Question about intakes

[Veritas]

The 4runner is pulling air from inside the fender on the passenger side... that's as cold air as you get! Drop in the K&N to that and you'll get as much as most aftermarket kits will. Maybe you didn't understand COLD AIR INTAKE as opposed to AFTERMARKET INTAKE Most intake systems stock on cars now are cold air intakes and colder air than the aftermarket intakes suck in from the engine bay. It's a joke the lack of power you get from most aftermarket systems unless you just like the noise you get from them... Pull your airbox off and look for the hole in the fender... that's where the cold air comes in.

you won't get any colder air, but you may get more air if you can pull the air from the grill to the intake.

If there was a simple way to do it I'd say lose some of the cats and just put one high-flow in their place as it'll buy you a good 30HP (removing all 3 on the 2gr-fe nets you 30-40HP to the wheels. we dyno'd 289 at the wheels as opposed to toyota's 270 at the engine). That would require an exhaust reworking, headers, and some 02 simulators for the 4runner though.

Technically, you dont have a CAI anymore. The K&N isnt a "cold air intake" since the filter isnt closed off from the hot air in the engine compartment. Volant is a true CAI.

Yes it is, that is why it comes with a heat shield! It doesn't just float there next to the engine...All around the heat shield you install a rubber gasket as well to seal it from sucking air in through the engine compartment, that only leaves it to draw air from the passenger side wheelwell! Which as you pointed out is the location where "the coldest air" is. Looks like K&N beat you to the punch. When you close the hood the rubber gasket is compressed, effectively sealing the CAI from the engine compartment.

Clearly neither of you have seen the K&N in person, yet alone installed one.

 

[Veritas]

The difference between a OEM and a well designed intake like the AFE is VOLUME. OEM was designed with three things in mind cost, emissions, and noise control. That is why it snakes around, has a hydrocarbon filter and has baffles.

This is precisely what I am getting at as well, it is no different than a muffler or a suppressor, you make it larger and include a baffle system to make the air move slower and in effect more quiet. With a straight K&N air intake it feed straight into the engine and does not starve it from air like the factory intake does, that is why you see an increase in sound and in power. Plain and simple

 

[galactic_04]

Yes it is, that is why it comes with a heat shield! It doesn't just float there next to the engine...All around the heat shield you install a rubber gasket as well to seal it from sucking air in through the engine compartment, that only leaves it to draw air from the passenger side wheelwell! Which as you pointed out is the location where "the coldest air" is. Looks like K&N beat you to the punch. When you close the hood the rubber gasket is compressed, effectively sealing the CAI from the engine compartment.

Clearly neither of you have seen the K&N in person, yet alone installed one.

clearly you didn't read my post as I never said you didn't have one. I'm simply correcting the fact that stock is a cold air intake and saying the cheaper intakes are not cold air (such as this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Toyo...ptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories).

I've run multiple setups from open stacks (lost torque) to cai. The CAI works, but they were all on engine swaps so I can't really provide before/after dyno power other than my 944. I will say I've never had a system I could say "damn, that helped a ton!"

Open stacks on the mr2 (gave up this setup even after making an intake housing):
http://pics.midsouth-mr2.com/listpics.asp?a=show&ID=24131
CAI setup (pulling in from the vents on the hood and air coming from under the tranny):
http://pics.midsouth-mr2.com/listpics.asp?a=show&ID=40675
2gr-fe MR2 pulling in the side vents:
http://pics.midsouth-mr2.com/listpics.asp?a=show&ID=43376
http://pics.midsouth-mr2.com/listpics.asp?a=show&vm=small&ID=43378
2gr-fe on the E153 transmission:
http://pics.midsouth-mr2.com/listpics.asp?a=show&ID=43369

 

[SkylineGTRracer]

Now that ebay is one of the biggest POS I have seen. kill it with fire!:gun4:

 

[Veritas]

clearly you didn't read my post as I never said you didn't have one. I'm simply correcting the fact that stock is a cold air intake and saying the cheaper intakes are not cold air (such as this: Toyota 03-08 04 05 06 07 4Runner V6 4.0L Air Intake Kit | eBay).

I've run multiple setups from open stacks (lost torque) to cai. The CAI works, but they were all on engine swaps so I can't really provide before/after dyno power other than my 944. I will say I've never had a system I could say "damn, that helped a ton!"

Open stacks on the mr2 (gave up this setup even after making an intake housing):
P1000273 (Medium).JPG
CAI setup (pulling in from the vents on the hood and air coming from under the tranny):
P1020728 [800x600].jpg
2gr-fe MR2 pulling in the side vents:
0516101850.jpg
0516101850b.jpg
2gr-fe on the E153 transmission:
0312102250.jpg

Fair enough, I see what you are saying and I agree with you, all intakes suck cold air as they are designed to, however stock intakes are generally more inefficient. We are simply arguing over semantics here, I guess I should called my K&N a "Cold Air Charger"? or a "baffleless intake" or a "straight intake" or something like that.

I think that we both can agree that when a Cold Air Intake is done correctly, with a heat shield and gasket between it and the engine bay, it absolutely works and does improve performance.

