My 3.4 timing belt thread

[Previologist]

it took forever but you can see why. That gunk is powerful glue.

I was very scared that the bolts would strip out or break. Partway through I had to go buy 2 more m6 x 1.0 bolts because the first two were bending, probably because my beheaded crank bolt wasn't perfectly flat. It was also getting ground up by the intense pressure from the turning puller bolt. Then I had to replace one of the 2nd batch of 6 mm bolts with the better of the 2 from the from pair. I had to use the puller until it was ALL the way off. It was brutal.

 

[Previologist]

Tried to get one of the cam pulleys off using a holder but it slipped and the pulley rotated clockwise nearly 1/4 turn. Now I'm out of my pay grade-should I just continue through a 3/4 clockwise rotation till the timing mark is back on top? I don't know if one turn is really one cycle for the pistons or not.

 

[gh25_]

Tried to get one of the cam pulleys off using a holder but it slipped and the pulley rotated clockwise nearly 1/4 turn. Now I'm out of my pay grade-should I just continue through a 3/4 clockwise rotation till the timing mark is back on top? I don't know if one turn is really one cycle for the pistons or not.

I am assuming you have the timing belt off right. Taking the cam pulleys off to do the seals correct? If it jumped there is no worry. Our 5VZ engines are non-interference so no point would the pistons be able to contact the valves. Just turn the cam around back where it's lined up with the marks and your good. Since the timing belt is off that camshaft isn't connected to the other cam or the crank shaft so you can move it independently and your fine. Just be sure your marks are all lined up before putting the new timing belt on. Also for taking off the cam pulleys I recommend a different method. Wrap your old timing belt around your cam pulley and go fully around it and give some overlap about 3 inches is plenty. Then use some duct tape or gorilla tape and wrap that around it as well to hold the belt around the pulley so it doesn't move or fall off. Then you can get some chain whip vice grip pliers and you wrap them around the pulley and make sure to put the part of the pliers that presses into it on the overlapped part of the belt just for extra caution so you don't damage it. When you clamp them it holds a very firm grip on the pulley. You'll need a extra set of hands for this as well. You can try to break it loose with a breaker bar but a impact will work best. With the breaker bar most likely you will out lever your buddy holding the chain whip and it won't come loose. Now having done two timing belt jobs those cam bolts are quite a bit more difficult to get off if they have not come off before. Now for tightening the cam pulley bolt you do the same thing but torquing it is a lot easier i believe the spec is 81 ft/lbs and the person holding the chain whip will have enough leverage to torque it to spec. They have the chain whip vice grips at harbor freight for 16 bucks and I suspect they would be pretty cheap at other places as well. Those cam holders work decent sometimes but I have heard of people bending them. I have done the method I just told you twice and it worked like a charm both times. After you have the cam pulleys off just make sure you don't loose the little pins that align them on the camshaft. They can fall out.

20 in. Locking Chain Clamp, Harbor Freight:

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[Previologist]

Since the cam seals do not appear to be leaking I might just avoid the whole issue and not remove the cam pulleys. My buddies all live 30 miles away and they are scrawny weaklings lol.

 

[2TH4IST]

Do the seals if you are already in there. Otherwise if you don't do them they will leak shortly after you re assemble everything, it's like the law of the universe or something.

 

[Previologist]

Do the seals if you are already in there. Otherwise if you don't do them they will leak shortly after you re assemble everything, it's like the law of the universe or something.

Well if I can get the pulleys off i will change them but I'm not quite all the way in there yet! But I also can't be sure they aren't leaking I guess, until i get the rear timing cover off.

It seems to me like the best way to do this by yourself (since I know I'm not the only one who has struggled with it) would be to loosen the cam pulley bolts when the belt is still on tight and you can use the crank pulley tool and breaker bar against the frame. if you just crack em loose you can still get the timing marks lined up with the belt on. Too late for that now.

But I think i can find a way to secure the pulley tool so I can use both hands on a breaker and cheater to bust them loose.

 

[Previologist]

