some advice on TR4 project

[dirt hooker]

i just bought a mint '03 TR4 SE V8 4x4...it has 90k, 100% stock, and has lived an easy life..

now im getting ready to do some light mods to her, but before i spend any money, i know its wise to make sure everything works together as a package...so i really need some guidance from you guys so i dont waste any money or mismatch components...please keep in mind that i plan to use this as a daily driver and want to keep it as long as possible

ive decided im gonna go the Daystar 2.5" kit- i believe its 2.5 in the front and 1.5 in the rear...i plan on keeping xreas. i also want to install Spidertrax wheel spacers...now comes to tires which i want a slighly taller A/T tire..im guessing it the safest to go with 265/70/17, but im also interested in the 255/75/17 as well...im gonna start running into problems any bigger (like a 275 or 285) correct??

im really interested in getting a steel bumper up front (shrockworks, arb, demello, cbi)...any of these will be plenty strong for what im gonna do, but is there any advantages to any of them over the other (other than $)? what about tube steel bumpers- are they good for a daily driver, or are there issues w running them?...now here is where i need help...anytime ive read about steel bumpers and xreas, everyone says its not really a good idea- why cant i just upgrade the springs to accomodate the extra weight if needed? if im def gonna go w a steel bumper (and possibly a rear) should i skip daystar, ditch xreas, and get an appropriate setup...im not looking to do hardcore offroad as much as i want fenderbender protection and there are lots of deer where i drive (looks great as well!)

lastly is tire choice (ugh i know!)...im kinda sold on the Duratracs in E load, but i know there a re other great choices too...i do want a decent highway tire that is good on wet roads w occasional snow/mud...decent durabiility is also a consideration...one question about tire selection: if i go with a mild lift (daystar eg) im concerned a taller tire wil be more 'wobbly' w a steel bumper- i was thinking the stiffer sidewlls on the E load DT's will help reduce squishiness...id rather have a stiffer ride with good roadholding...can anyone suggest other good tires for this application?? i understand this is a 2 ton SUV and will never be a 911, but the xreas handles great and would like to maintain it as much as i can- i know everything is a compromise

i really appreciate any advice you can throw my way- i have read a LOT already on this great board---i will post pics as i go

 

[Doozi]

Well... I'm not really sure where to start, but there are a ton of variables to discuss.

First of all, I think you need to decide what you want the end result to be. I spent days, if not weeks, going through the "Lift and Tire" thread, scouring the internet, and weighing the pros and cons of each option.

Tires... the 265/70 or 255/75 are both good with something like the DS spacer kit, but wheel spacers would not be required. Once you add the wheel spacers, you're going to have to start trimming the bumper and moving the fender liners. Going to the 285's means spacers are required to clear the UCA's and even more trimming. E-load tires will also add a lot of weight... usually required for overland adventure, but not desirable for daily driver duty.

Bumpers... adding front and rear bumpers will add weight that will require much heavier-duty coils which, in turn, will require a heavier-duty shock to control the upgraded coils.

I'm where I am right now due to my current "toy" budget condition... FJ coils swapped onto stock XREAS with a front spacer to level the rig over 265/70 Silent Armors. I really like the ride quality and have been pretty pleased, overall, with off-road performance, but definitely have plans to upgrade. I'm at +2" in the front and +0.75" in the back... it sits nice and level, is subtly taller than stock, but lifting with the stock shocks limits suspension travel. I pull the rear tires off the ground all the time off-roading because I just don't have the downward travel or "droop" I would have with shocks designed for the added height and travel.

I'm also considering bumpers (front first, rear at a later date), but have to time that with the purchase of upgraded suspension.

There's a TON of info on this forum and also on Toyota120 and even an "Aftermarket Front Bumper" thread discussing the pros and cons.

Sorry for the long post, but I just want to try to help you think of all of the options... maybe not exactly the answers you were looking for, but there's a lot going on here! . This forum has helped me a lot and we'll help to get you squared away and into the "mod squad" for sure!

Welcome to the forum!!

 

[ARK_SWAMP_RIDER]

There are several things to think about, most have already been said.

You need to plan your lift to match the weight you plan to carry. A spacer lift on the stock xreas will not support the weight of the aftermarket bumpers. You'll need to budget more money into the lift if you're definitely planning on the added weight. There's a sticky at the top of this section that goes into the different options you have for lifts. Read this, paying particular attention to the OME and coil over sections. Those are the lift options you need to consider if adding weight is in the somewhat near future. If it's going to be 2-3 years and you just want a lift, than by all means a cheap spacer lift will do, just don't expect it to hold up to the added weight that comes with aftermarket bumpers. You can add coils like OME to the stock system, but the stock shocks can't properly control the stiffer coils. Also, OME coils will lift ~3", the stock shocks aren't made for this. Aftermarket lift shocks (OME, Bilstein 5100, etc) are longer than stock to accommodate the lift that comes with the stiffer coils.

