Steering Shimmy

[2000se]

i guess i'll chime in here as well

got an 02 4runner sr5 2wd...bought it brand new and still driving it everyday....just rolled over 92k miles ...Put brand new tires on it 3 weeks ago (this is going to be sorta long sorry up front)

at 35k took the OEM tires off and replaced w/ goodyear silent armor fortera's 265/70/16's ...(fantastic tire) ...drove them till about 91,800 miles. So I got about ~55k out them (still had some tread life left in them but was going to take a trip and wanted new on there)..So I decided to buy a new set of the goodyears and for the life of both the tire shop and the dealership they could not get them balanced. Over 60mph the steering wheel just shimmied pretty bad. Had the tires took off the rims and dial checked the rims for true-ness and run out. They passed to my amazment with like ~.005 of an inch out. Dang near perfect roundness. All four of them where the same way. So I tried a new set mich. LTX's on there and still had a bad "balancing" problem. So I order another new set of the goodyears again...still had the balancing problem. Finally had the dealship keep the truck over night and the lead tech said that drive shaft u-joints were bad and that he just replaced another 4runner u-joints with the same vibration problem as i am having and that fixed it. That 4runner had 125K miles on it and was an 02 model as well...It is costing me $285 with a 12k mile / 1 year warranty to fix.. I'll let you now the results.

 

[Deep_palancar]

I talked to my alignment shop guy. He suggested replacing the steering rack mounting bushings. I just ordered some and will let you know how it turns out.

I'd still go back for a rebalance, the stock wheel are lug-centric. Most shops will always balance hub-centric unless they are really-really on the ball. This is a pretty common complaint with 4runner due its fairly light suspension components. A harmonic imbalance (technically out of round) can be set off by a bump which quickly changes the center of the gyroscopic force of the spinning wheel.

After fighting mine for several months I discovered the importance of the right KIND of balance. This is the best reference that I've read in one place.. http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/wheels-tires/29649-tire-balance-vibration-fix.html

Since you have ordered the steering bushing you may as well change them. If they are worn the play will be obvious around the large horizontal bolt. You will be able to see the rub marks where it is moving from side to side.

BTW, the center vertical bolt on the steering rack comes out from the TOP. The lower nut is welded in place. No amount of force or language will remove it.... voice of experience here.

 

[2000se]

update.....

picked up the truck from the dealer and he actually had the drive shaft balanced along with replaceing of the u-joints( both the front pair and rear pair on the drive shaft). I will actaully say that the shimmy has been reduced by about 85%...there are still vibs now from under the truck. I also mentioned the check valve in the steering pump and the tech said probably not because the vibs aren't in the steering to much any more..more like something bent in the drive train section.

What else could be causing this vibration.??? Lead tech is thinking of actually switching the drive shaft out of a good runner with mine to see if it is still the drive shaft. After that he mentioned 3 other things it could possibly be.

1) Bent rear axle (how hard is it to bend ? Never had it off road)

2) rear diff section (spider and ring gears etc..??)

3) bent wheel mount flang on the axle itself. Can those bend easily


What can a guy expect to pay for a new drive shaft and or a new rear diff section? This sucks... I didn't have not one problem until i took it to dis count tire to have the tires replaced. Thats all. Up untill that point the car was fine. No problems at all. Do you think it is possible that dis count tire fvcked something up?

 

[Fitz]

I'd still go back for a rebalance, the stock wheel are lug-centric. Most shops will always balance hub-centric unless they are really-really on the ball. This is a pretty common complaint with 4runner due its fairly light suspension components. A harmonic imbalance (technically out of round) can be set off by a bump which quickly changes the center of the gyroscopic force of the spinning wheel.

After fighting mine for several months I discovered the importance of the right KIND of balance. This is the best reference that I've read in one place.. http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/wheels-tires/29649-tire-balance-vibration-fix.html

Since you have ordered the steering bushing you may as well change them. If they are worn the play will be obvious around the large horizontal bolt. You will be able to see the rub marks where it is moving from side to side.

BTW, the center vertical bolt on the steering rack comes out from the TOP. The lower nut is welded in place. No amount of force or language will remove it.... voice of experience here.

