread and the OP's original question - is it possible to put a TRD Pro suspension on a non-TRD Pro 4Runner (and then the subsequent conversation about why someone would do that rather than get something with better performance). :usa2:
FWIW, I don't own a TRD Pro (yet) - I'm actually trying to decide between the 2016 TRD Pro and the TEP. The decision for me personally will be based on the "bone stock" capabilities rather than the aftermarket options, and honestly, I'm leaning toward the TEP.
Jairborne78
New member
TRD Pro Suspension Kit Issue
I purchased a TRD suspension kit for my Trail. Dealership installed it. My Trail had leveling spacers on it. When I picked it up I noticed that it was not as tall as before. It had toytec spacers on it before and I was told they won't fit with the TRD kit. It is a lot lower in the front than the rear. HELP!!!
I purchased a TRD suspension kit for my Trail. Dealership installed it. My Trail had leveling spacers on it. When I picked it up I noticed that it was not as tall as before. It had toytec spacers on it before and I was told they won't fit with the TRD kit. It is a lot lower in the front than the rear. HELP!!!
There is a TRD Pro lift suspension on this forum and they are using THIS KIT to gain 2" height on their Pros. Since your front is lower than you rear, you can ask Toyteclifts to swap out the Superflex 2" coils that come with the kit with the SAW 1.5" coils for $38 more. Toyteclifts will also be having a 10% off sale next week.
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4runner lift with KDSS
I appreciate your input, and could you shed some light on the long term ramifications of adding a lift to a 2015 4R Trail with KDSS?
I recently purchased same and on an elk hunting trip in CO repeatedly struck bottom where I never before had an issue.
Coming out was worse as we'd had 3 days of constant rain.
My previous vehicles have been Cruisers, and all I had to do was add oversize tires, but this doesn't appear to be a solution without a lift on my 4R.
I was surprised that the 4R KDSS clearance was less, and something I missed in my research.
Even a 1 1/2" lift would be a blessing.
I appreciate your input, and could you shed some light on the long term ramifications of adding a lift to a 2015 4R Trail with KDSS?
I recently purchased same and on an elk hunting trip in CO repeatedly struck bottom where I never before had an issue.
Coming out was worse as we'd had 3 days of constant rain.
My previous vehicles have been Cruisers, and all I had to do was add oversize tires, but this doesn't appear to be a solution without a lift on my 4R.
I was surprised that the 4R KDSS clearance was less, and something I missed in my research.
Even a 1 1/2" lift would be a blessing.
I doubt that you cannot use the spacer with the TRD suspension ? Did they explained you why ?
Jairborne78
New member
Is there anyone else that has installed the pro kit and had issues? Installed the pro and the rear of the vehicle is higher than the front. I had spacers on the front on my stock Trail. Installed this kit and now my tires rub. And I have 275/70/17. Is there a fix? I thought it was a leveling suspension kit. The TRD site level.
Saker
Senior Member
I don't think it is a leveling kit, to level the truck there are two ways to compare.
1) If you are talking about the frame being level is one.
2) If you are talking about the height from the center of the wheel to the tops of the wheel well is another.
There is approximately 2" difference in height front/rear the second way!
Read below:
I found this some time back on the TRD Pro 4Runner site.
High Performance TRD Suspension System
Professionally-tuned by TRD suspension engineers for high performance to Toyota’s exacting standards for ride quality and durability, both front and rear suspensions feature larger Bilstein® monotube shocks that hold additional shock fluid, as well as larger digressive Bilstein® pistons (60 mm front/46 mm rear, versus 32 mm original equipment front/rear) that gave engineers greater surface area for tuning valving profiles. The front and rear original equipment sway bars, end links, and bump stops are retained.
Front suspension details: TRD-tuned 2.5-inch Bilstein® 5100-series independent coil-over-shock type suspension, TRD-tuned Eibach® springs, and factory stabilizer bar, end links and bump stops.
TRD-tuned Eibach® springs with decreased spring rates (softer-than-stock) improve ride quality over harsh terrain and gives a 1-inch higher ride height, for a level front to back appearance that gives better front ground clearance when out on the trail off-highway.
Larger 2.5-inch shocks (similar in size to those used on heavy-duty industrial vehicles) with digressive valving are matched to the softer spring rate for enhanced overall characteristics operating off-highway in the dirt. Larger, more rigid 18mm shock shafts add component strength (original equipment shafts are 12mm).
The new shocks have also been engineered with a longer-stroke, to give an additional 1-inch of extended, or “down”, wheel travel for enhanced articulation capabilities when off-roading.
The larger 2.5-inch shocks houses a greater oil capacity than stock equipment; the increased amount of oil means the shocks can better dissipate heat and avoid cavitation created from working the shocks hard off-
road. This results in a predictable suspension that consistently works over longer periods of time in some of the most extreme situations and environments.
Rear suspension details: TRD-tuned 2.0-inch Bilstein® 5100-series shocks with remote reservoirs, and factory rear coil springs, stabilizer bar, end links, and bump stops.
The enhanced rear suspension features larger-than-stock 2.0-inch shocks with remote-mounted external reservoirs that also house a greater-than-stock shock oil capacity, equivalent to that of a larger 2.5-inch shock, but inside of a more compact package. The increased amount of oil means that the shocks can better dissipate heat to help avoid cavitation created from working the shocks hard off-road. This results in consistent, predictable suspension operation that keeps on working as designed in the most extreme situations and environments.
