Ride Quality of Icon?

[jangoforhire]

Alright. So I am SO close to pulling the trigger on an ICON setup for the Limited. But I am still ever so slightly reserved. And I am not going to spend this kind of money unless I am convinced 100%.

SO CONVINCE ME PEOPLE!

Here are my few reservations.

1. I have the Limited so I have XREAS, and
I really like how this rides. I don't want to lose much of this ride quality. I have been driving in friends Jeeps that are lifted and all I feel is crazy body roll and the drive just feels sloppy. If I am spending $3000+ on a suspension system, my ride quality better improve substantially. I know RiDE and Harper7 have a similar ICON setup to what I am looking at. From what I have read Harper7 loves the setup, but I am just looking for some more comparison.

2. I hear a fair amount of people complaining about a serious loss of power and a harsher ride when they upgrade to larger tires after a lift. I can already feel the power is slightly lacking, but how bad is this after larger tires?

Basically my bottom line is this: I want the ability to fit larger tires, support extra weight, and perform well off-road, but I still need good on-road ability and a comfortable, stock-like, ride. Am I looking for something that is too perfect and doesn't exist? Do I need to just suck it up and live with a bit of a harsher ride to get the off road ability?

 

[Dlak]

Alright. So I am SO close to pulling the trigger on an ICON setup for the Limited. But I am still ever so slightly reserved. And I am not going to spend this kind of money unless I am convinced 100%.

SO CONVINCE ME PEOPLE!

Here are my few reservations.

1. I have the Limited so I have XREAS, and
I really like how this rides. I don't want to lose much of this ride quality. I have been driving in friends Jeeps that are lifted and all I feel is crazy body roll and the drive just feels sloppy. If I am spending $3000+ on a suspension system, my ride quality better improve substantially. I know RiDE and Harper7 have a similar ICON setup to what I am looking at. From what I have read Harper7 loves the setup, but I am just looking for some more comparison.

2. I hear a fair amount of people complaining about a serious loss of power and a harsher ride when they upgrade to larger tires after a lift. I can already feel the power is slightly lacking, but how bad is this after larger tires?

Basically my bottom line is this: I want the ability to fit larger tires, support extra weight, and perform well off-road, but I still need good on-road ability and a comfortable, stock-like, ride. Am I looking for something that is too perfect and doesn't exist? Do I need to just suck it up and live with a bit of a harsher ride to get the off road ability?

You can't go wrong with ICON' but are we talking about the dual res CO's? If we are then I can voice my opinion "best setup I have ever had" The suspension plus more meaty tires will give you a ride you won't regret (that's what she said) I have no issues with body roll at all, in fact I felt like it cornered better with the aftermarket suspension setup than the XREAS. The suspension along with wider tires make it feel more planted IMHO.

 

[joneseyyy]

When's the last time you saw someone post "Well I sprung for the ICON stuff but really after having it a while think I would've been better off with something cheaper or more basic" or "I am not impressed with a quality".

Yeah never.

You know what to do.

 

[SOcalTRAIL]

Basically my bottom line is this: I want the ability to fit larger tires, support extra weight, and perform well off-road, but I still need good on-road ability and a comfortable, stock-like, ride. Am I looking for something that is too perfect and doesn't exist? Do I need to just suck it up and live with a bit of a harsher ride to get the off road ability?

I would have to say, from my personal experience, that the Icon stage 1 would fit your bill pretty well. The thing is, you may notice a difference in the ride characteristics of the truck (slightly stiffer, etc) but you get used to it veeeeery quick. ANy of the major mfg. coilover replacements are a huuuge improvement over what comes on our vehicles from the factory. The Icons will be stiffer, but this is relative to what you are coming form, a cushy, soft, suspension setup tuned by the factory to suite the likes of the majority of drivers. You will have less body roll, less brake dive, better off road capability and a fully rebuildable / adjustable shock that will outlast the truck. It is worth it.

As far as bigger tires... bigger tires=heavier in most cases. This= an increase in un-sprung weight and rotating mass which is directly inversely correlated to your gas mileage. Its the nature of the nature of the beast. In most cases, you might see anywhere from .5mpg to 2mpg decrease in mpg depending on driving conditions, tire / wheel weight / tread design, etc... lots of factors.

Hope that helps.

 

[jangoforhire]

You can't go wrong with ICON' but are we talking about the dual res CO's? If we are then I can voice my opinion "best setup I have ever had" The suspension plus more meaty tires will give you a ride you won't regret (that's what she said) I have no issues with body roll at all, in fact I felt like it cornered better with the aftermarket suspension setup than the XREAS. The suspension along with wider tires make it feel more planted IMHO.