I am assuming you have the timing belt off right. Taking the cam pulleys off to do the seals correct? If it jumped there is no worry. Our 5VZ engines are non-interference so no point would the pistons be able to contact the valves. Just turn the cam around back where it's lined up with the marks and your good. Since the timing belt is off that camshaft isn't connected to the other cam or the crank shaft so you can move it independently and your fine. Just be sure your marks are all lined up before putting the new timing belt on. Also for taking off the cam pulleys I recommend a different method. Wrap your old timing belt around your cam pulley and go fully around it and give some overlap about 3 inches is plenty. Then use some duct tape or gorilla tape and wrap that around it as well to hold the belt around the pulley so it doesn't move or fall off. Then you can get some chain whip vice grip pliers and you wrap them around the pulley and make sure to put the part of the pliers that presses into it on the overlapped part of the belt just for extra caution so you don't damage it. When you clamp them it holds a very firm grip on the pulley. You'll need a extra set of hands for this as well. You can try to break it loose with a breaker bar but a impact will work best. With the breaker bar most likely you will out lever your buddy holding the chain whip and it won't come loose. Now having done two timing belt jobs those cam bolts are quite a bit more difficult to get off if they have not come off before. Now for tightening the cam pulley bolt you do the same thing but torquing it is a lot easier i believe the spec is 81 ft/lbs and the person holding the chain whip will have enough leverage to torque it to spec. They have the chain whip vice grips at harbor freight for 16 bucks and I suspect they would be pretty cheap at other places as well. Those cam holders work decent sometimes but I have heard of people bending them. I have done the method I just told you twice and it worked like a charm both times. After you have the cam pulleys off just make sure you don't loose the little pins that align them on the camshaft. They can fall out.

20 in. Locking Chain Clamp, Harbor Freight:

Access to this page has been denied

I'm gonna try one more time with the puller but will keep these ideas in reserve! I think i will get one of those chain grip tool anyway, looks like a handy thing to have around especially at that price!

 

[Previologist]

Got em both off, piece of cake. I just strapped the handle of the tool to the ac bracket on one side and the water pump inlet on the other side. Both are plenty strong, the bolts really weren't all that tight once I had good purchase. I resisted the temptation to let the padded handle push against the crankshaft, for the passenger side, but that would have worked too. And both seals are leaking, so hurray for me :cheer2:.

 

[gh25_]

Got em both off, piece of cake. I just strapped the handle of the tool to the ac bracket on one side and the water pump inlet on the other side. Both are plenty strong, the bolts really weren't all that tight once I had good purchase. I resisted the temptation to let the padded handle push against the crankshaft, for the passenger side, but that would have worked too. And both seals are leaking, so hurray for me :cheer2:.

Good to hear! Getting it done! Those can be somewhat difficult especially by yourself. Good to hear you figured it out. Good luck with the rest of the job :biggrin1:

 

[Previologist]

My tensioner piston is firm and its not leaking oil, but my cheap harbor freight caliper measures the piston at about 11.5 mm. FSM says it should be 10 to 10.8. Do I have to get a new one anyway?

 

[2TH4IST]

Hmm, I've always replaced them when I'm in there doing a timing belt. But then again the 3.4 tensioner is accessible from underneath. So you can use it and if it's a problem then you can replace it without disassembling all that you just did.

 

[brillo_76]

My tensioner piston is firm and its not leaking oil, but my cheap harbor freight caliper measures the piston at about 11.5 mm. FSM says it should be 10 to 10.8. Do I have to get a new one anyway?

Yes. I always replace the tensioner when I do timing belts. Its not worth doing all this work without replacing it.

However, this is your choice. I have never done the job without changing that part. timing belt bearings, water pump all gets changed. The last 2 Timing belt jobs I did all those seals. Cams, front main etc.

I think I have done 3 timing belt jobs thus far.

 

[Previologist]

OK, OK, I ordered a new tensioner. It has arrived along with the 250 ft-lb torque wrench I need for the crank bolt, and I go to pick up my new alt-ps-etc belts today.

I tried to get the timing belt on last night, and failed. I had the tensioner in, but the bolts were only screwed in very slightly. I really don't want to take it out but that's an option I guess. Thanks to my arthritic wrists, I just can't pull the belt tight enough to get it just ONE MORE TOOTH when it goes on the crank gear. To be clear, I can get it on the crank gear, but it's one tooth off from where it needs to be for all the marks to line up. Any tips or tricks, aside from removing the tensioner completely? Can I turn the crank gear back one tooth's distance? It would then be one tooth left of the timing mark on the oil pump, but all the belt markings and cam sights would line up-at least for a second lol. I suppose I could try it and then turn it all through a cycle or two and see if they all still line up

A pox on my weakling wrists...

 

[brillo_76]

Take the tensioner bolts out till they are loose but still a good turn or 2 in the threads.. ( make sure your tensioner is compressed with lock pin in place) This will give you slightly more slack.. Use small vice grips or c clamps to hold the belt onto the top 2 cam shafts in their exact position... You put the belt on everything except the bottom Pulley. Then you work it on that pulley with the little prybar I always mark the dot with a yellow marker along with the side of the belt so its easier to see. Start the belt on that last pulley on the passenger side then work it on to the drivers.. The belt will be mostly off the next pulley up on the drivers side that is ok. As when you get it started it mostly will just slide on. As it slides on it will go into place. Double and triple check the timing marks as it very easy to be a tooth off in doing thins.