The upgraded Bilstein® rear shocks use larger 46 mm pistons with more valving surface area, an improvement over the 32 mm original equipment pistons.
The shocks have also been engineered to provide an additional 1-inch of extended or “down” wheel travel for enhanced articulation capabilities when off-roading.
Why did they remove your Toytec spacers?
Were they on top of the OEM plates?
If so, they could have left them there. (1/4" Toytec spacer gives you 1/2" of lift.)
Jairborne78
New member
Yes they were. They said they wouldn't fit. I figure they would. I bet they didn't even try.
Jairborne78
New member
No they didn't. I thought it was BS. I am taking it back up there Monday.
Hi , I'll try . As far as the ground clearance in Toyotas own literature published you have less ground clearance due to the sway bar bracket design on the rear axle and also the bracket design on the front lower control arm. Also the hoses and frame mounted oil canisters tend to be vulnerable. The system is also heavy for obvious reasons. The reason that Toyota does not offer a lift with KDSS and it is not advised to lift a vehicle with is the same reason it's not advisable to lift a truck with stock shocks. The KDSS cylinders have a predetermined stroke in and out when you lift the vehicle you move that stroke near the top so you have less down travel it's like putting on a lift kit or a long travel kit but leaving the stock shocks. You will hear the KDSS cylinders bottom and top out like a shock would when you reach their limits. And Toyotas design is for the shock to limit down travel not the KDSS cylinders so there's another durability issue. Another problem and the reason that Toyota did not offer it on the TRD pro is heat the increased stroke generates heat which equals fade which equals the sway bars losing their effectiveness in high-speed off Road type desert , The opposite of what you want on the TRD pro. KDSS is a good system and it has its place if left stock it works great and does what it's intended to do , allow a vehicle to have better Street manners and still go off road that's why it's on the Lexus , and not the FJ , it's not primarily designed for off-road it's more a design for a compromise to go on road as the sway bars are much larger.
Note This is only for you asking these questions I have been flamed for this many times. I hope this explanation helps in someway.
Thank you for the detail. What is the source of the information?
Ike64
New member
So please don't flame the new bee, or just throw unwarranted hate because I bought a Pro. But as to the suspension handling extra weight of added components. What is the weak link the shocks or just the softer spring rate? If it's the springs is there an after market spring with a higher weight handling capability.
Better then starting a new thread to just ask here.
Better then starting a new thread to just ask here.
I am new to this site/thread and 4Runner ownership and am having the same dilemma as some others (TRD Pro vs TEP w/KDSS). I want to have good off-road performance (better than the standard/stock 4Runner without TRD or KDSS but also without the need for a lot of aftermarket suspension changes to the vehicle. I live in AZ so primary off road driving would be desert trails and washes, some of which can get a little rocky/bumpy/rutty. Not planning any hard-core rock climbing jeep trips or anything like that. I am mostly concerned about the comfort of the ride when off road as I have had a back surgery in the past and my back still does not like a lot of jolting bumps and getting thrown around while driving. I also do care about on-road handling as well since this is not just a toy and I do have adult responsibilities and a daily job to drive to.
I have not been able to actually find a TRD to test drive in order to compare the vehicles, so I would appreciate answers to the following questions from those who have driven the TRD and/or the KDSS.
1) It seems like the trade-off is that the stock TRD is better for off-road performance/comfort whereas the stock KDSS is better for on-road handling but still a very capable off-road setup. Is this a fair/correct summary?
2) If so, is the on-road handing of the TRD terrible in comparison to the KDSS?
3) Also, is the off-road handling of the TRD better enough (given my intended uses) to justify losing the better on-road handling of the TEP w/KDSS?
I realize that there have been a lot of responses to similar questions but I am honestly a little confused by some conflicting information/opinions.
I am also very interested in hearing someone's response to Ike64's question regarding the impact on the suspension of the TRD of added weight from added accessories and if correcting this is as simple as swapping out springs or a bigger endeavor. I would like to add sliders and a Gobi rack/ladder, but not interested in heavy bumpers or winch or anything like that.
I really appreciate any help/clarifications I can get, so thank you in advance.
I have not been able to actually find a TRD to test drive in order to compare the vehicles, so I would appreciate answers to the following questions from those who have driven the TRD and/or the KDSS.
1) It seems like the trade-off is that the stock TRD is better for off-road performance/comfort whereas the stock KDSS is better for on-road handling but still a very capable off-road setup. Is this a fair/correct summary?
2) If so, is the on-road handing of the TRD terrible in comparison to the KDSS?
3) Also, is the off-road handling of the TRD better enough (given my intended uses) to justify losing the better on-road handling of the TEP w/KDSS?
I realize that there have been a lot of responses to similar questions but I am honestly a little confused by some conflicting information/opinions.
I am also very interested in hearing someone's response to Ike64's question regarding the impact on the suspension of the TRD of added weight from added accessories and if correcting this is as simple as swapping out springs or a bigger endeavor. I would like to add sliders and a Gobi rack/ladder, but not interested in heavy bumpers or winch or anything like that.
I really appreciate any help/clarifications I can get, so thank you in advance.