Yes I am talking about the remote res CO's. Ive heard some people say the rear piggy-res shocks are definitely worth the price. And for only $200 more to get the remote res's up front I think its a no brainer. Thanks for your input this is definitely what I want to hear.

I would have to say, from my personal experience, that the Icon stage 1 would fit your bill pretty well. The thing is, you may notice a difference in the ride characteristics of the truck (slightly stiffer, etc) but you get used to it veeeeery quick. ANy of the major mfg. coilover replacements are a huuuge improvement over what comes on our vehicles from the factory. The Icons will be stiffer, but this is relative to what you are coming form, a cushy, soft, suspension setup tuned by the factory to suite the likes of the majority of drivers. You will have less body roll, less brake dive, better off road capability and a fully rebuildable / adjustable shock that will outlast the truck. It is worth it.

As far as bigger tires... bigger tires=heavier in most cases. This= an increase in un-sprung weight and rotating mass which is directly inversely correlated to your gas mileage. Its the nature of the nature of the beast. In most cases, you might see anywhere from .5mpg to 2mpg decrease in mpg depending on driving conditions, tire / wheel weight / tread design, etc... lots of factors.

Hope that helps.

The Icon Stage 1 is nice, but like I said above, I read that the rear remote res's are well worth the upgrade, and for the small difference between the standard ICON CO's and the remote res's up front I am just going to get the remotes. I am not going to get the ICON UCA'a (unless I find a ridiculous deal), and I am still undecided about the rear trailing arm kit. So when it's done it will be kind of close to a Stage 5...give or take.

I can get used to a slightly stiffer ride. I just didn't want a rolling or loose feeling suspension. So it seems that this will work for me. And yes unfortunately the science is against us with the larger tires. But I can take a few MPG hit for the improved off-road performance.


What has been your guys experience with the ICON's as far as reliability goes?

 

[SOcalTRAIL]

What has been your guys experience with the ICON's as far as reliability goes?

100% in my case!

 

[harper7]

What has been your guys experience with the ICON's as far as reliability goes?

Almost 2 years and 35k miles and my Icons still feel like they day I put them on. I inspect and maintain them regularly(oil change) though which is spraying some dri-slide on the shafts,bushings and threads on the front CO's so they don't corrode and lock up .Just a little maintenance goes a long way on how long moving parts last.I'm down south ,but up north or where they use alot of road salt I would have gotten the extreme weather plating option on the shafts.

As stated they are much stiffer then the XReas and you can definitely feel the small bumps or potholes more at low speed.Heck, I could feel every knob on my mud tires below 10mph.That's the way they are valved, to be smooth and unbelievably stable taking bumps,potholes and corners at higher speeds. For instance, a typical speed bump at less then 10-15mph is pretty harsh,however take that same speed bump at 20+mph and it's like it's not even there,just eats it right up.

I found they work great going faster on fire roads where the gravel roads are bumpy and feel like rail road tracks as some of you will attest to. At slow speed they about jar your fillings loose ,go fast enough and you feel like you float over them with great handling and stabilty. They soften as the shock shaft speed increases and really work the shocks. After an hour or so cruising on fire roads in Colorado and Utah my shocks even with the remote res were pretty warm to the touch.

King Off Road has a sweet suspension set-up out now with adjustable compression specifically for our 4Runners.From research and their reputation King is another high end option I'd consider. King or OW weren't out yet for the 5ths when I bought mine or else I'd probably have Kings if the truth be told. A good read of a discussion and poll going on now over in the FJ forum between Icons and Kings....... Suspension Icon vs King - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum

The long King read....King suspension for the FJ Cruiser - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum

 

[Dlak]

30,000 miles on mine and not one issue...

 

[Qjake]

I'm down south ,but up north or where they use alot of road salt I would have gotten the extreme weather plating option on the shafts.

I'm up north and just ordered Icon's, Though I knew it was available I didn't see this option on the metal-tech site, can the shocks be sent to Icon to have this coating applied? and do you feel its really necessary.

 

[limamike]

I just ordered a set of Icons as well based on the testimony of the members here. My UCAs were delivered today; waiting for the rest of it to ship!

EDIT: Here are the Light Racing UCAs I ordered from Metal Tech

 

[jangoforhire]

Almost 2 years and 35k miles and my Icons still feel like they day I put them on. I inspect and maintain them regularly(oil change) though which is spraying some dri-slide on the shafts,bushings and threads on the front CO's so they don't corrode and lock up .Just a little maintenance goes a long way on how long moving parts last.I'm down south ,but up north or where they use alot of road salt I would have gotten the extreme weather plating option on the shafts.

