New to t4r, w/ some interesting production info

[KCcarguy]

Well yes and no... here in Canada the trail is 7k more than the SR5. That's a really big difference when my only grip is the soft suspension, something that can be fixed for about 1k.

Well, you guys in Canada are very lucky to have the SR5 trimmed-out the way it is. It looks great. The US model SR5 "ground effects" are my biggest complaint about my car and shame on me for not taking a closer look before purchasing. Why did they make a body kit that makes accessing the rear recovery-points impossible???? And the front access is useless if you're at any kind of angle. Anyway....My point is you could spend a lot of money on air-locker (not as reliable?), a lift kit, and in the U.S. a TE body kit.

 

[terra4r]

So your "interesting" production info is from a dealer? Remember the dealer's #1 job: Sell what we have in inventory today. Those dealers who told you about no more TE's in 2011 didn't happen to have some SR5's and LE's sitting around did they?

Usually the only production info the dealer's get (and that is the owner - the salesmen get even less) is what is shipping to them. Most dealership owners that I know could care less on the overall state of one little niche model (TE) of a niche vehicle (4Runner)compared to the Camrys, Corollas, Tacomas and Preii availability. These units are their volume bread and butter and if they (the dealer) would know anything about production it would be about their top sellers.

Well not only one dealer, 3... including the GM for central atlantic regional inventory. All were telling me none are on the building block in Japan.

Of course I could put in an order for a '12, but was just letting ppl know if they were waiting for a dealer to get an '11 TE in from overseas, its unlikely.

 

[DarkHelmet]

Jim,

Read my thread here on buying a TE and how we did it. http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/91679-2011-toyota-4runner-trail-magnetic-gray.html

Toyota stops accepting dealer orders for current model year in about May. The 4Runner is still assembled in Japan so the March earthquake really threw a wrench into the production there. Couple all that with the fact that the 4Runner is one of the lower volume vehicles for Toyota and that may lend *some* truth to what you are hearing. I don't think the dealer got it quite right though.

My research while we were preparing to buy indicated that the Trail Edition makes up about 2.5% of the total 4Runner inventory in the US right now. It probably is NOT as popular as the SR5 or Limited for any number of reasons that I'm sure the marketing folks at Toyota know about. But that doesn't mean that it doesn't sell - there is a specific market of people that will buy them. But they are making certain that supply does not outpace demand on them so they will be harder to find than the SR5 and Limited. You may have to travel to get the one you want. Search online, both on the aggregate sites like Cars.com, as well as individual dealer websites in a radius around your area. Ask dealers to look for the car you want. You'll have to do some digging to ferret out the dealers that have them and it probably won't be a local one. Our dealer was 500 miles away but part of their deal with us was to deliver the car to us as part of the negotiated price.

Good luck.

 

[terra4r]

thanks for that darkhelmet, I was just reviewing your post actually. I did a little leg work and found a few spec'd out the way I want. Got to contact some dealers and we'll see where we go from there.

 

[DarkHelmet]

thanks for that darkhelmet, I was just reviewing your post actually. I did a little leg work and found a few spec'd out the way I want. Got to contact some dealers and we'll see where we go from there.

I would really encourage you to buy the package from FightingChance.com. It is a lot of reading but you will learn so much and be in a much better negotiating position if you do. It was worth every penny and it really felt good to be contacting dealers knowing we had the upper hand when it came to information and negotiating.

*Disclaimer: I have no connection with FightingChance other than being a very satisfied customer.

- DH

 

[odyrunner]

Hi all - I have been lurking for awhile but decided to sign up as I am a new owner of a 2011 Limited.

For me, around a +120 mile radius, supply was about 25 Limiteds listed on car sites and dealer stock searches. That hits a lot of dealers. Problem was that in an entire massive region of my State only 3 were in the magnetic grey. There were plenty of shoreline blue and silver as the most common colors, pretty much zero in black or blizzard pearl white, and I never saw a red one ever. I never saw any Trail models on the lots either, but only mostly SR5s and a few Limiteds - and some dealers really only had one or two at all.

Dealers were real willing to deal on shoreline blues because they saw so many other dealers had them and they had been sitting on lots. However if you wanted what you wanted, which for me was magentic grey (or possibly black) - it was slim pickings and the dealer leveraged that fact since they sell even before they arrive on lot after they are listed as dealer's allotment. All Limiteds seem to be coming only one way on options with the third row seats and JBL/Nav.