I love the 255/75's, but the Duratrac's aren't offered in this size. I've got these and they've been great. A little taller than a 265/70 so they look better, and being narrower they seem to have less affect on gas mileage. You can go taller without major problems, just a little more trimming. Again, tire sizes and what it takes to fit them is discussed in the suspension sticky at the top of the page. Wheel spacers cause you to have to trim a little more, but it's not major. Decide what size you want and go from there.

As far as bumpers, the main one I see for the rear is CBI. As Doozi pointed out, there's a very good thread going on right now discussing the various options for the front, it's a good read and will probably help you decide.

I do believe the Duratrac (or it's cousin the Kelly Safari TSR) would be a perfect fit. If you are set on an E load rating, you're only option on 17" wheels is a 265/70/17, so that really narrows down your selection. The next size up, 285/70/17, is a D load rating.

If you want to see pics of the 255/75's, I've posted some in my build thread. I've had various lift heights all with the 255's, you can see how it looks at various heights from the pics I've posted. A link to my build thread is in my sig.

Also, here's a link to the suspension thread.
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/102272-4th-gen-suspension-options-faq.html

 

[T4RUSAF]

^agree...

For starters, your suspension plans are good up until you mention you want a front bumper. The weight up front will throw off your suspension and I don't think the x-reas is up for the task.

A cheaper solution if you want a front bumper is to get an OME lift all around with the correctly rated coils. Of course, coilovers would be ideal because you can adjust for height, but that's typically a budget buster.

 

[dirt hooker]

thank you guys for the very helpful information and suggestions- it changed my short term plans...as is usually the case, you have to upgrade things across the board so everything works as a system. im just gonna do the DS 2.5 (maybe spacers) and tires for now. the truck drives/runs perfect right now, so ill just wait to do an appropriate lift and bumpers

ASR, i read your build thread as well- i like where you have your TR4 right now- i too want too get an HID lights and maybe add a couple small things to improve performance/handling. i also really like your 'stang- its been a dream of mine to own a 3rd or 4th gen 4runner as well as a '03/04 Cobra hehe!!

do you guys feel an E load DT will be too HD for a daily driver?? i read the D load have had some issues and everyone who bought the E's was happy they did. if i go w a 255/75 tire, could anyone give me some advice what tire to go with- i also thought about Revos, Dynapro and some others, but my main concerns are they handle the wet roads well and have some decent grip/ride...interesting how you can read 100p pages about tires and still have questions lol

thanks again helping me out- im more a motorcycle guy and just learning about 4x4's

 

[ARK_SWAMP_RIDER]

Thanks for the kind words. When I sold the 'stang, I promised myself I'd have another, but as a second vehicle and not a daily driver. Like you, 03/04 Cobra's are what I'm looking at. Really want a 04 Mystic vert, but that'll be down the road.

IMO the E load range tires are overkill. If you were doing a lot of off road then they might be justified. The bad reviews I've seen on the Duratracs are all coming from heavier vehicles (3/4 ton, 1 ton trucks). Most here seem to be happy, even with the lighter load rating ones.

The Revo 2 is a great choice, as is the Firestone Destination AT. Both are a milder AT tire than the Duratrac. I would not recommend the Hanook ATM's, I'm not happy at all with mine. They were excellent for the first 15k miles. I'm over 30k miles on them now, performance has taken a huge hit. Main issue I have with them is if the roads are wet, it seems very unsafe. Wet roads almost feel like driving on snow/ice. They've also gotten very loud. I don't really have much to compare to, but my uncle runs Toyo MT's and my tires are just as loud as those. I've still got 50% or better tread, but I'll be replacing them as soon as I can, they're that bad.

There are so many great options out there, it's very hard to pick just one. When I made my tire choice, I chose the size first, and then started looking at tire models. I love the 255/75's, still considering them for my next set.

As long as you realize the limits of the spacer lift, you'll be fine. There's been a lot of people who start there and shortly after, do a full suspension upgrade. It's cheaper to get it right the first time. If your off road use is minor and bumpers are a few years out, that's when I'd consider the Daystar or other spacer lifts.

 

[honda_nos]

I have the Daystar 2.5/1.5 and for my use it has been great. I also have the SPC UCA to dial the caster back into track.

I don't wheel much and have the V8 Limited. I do periodically tow my boat and other trailers. I'll likely go to 265 65 18 or 275 65 18 in the future. I'm been thinking about the spidertrax spacers for a long time, just haven't pulled the trigger.

Also, I did all the work myself, (other than the alignment). No big deal. Good luck