As stated they are much stiffer then the XReas and you can definitely feel the small bumps or potholes more at low speed.Heck, I could feel every knob on my mud tires below 10mph.That's the way they are valved, to be smooth and unbelievably stable taking bumps,potholes and corners at higher speeds. For instance, a typical speed bump at less then 10-15mph is pretty harsh,however take that same speed bump at 20+mph and it's like it's not even there,just eats it right up.

I found they work great going faster on fire roads where the gravel roads are bumpy and feel like rail road tracks as some of you will attest to. At slow speed they about jar your fillings loose ,go fast enough and you feel like you float over them with great handling and stabilty. They soften as the shock shaft speed increases and really work the shocks. After an hour or so cruising on fire roads in Colorado and Utah my shocks even with the remote res were pretty warm to the touch.

King Off Road has a sweet suspension set-up out now with adjustable compression specifically for our 4Runners.From research and their reputation King is another high end option I'd consider. King or OW weren't out yet for the 5ths when I bought mine or else I'd probably have Kings if the truth be told. A good read of a discussion and poll going on now over in the FJ forum between Icons and Kings....... Suspension Icon vs King - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum

The long King read....King suspension for the FJ Cruiser - Toyota FJ Cruiser Forum

I was hoping you would jump in here Harper! Thanks for the detail. I couldn't find a lot of info on the King's before this. I think I had only seen one other T4R guy with the full setup...I will do some reading on them. Thanks for adding your 2 cents regarding how the ICON's ride. I hadn't heard that opinion anywhere else so far. Definitely something to consider.

I'm up north and just ordered Icon's, Though I knew it was available I didn't see this option on the metal-tech site, can the shocks be sent to Icon to have this coating applied? and do you feel its really necessary.

I am interested in this as well. In the winter up here every car magically turns white with the amount of road salt they throw on the roads.

The lower prices of the OME, toytec and OW kits are so very attractive right now...But I will have the truck as my daily driver for probably 10 years at least, so if I am doing a major upgrade (e.g. the entire suspension) I want to make sure I do it right the first time. I am a firm believer that you get what you pay for.

 

[Qjake]

I am interested in this as well. In the winter up here every car magically turns white with the amount of road salt they throw on the roads.

The lower prices of the OME, toytec and OW kits are so very attractive right now...But I will have the truck as my daily driver for probably 10 years at least, so if I am doing a major upgrade (e.g. the entire suspension) I want to make sure I do it right the first time. I am a firm believer that you get what you pay for.

My Icons have yet to ship I think ill call Metal-Tech in the morn to inquire about the extreme weather plating.

BTW The OW kits aren't cheap, got the Icon set and LR UCA's cheaper from Metal-Tech

 

[Qjake]

I just ordered a set of Icons as well based on the testimony of the members here. My UCAs were delivered today; waiting for the rest of it to ship!

EDIT: Here are the Light Racing UCAs I ordered from Metal Tech

Looking good Mike!! I can hardly wait :biggrin2:

 

[SOcalTRAIL]

Just to clear it up... the "extreme weather plating" that Icon offers for their shocks is applied to the body of the shock only, not the shaft. I believe, and I would have to double check to be 100% sure, that Icon already uses a variant of a "stainless" steel for their shafts as opposed to King who used hard chromed shafts.

EDIT: I just checked, Icon uses a "nitro steel shaft"
NitroSteel® is produced through a patented process combining nitro carburizing and surface oxidizing to produce a hard and corrosion resistant surface layer. This process produces a hard, thin, oxygen-enriched iron nitride layer at the surface of the steel (64 HRC min) with a nitrogen-hardened zone underneath. NitroSteel® offers superior performance because it is not plated or coated but STEEL itself.

Speaking of King....
I had the 2.5" Rear Reservoir shocks with the compression adjustment on my truck and while they were a great and substantial improvement over the OEM shocks, I was bothered by the fact that I only ever could run them on the most "open" or soft settings. I have quite a little bit of weight added to my rig and even with the extra weight, they were too firm for my liking at any setting past about 5 out of like 21 clicks available. Give em 12 clicks and they were stiff as hell. I guess great for someone carrying a metric butt load of weight???

Upon further research when I was deciding what to to (whether to re-valvle them or sell them) I discovered the Icon Omega Bypass reservoir shocks and went that route for my rear suspension.

If you do choose to go the King route which is a great option, I would save your money on the "compression adjusters" and just run the regular 2.5" resi's or just stick with the Icon 2.5" piggybacks. Everyone raves about those guys.