That eBay item is a travesty, I will take a picture of my K&N and post it up later today/tomorrow so you can see exactly what I mean.

p.s. the "Yes it is" was directed at Casper, not you, I read both of your posts.

 

[klennop]

Veritas, I think you are misinterpreting when some of the people are just saying K&N. There is the drop in replacement filter and then there is the "air charger" kit. So just keep that in mind.

I think the K&N "air charger" is junk because of how much they charge for it. It seems like they just put a filter on the end of a pipe and then put a flimsy "heat shield" around it. I would take the drop in filter over that kit.

However I went with the Volant in my V8. I would buy it again in a heartbeat. I noticed a small increase in MPG and HP. Don't expect a miracle but also don't believe the people that say there is no gain at all.

 

[SkylineGTRracer]

Having had both the AFE and K&N I have pics....

 

[Veritas]

Veritas, I think you are misinterpreting when some of the people are just saying K&N. There is the drop in replacement filter and then there is the "air charger" kit. So just keep that in mind.

I think the K&N "air charger" is junk because of how much they charge for it. It seems like they just put a filter on the end of a pipe and then put a flimsy "heat shield" around it. I would take the drop in filter over that kit.

However I went with the Volant in my V8. I would buy it again in a heartbeat. I noticed a small increase in MPG and HP. Don't expect a miracle but also don't believe the people that say there is no gain at all.

You are correct, mine is called the "air charger" and not a "Cold Air Intake" (again, just semantics, but apparently words have changed meaning, my fault) and yes it was expensive, but man was it worth it, I think it does an excellent job and I would buy it over any other if I had to, I am very impressed with it. Yes I also know about the drop in filters, I have one on one of my older cars. I do think the extra gain from the "air charger" is worth it for my 4runner.

http://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?Prod=63-9023

...now I need to change my signature line to read "K&N Aircharger"... lol

 

[Krazynative]

If you do go the AFE CAI, Volant CAI or K&N air charger(not drop in) you will get a rise in volume that the MAF sensor won't be able to handle correctly. You're performance will decrease and not give you the HP gains you are looking for. To correct for this, you will need a URD MAF sensor calibrator or a full blown fuel computer that can be tuned for your specific mods.

I know this from experience. I have the AFE and URD and love them. Pricey, but worth it to me.

If you noticed, Skyline has the AFE after trying the K&N. What does that say about the K&N?

 

[Veritas]

If you do go the AFE CAI, Volant CAI or K&N air charger(not drop in) you will get a rise in volume that the MAF sensor won't be able to handle correctly. You're performance will decrease and not give you the HP gains you are looking for. To correct for this, you will need a URD MAF sensor calibrator or a full blown fuel computer that can be tuned for your specific mods.

I know this from experience. I have the AFE and URD and love them. Pricey, but worth it to me.

If you noticed, Skyline has the AFE after trying the K&N. What does that say about the K&N?

Hopefully it means that at double the price of the K&N you are getting double the power.

 

[SkylineGTRracer]

Thats pretty much what it does. lol In reality the main difference between the AFE and the K&N are as follows

1. The AFE is able to achieve ambient air temps faster than the K&N.
2. You get more flowing capacity with the AFE than the K&N.
3. With tuning, (it can go off the MAF or more like spark control and timing advance/re****) makes more power with the AFE.

That basically sums it up. I have modded the K&N to the point its more of a APR/Lucario mod then a K&N intake. I'm not saying K&N is bad, its ok but for my needs I'm better suited with the AFE. When I'm autox'ing my throttle response improved as well as the torque curve and at the 1/4 my times fell by two tenths. This was when I was running F2 (F1 tune with speed limiter defeat) and had the whole factory exhaust on.

 

[Whitebeauty]

Tru tru. I agree with all. And in the end it all boils down to tuning. That to me is the most important mod to all performance applications. Like stated previously that maf doesn't like a lot of air...

 

[Dawg4Runner]

Your T4R already has a cold air intake. Don't waste your money. Try a drop-in K&N and remove the hydrocarbon filter. That will give you smoother throttle response. Talk to a shop if you want to do exhaust.

To the OP, this is the best advice right here. Yank the hydrocarbon filter and drop in a K&N or TRD filter. The oem airbox is a CAI. Unless you do some major mods like porting and polishing the heads, cam, headers and full exhaust you won't get a significant performance increase from these aftermarket CAI's. They sound cool and look cool but that's about it. So if that makes you happy and you don't mind dropping the money, go for it.

The volant box looks great, has a smoother/straighter tube then oem but that hole in the front is a great place for hot air to be sucked in. It would be better if it were covered up. I wouldn't argue that this box doesn't flow better then the oem box. It most likely does. But to what degree and at what rpm range? I doubt that its more then 3-5 hp without head work or exhaust mods. Only before and after dyno runs would confirm the gains and put this debate to rest. I wouldn't spend that kind of money just to get a few more ponies at the 4-5k RPM range. But that's just me (my priorities are all out of whack).

That K&N system has too many gaps to be considered a CAI system.