Need some expert help - installed Bilsteins (pics) but have issues

[robotkiller]

Installed Bilsteins at 1.75 front with 1.5 inch rear spacer. The truck looks good (I think) and when I drove it from the shop, I immediately noticed how much better the shocks dampened. Only problem was when I reversed at full lock (tires pointed to the right front corner of the car), the wheel massively toes in and I could feel the suspension binding with a clunk when I straightened it out.

Took it in and the shop attempted to align it with a Hunter. They were not able to figure out why the wheel toes in on full lock reverse and now the traction control light is on and the steering wheel isn't centered.

I'm throwing in the towel and taking it to Toyota. Any ideas here? Do you think that the KDSS is somehow playing a role in this? I know they unbolted the sway bar from the LCA to install the front struts.

Could really use some advice. Here's some pics of before and after

Before: (with 40 pound hitch rack)

After (without rack)

Before

After:

 

[Jesse1983]

Im wondering a few things. Are you sure the shocks are set to 1.75? I'm wondering if the shocks are set to the max and the problem is lying in your UCAs.

When you took it in for alignment, were they able to align it to spec, or did they say they couldn't?

It's strange you have the traction light on. Is it steady on, or just coming on then turning off?

 

[robotkiller]

Im wondering a few things. Are you sure the shocks are set to 1.75? I'm wondering if the shocks are set to the max and the problem is lying in your UCAs.

When you took it in for alignment, were they able to align it to spec, or did they say they couldn't?

It's strange you have the traction light on. Is it steady on, or just coming on then turning off?

I don't have the print out, but they said they could only get it to +one degree caster. Don't have the other parameters.

I thought about UCAs, but I set the clips myself to the 3rd notch and I would not expect to see rake - which is there (though less than stock).

The traction control light is constantly on, which makes me worry about damaged ABS sensors.

I watched them reverse the truck at full R lock (turning left in reverse). The R passenger front wheel was significantly toed in and it feels like it's binding somewhere.

One of my big worries is that they screwed something up with the KDSS when installing the struts - I just don't know if that would cause the above symptoms.

After alignment, the truck ran worse - steering wheel off center, ABS light on. Hopefully this is all just an incompetent alignment job - I presumed that since they were using a Hunter and had a good reputation, they would be able to do a decent job.

I'm pretty irritated. Hoping you (and others) may have some ideas.

 

[harper7]

Doesn't sound good at all and possibly dangerous.They did something wrong.Are you sure they hooked the sway bar back up to the Lower control arm?
Not sure what you mean "it massively toes in"
If one wheel points straight ahead and the other doesn't then that's the toe being out.

Do you mean it leans in at the top more then the bottom cause that's camber.
We need more info and pics of the front suspension really.

Looks great with the lift though!

 

[robotkiller]

Doesn't sound good at all and possibly dangerous.They did something wrong.Are you sure they hooked the sway bar back up to the Lower control arm?
Not sure what you mean "it massively toes in"
If one wheel points straight ahead and the other doesn't then that's the toe being out.

Do you mean it leans in at the top more then the bottom cause that's camber.
We need more info and pics of the front suspension really.

Looks great with the lift though!

You are right - my terminology was incorrect. When the wheel is locked right and in reverse there was a lot of negative camber in the R front wheel. I have a feeling this is could be a sway bar issue - if KDSS is engaged/dysfunctional and the wheel is turned full, would that result in big time negative camber? A little stressed about this - I'm hoping they didn't somehow screw the KDSS up.

Sucks, because I like the way it looks and I can tell the Bilsteins are an upgrade in terms of compression dampening.

Thanks and keep it up guys - I'm taking it to Toyota tomorrow AM and want to be mentally prepared.

 

[silversx]

if dealer is going to take it all apart.. might as well have them set it to 2.5 in front so it's even..

you can actually raise the clip by compressing the spring and not taking the springs off the strut.. if you know what i mean

hope they fix it up for you tomorrow

 

[robotkiller]

if dealer is going to take it all apart.. might as well have them set it to 2.5 in front so it's even..

you can actually raise the clip by compressing the spring and not taking the springs off the strut.. if you know what i mean

hope they fix it up for you tomorrow

I actually want a little bit of a rake, I prefer that to negative rake. I want to avoid the expense of UCAs, so 1.75 is the max I think I can go here.

 

[Ramzey28]

keep us posted on the fix, this is what I want to do with my Trail. Did you go with Daystar spacers?

 

[4ShoreRunner]

I actually want a little bit of a rake, I prefer that to negative rake. I want to avoid the expense of UCAs, so 1.75 is the max I think I can go here.

+1...I'm running the bilsteins with 1.75 and have 1.5" SAWs in the rear and its perfect....it may appear to have a slight rake but honestly its probably level if you measure the front and rear of the frame. The rear wheel wells are just cut out a little higher than the fronts for flex creating the illusion.

 

[4ShoreRunner]

Also - Does it make a clunking sound in the front end when going over large bumps or pot holes? If it was a KDSS/Sway Bar problem you could probably hear / feel it more often then just being in reverse at full lock

 

[Jesse1983]

I just can't see the KDSS getting damaged in that install. But I guess anything is possible when you're dealing with people that don't care about your truck and just want to get a job done.

But like Harper said, more pics of the suspension and camber you're seeing would be helpful.