My experiences, others' may vary.

 

[T4rman]

To the OP. I ran a 3 inch lift on my 4th gen for a while with the stock upper control arms and it drove ok but not great. It took some effort to change lanes on the highway and wasnt quiet as stable. I ordered Light Racing UCAs because my ball joints went out on the stock set. Now the truck drives ten times better. I would highly recommend ordering a set of upper control arms to go with your icon lift. It will keep the steering characteristics much closer to stock and make it much more enjoying to drive. Also, you will spare some labor costs and another alignment if you install all the parts at once.

Good luck with the build!

 

[Qjake]

SOcal,

Great info thanks a bunch :thumb3:

So I'm thinking the only real issue would be keeping the adjuster rust free, I think with regular cleaning and maintenance (Harper mentioned Dri slide) that shouldn't be a problem.

 

[TaskforceRudy]

Where are you getting your Kings from? Did you just order and FJ kit?

 

[harper7]

I'm up north and just ordered Icon's, Though I knew it was available I didn't see this option on the metal-tech site, can the shocks be sent to Icon to have this coating applied? and do you feel its really necessary.

Best to call Icon or Metal-tech about if it. I talked to Jeremy at Icon before I bought mine and he said I wouldn't need it.

Just to clear it up... the "extreme weather plating" that Icon offers for their shocks is applied to the body of the shock only, not the shaft. I believe, and I would have to double check to be 100% sure, that Icon already uses a variant of a "stainless" steel for their shafts as opposed to King who used hard chromed shafts.

EDIT: I just checked, Icon uses a "nitro steel shaft"
NitroSteel® is produced through a patented process combining nitro carburizing and surface oxidizing to produce a hard and corrosion resistant surface layer. This process produces a hard, thin, oxygen-enriched iron nitride layer at the surface of the steel (64 HRC min) with a nitrogen-hardened zone underneath. NitroSteel® offers superior performance because it is not plated or coated but STEEL itself.

Speaking of King....
I had the 2.5" Rear Reservoir shocks with the compression adjustment on my truck and while they were a great and substantial improvement over the OEM shocks, I was bothered by the fact that I only ever could run them on the most "open" or soft settings. I have quite a little bit of weight added to my rig and even with the extra weight, they were too firm for my liking at any setting past about 5 out of like 21 clicks available. Give em 12 clicks and they were stiff as hell. I guess great for someone carrying a metric butt load of weight???

Upon further research when I was deciding what to to (whether to re-valvle them or sell them) I discovered the Icon Omega Bypass reservoir shocks and went that route for my rear suspension.

If you do choose to go the King route which is a great option, I would save your money on the "compression adjusters" and just run the regular 2.5" resi's or just stick with the Icon 2.5" piggybacks. Everyone raves about those guys.

My experiences, others' may vary.

Great info on the King adjustables. I see the ones now are valved specifically for the 2010+ 4runner . Are those the same ones you had.How are those Omegas? I have the piggybacks and they have been great.

Where are you getting your Kings from? Did you just order and FJ kit?

They have them valved specific to the 5th Gens(might be same as FJ)on Ebay and also at Down South Motorsports that I've seen....... King Performance Kits for All Toyota's

 

[SOcalTRAIL]

As Harper said, Down South Motorsports is by far the cheapest place out there to order Kings from. Offroad Warehouse is where I got mine, both companies order direct from King and the shocks are built on order for the most part. If I were to keep the rear adjustable kings, I was going to re-valve em slightly softer on the compression so I could utilize more of the compression adjustment range.


Harper - I did a couple runs with a buddy who has the Icon piggybacks and was pretty impressed. For the money, not sure you can beat em. The valving seemed spot on and they ate up everything we rode on.

I just spoke to Jason Demello yesterday and my Omega Bypasses for the front and rear will be shipping out this week!!!! Since I took the Kings off, I have been running OEM rear shocks again while I have been waiting for Icon to build the new Omegas. This gave me a whole new appreciation for the King shocks... as soon as I put the stock rear shocks back on and drove it, I thought to myself, damn, what a huge difference. The Icon Omegas are supposed to be great so I hope they live up to the price! I have a whole suspension makeover going on, as soon as that is done I am putting my build thread together.

 

[joneseyyy]

Socal I can't wait to get your impression of the Omega Bypasses. That is some SWEET hardware! I currently have the old-style icon mono-tube rear shocks. if I end up doing a rear bumper I may look at those in the rear or trying to get the piggybacks custom valved to handle the extra weight. ~$800/shock for the Omegas is a little rich for my blood!