From what I am getting, production is simply real low on 4runners, and post tsunami Toyota is certainly working different cars as a priority. From what I understand the plant they make these from (Tahara Aichi) largely makes Lexus cars, with 4Runner and Rav4s as a couple of the Toyotas produced there. Mine was built in late June. Very fresh and sold before it arrived at the dealer. It seems they trickle in across the country.

So from my perspective I see that 4Runners sell. They sell fast on the colors and options people want, and thus supply is very low. Dealers will push that as a position of power on their side on negotiating. If you want a SR5 in shoreline blue and are flex on interior, you have a larger pick of the litter to bargain with. This will probably change a little in 6 months as some dealers hint they should see more come in like before the tsunami.

Bottom line though - 4Runners sell. I would laugh at any dealer that tried to sell a different line.

 

[DarkHelmet]

...snip...

Bottom line though - 4Runners sell. I would laugh at any dealer that tried to sell a different line.

Yes and no. 4Runner sales was down almost 78% between 2007 and 2009. It then recovered partway in 2010 due to the redesign, but is still only about 55% of its 2007 levels. Sales, post-earthquake dropped by about 25%, year-over- year after a modest increase in sales at the beginning of the year.

Dealers ARE selling what they have, but Toyota isn't producing nearly as many as they were, and it isn't their highest priority vehicle to get back online following the earthquake. Simple supply and demand.

 

[DHeuschele]

LTD without skirts, etc is still no trail (and vice versus)

I would bet that if you take of the side skirts and front airdam off of a Limited put the TE 17" wheels and AT tires on it, put the same driver in it as a TE, the LTD will go anywhere a TE will go. IMHO the TE is an over priced marketing gimmick. Rear locker, terrain select, KDSS and an appearance package combined are not worth as much as the Torsen in this part of the country. My 11'LTD is my 4th T4R and is the best one yet.

Not a chance. I agree that the majority of 4x4 trails do not need lockers or KDSS but those that do could not be done with an LTD that simply had the clearance of a trail. Have you seen the KDSS in action? I have had various people gawk at the articulation even on trails were the articulation was not really required. My skid plates have taken numerous hits that likely would have disabled the vehicle without the skid plates. I did one trail recently that when I got to the trail end the gate keeper was shocked that I did it in my trail, but she really did not know the capabilities of the Trail only that it looks somewhat like a normal stock 4Runner.

I believe your Limited is very nice on the road and significantly more luxurious than the trial. I also like the Torsen but would not compare it to lockers off road (it is superior in other situations and maybe more appropriate for your usage ("your part of the country") but it is not a locker).

If you want more luxury get the LTD but if you want more off road capability get the trail.

If you want to do only easy to moderate 4x4 trails the Limited will easily work, if you want to tackle difficut 4X4 trails that require lockers, skid plates, etc. then the Trail is the best choice.

As for the cost differential, I do not believe either 4Runner can be converted to the other use cheaper than buying the correct 4Runner for your usage in the first place. KDSS, skid plates, locker, differential slippage control, Crawl,
appearance package add up fast.

 

[robotkiller]

I recently went through the PITA of finding a loaded Trail. For what it's worth, at least one dealer suggested placing an order, but gave no guarantee as to availability - generally suggesting a 3 month window. I heard from a couple that the availability of the Trail in '12 is not clear, but that could just be salestalk.

I finally found a dealer who had a TE that he traded with another dealer for a loaded TE that I have been looking for. I've heard that the dealers are not really wanting to trade out their 4runners and that they do sell. The dealer I used told me that their Trail models tend to move within days of arrival and he wished Toyota made more of them.

Again - could be all salestalk and BS, but there it is. There is no doubt, though, that inventory is low. Most dealers have only a few on hand - my closest Toyota superstore had only two 4x2s available; the rest had been sold within the week.

 

[Koz]

Toyota does not build the TR4;s to order. What happens is that a dealer requests a certain "build", and as they either come off the Assembly line built that way or close, or if that vehicle is on a boat, or at one of the three "distributors", then the vehicle will be assigned to that dealer for the customer. If the build is "close", then a distributor will add missing options if possible, or they will send the "close" vehicle to the dealer in hopes the customer will accept as is. The second option is for the dealer to do a locate to see if the same or similar build is already on another dealers lot then either trade of have it shipped to the requesting dealer. Again, however, the factory does not take orders from individuals or dealers. At least that is what I was told and it seems to be true. But any confirmation would be welcome.

This is not true, the salesman (someone) lied to you, you can special order a vehicle exactly the way you want it. It will be built specifically with the available equipment/packages you want. The only drawback is it will take approx 3 1/2 months. If you special order now it will probably be a 2012. I have done this 4 times.

Koz