 

[robotkiller]

So far Toyota thinks that it just needs to get a better alignment. They said they can see nothing wrong with any of the suspension components - everything is connected properly, not binding and no codes are being thrown for damaged sensors.

That said, they are not able to calibrate the traction control system to get rid of the light. They are saying the lift could be to blame - which is what I expected them to say. Last thing I want to do is reverse this, particularly since the light didn't cut on til after the 1st alignment (and frankly I doubt the small lift is to blame - particularly given all the successful lifts around here). They are talking to Toyota technical to get a better idea.

Anyone here have dealt with the TRAC light staying on after a lift?

 

[homeyclaus]

So far Toyota thinks that it just needs to get a better alignment. They said they can see nothing wrong with any of the suspension components - everything is connected properly, not binding and no codes are being thrown for damaged sensors.

That said, they are not able to calibrate the traction control system to get rid of the light. They are saying the lift could be to blame - which is what I expected them to say. Last thing I want to do is reverse this, particularly since the light didn't cut on til after the 1st alignment (and frankly I doubt the small lift is to blame - particularly given all the successful lifts around here). They are talking to Toyota technical to get a better idea.

Anyone here have dealt with the TRAC light staying on after a lift?

There was a thread some time ago as to how to recalibrate the pitch and yaw sensors on the vehicle so that traction control stops freaking out that the rake and pitch dynamics have changed. There is also a procedure how to do this in the FSM. Your dealer should be able to do it.

 

[robotkiller]

There was a thread some time ago as to how to recalibrate the pitch and yaw sensors on the vehicle so that traction control stops freaking out that the rake and pitch dynamics have changed. There is also a procedure how to do this in the FSM. Your dealer should be able to do it.

I don't have the details, but the dealer said the car was not letting them recalibrate. Not sure what to make out of that.

 

[robotkiller]

Toyota is now attempting a manual calibration of the TRAC sensors. Crossing my fingers that this works.

 

[robotkiller]

Well I guess my truck is broken. They aligned it to spec and tried to manually calibrate the TRAC system. Still didn't take. When they took the truck out for a test drive, the steering wheel reset itself to off-center. TRAC light is still on. They have no idea what the problem is. I have a hard time believing that installing struts could wreak havoc like this. It seems bizarre that an alignment could be f**ked up so badly to cause damage. Maybe this is a warranty issue?


One question I have, that I wonder if anyone here can answer - Does KDSS need to be reset/bled? Could the sways be causing a lean that is tripping the TRAC system and causing the computer to reset the steering wheel off-center?


BTW - if anyone plans on doing this and aren't comfortable/capable/able to do it yourself, I would recommend either getting it done at Toyota or by a shop that has specific experience with this vehicle. I'm sure it will all work out in the end, but I'm feeling pretty burned right now.

 

[Antman]

I might get some flack for this, but oh well.

The dealer is not the correct venue to get this fixed IMO. They may be able to fix a stock vehicle adequately (sometimes), but have no clue with something that is aftermarket. You need a proficient shop that has performed numerous lifts, and knows what they are doing! Plenty of people have performed this lift with no issues, anyone have recommendations for this OP?

Sorry your having issues- it would be stressing me out too. Your truck is not broken- you just need to find someone who knows what the heck they're doing!

Good luck.

 

[simonj]

I think you might be screwed. I have a hard time believing that Toyota would warranty a suspension/steering/drivetrain issue when you modified the truck.

Its clear in the owner's manual that if damage is caused to the truck as a result of aftermarket parts or installations, your warranty is void with that system.

Gotta pay to play my friend. Hard lesson.

 

[robotkiller]

i might get some flack for this, but oh well.

The dealer is not the correct venue to get this fixed imo. They may be able to fix a stock vehicle adequately (sometimes), but have no clue with something that is aftermarket. You need a proficient shop that has performed numerous lifts, and knows what they are doing! Plenty of people have performed this lift with no issues, any recommendations for this op?

Sorry your having issues- it would be stressing me out too. Your truck is not broken- you just need to find someone who knows what the heck they're doing!

Good luck.

Only problem is that this is a Toyota system that's malfunctioning. Toyota has been honestly trying to help me, but yeah - they are not comfortable about the lift and really don't have any experience with KDSS.

i think you might be screwed. I have a hard time believing that toyota would warranty a suspension/steering/drivetrain issue when you modified the truck.

Its clear in the owner's manual that if damage is caused to the truck as a result of aftermarket parts or installations, your warranty is void with that system.

Gotta pay to play my friend. Hard lesson.

I'm mentally preparing for this. Obviously, this is the worst case scenario. It's hard to understand how an alignment could have gone so badly, particularly since I had no traction control or steering issues after the original lift was done. At this point, I'm even willing to throw in the towel and go back to stock if that will get things right again. I am considering having the rear spacer removed and the front dropped to .85 to see if that makes a difference - maybe just a reinstall, in general, is in order. Overall, I can't figure out what specifically is broken that would need to be replaced. No codes are being thrown and all systems check out visually and by computer. My personal take home lesson from this is to never mod a suspension again.

 

[FERAL 4R]

You know, it would be good to see some pictures of your suspension in the front...That might help some of us visualize the issue. Also, have you thought about taking it back to the place that installed it?