Once in place, tighten up the tensioner bolts and very the marks once again. If all good pull the pin to tighten the belt.

 

[Previologist]

Take the tensioner bolts out till they are loose but still a good turn or 2 in the threads.. ( make sure your tensioner is compressed with lock pin in place) This will give you slightly more slack.. Use small vice grips or c clamps to hold the belt onto the top 2 cam shafts in their exact position... You put the belt on everything except the bottom Pulley. Then you work it on that pulley with the little prybar I always mark the dot with a yellow marker along with the side of the belt so its easier to see. Start the belt on that last pulley on the passenger side then work it on to the drivers.. The belt will be mostly off the next pulley up on the drivers side that is ok. As when you get it started it mostly will just slide on. As it slides on it will go into place. Double and triple check the timing marks as it very easy to be a tooth off in doing thins.

Once in place, tighten up the tensioner bolts and very the marks once again. If all good pull the pin to tighten the belt.

The tensioner is not an issue at all, I wrote that and immediately realized I shouldn't even have mentioned it. It is barely bolted at all and I am not even trying to get it on that idler pulley yet, I only plan to do that once its on the crank gear properly.

My problem is strictly getting it on the crank gear so that its tight enough to streeeeeetch just one more tooth. I did use clips on the cam pulleys last night. Haven't tried it again yet today but I will try what you suggest tonight. If I understand you corretly you are suggesting only putting it slightly onto the water pump pulley to give it a little slack, then stretching it onto the crank. That might do it.

 

[brillo_76]

Well that is how I do it. You cant fight nor hold everything. By clamping the camshaft you hold the entire upper belt in place. With the water pump having zero teeth makes is a lot easier for the belt to slide on...

It will go... The first one is always the hardest... by 2 or 3 you can do it in a few minutes...

 

[Previologist]

I got it on. I tried your method but my wrists are just too painful. I found another old post suggesting to leave the upper idler loose, so it tips up a few degrees providing some slack. Then I took up that slack by rotating the driver side cam clockwise a little bit and also pulled the crank gear toward the front of the truck a bit so it was better aligned with the front edge of water pump pulley. I slipped it onto the tensioner pulley, then pulled it onto the water pump. All the marks line up now but I have a feeling it will skip a tooth when I tighten the tensioner and crank it around a couple times. But now I at least can get it on so that part is solvable.

The question that still bugs me is whether my passenger cam is really where it needs to be. Because it slipped when I first tried to get the belt on, i rotated it clockwise until the timing mark was back in line with the slot. But I can't help but wonder if i should have rotated it one more time to get the timing back where it needs to be. I'm not going to button it all up until I know for sure.

 

[AuSeeker]

I got it on. I tried your method but my wrists are just too painful. I found another old post suggesting to leave the upper idler loose, so it tips up a few degrees providing some slack. Then I took up that slack by rotating the driver side cam clockwise a little bit and also pulled the crank gear toward the front of the truck a bit so it was better aligned with the front edge of water pump pulley. I slipped it onto the tensioner pulley, then pulled it onto the water pump. All the marks line up now but I have a feeling it will skip a tooth when I tighten the tensioner and crank it around a couple times. But now I at least can get it on so that part is solvable.

The question that still bugs me is whether my passenger cam is really where it needs to be. Because it slipped when I first tried to get the belt on, i rotated it clockwise until the timing mark was back in line with the slot. But I can't help but wonder if i should have rotated it one more time to get the timing back where it needs to be. I'm not going to button it all up until I know for sure.

The cam sprocket rotates with the camshaft, turn the sprocket 360* and the cam turns 360*, turning it another 360* will not do anything different than when you turned it the first time, the timing marks will not move to a different location!

 

[Previologist]

The cam sprocket rotates with the camshaft, turn the sprocket 360* and the cam turns 360*, turning it another 360* will not do anything different than when you turned it the first time, the timing marks will not move to a different location!

OK, I thought that the cams rotated twice for each rotation of the crank (or maybe vice versa), because I think its like that in some engines. If not I should be good EDit: actually I realized even later that this may not matter either. This is why I try not to do mechanical work lol

Edit: of course i realized a few minutes later that I can see for myself how they rotate, now that the belt is on.

I tightened the tensioner, pulled the pin, rotated a couple times and everything still looks good. Will check it again and then start zipping it up.

 

[Previologist]

The moment of truth came tonight. I went over everything in my head, double checked a few things...and turned the key.

Cranked perfectly but didnt fire. My heart sank. No, no, I know I did everything right! Then I remembered my bad ground and pulled my plunger switch. Success! Thanks to all that helped! I'd been dreading that job for years and it was actually really easy except for the frozen crank pulley