Thanks for the great tips! My bushings have not been delivered yet. Hopefully this weekend I can install them. I wonder if the tires are a problem. They are Dunlop Grandtrek P265/70R16's. The wear appears to be very even, and I figure I might get another 6-8 months use out of them tread-wise.

 

[2000se]

UPDATE : FIXED 7/07/07

Had the new drive shaft installed today. It came from toyota (not aftermarket nor refurb.'d). It also came with the u-joints already installed on to it. It was pretty easy to replace... only four bolts. Any way...The truck drives great again..NO steering wheel shimmy or shakes at all. At any speed the truck is fine... The new goodyear fortera's silent armor is wonderfully quite. I am very happy again...I was really stressing over this but the drive shaft fixed it. Thanks for your help everyone. :biggrin2:

 

[Logans994runner]

Yeah have the same issue, will look into it

 

[Fitz]

Update:

I installed the new steering rack bushings yesterday. I was wondering if this project would be worth the work, so before I started, I had my wife wiggle the steering wheel while I was under the Runner. There was definitely a lot of play in the bushings, so I felt good about going ahead with the job. I started by removing the skid plate for better access. It wasn't too bad of a job, but access to the top bolt is not great. I had no room for a ratchet, so once I got the bolt loose with a 19mm wrench, I used a 3/4" gearwrench (slightly loose fit but works). There is another bolt and nut to remove from the saddle clamp that take a 19mm. Then there is the large bolt that takes a 24mm. I left the rod ends attached to the spindles, but it would make it easier to remove and replace the bushings if one end was removed. The toughest part was removing the old bushings from the rack. PB Blaster helped them slip out. The replacements appear to be made of polyurethane as opposed to the original rubber, so they are much more firm and fit perfectly.

Once I had them bolted back in, I had my wife wiggle the steering wheel again. This time there was no movement. A road test confirmed:
1. The shimmy was gone, even on the road that had caused the most noticable problem.
2. The alignment was now off (to be expected).
3. The tires need to be balanced.

Now that the rack movement is tightened up, I can feel a slight vibration that varies with speed, that I believe is tire/wheel unbalance. The alignment was perfect before I disturbed the rack mounting. I will now take the Runner in for an alignment and balance.

The bushing kit is available from autopartswarehouse.com as part number M1064-177712 for $60.95 with free shipping. I checked with the Toyota dealer and they could only get one of the three bushings!?

One other thing is that the large horizontal bolt is slightly bent. I was not sure if this is intentional, or the result of some damage. There are no signs of damage on the rack or crossmember, so I put it back in this way. Is it meant to be that way for some reason, or should I replace it??

Deep_palancar - thanks again for the tips.

 

[Fitz]

Another Update:

Unfortunately, the shimmy was not gone as I had thought. I have had the wheels balanced, had an alignment done and checked for looseness in the steering and suspension again.

This is getting frustrating. I love the Runner otherwise, but this "feature" is not good. We drove about 500 miles round trip on vacation last week, and learned that beyond about 75 mph, it smooths out again. So it shakes between roughly 60 and 75.

While looking everything over again last night, I noticed a lot of grease on the front pass side suspension. The CV boot on that side is bad and grease has been slung! I wonder if the boot was damaged during the alignment, because the grease is fresh. Could this have anything to do with the problem? The joint does not seem loose.

I am now thinking about new tires, shocks, or even a new rack assembly. I'm even thinking about taking it to an expert if I knew of one. Anyone have any ideas or know a Yota expert mechanic or shop they would recommend? Help!

 

[p nut]

Fitz,

I also had the same issue when I had my 1998. There have been long discussions on this on this and other sites. It's an issue that I never got to resolve (before it was totalled... ) On my 2002, I have not had the issue yet, but I'll probably be facing it again soon. Here is the thread that I am referring to. It does not provide a solution, but at least you know that you're not the only one with this problem.

http://www.yotatech.com/f123/vibration-issue-again-ive-had-truck-98357/

http://www.yotatech.com/f2/steering-wheel-jerks-over-bumps-but-no-excessive-play-96579/

The problem presented by the OP is not the exact problem that you are having, however, I think they are all related. My 98 was experiencing the exact same problems as yours. I hope a solution will bring itself to light soon.

 

[WOODPECKER101]

I had most of the same problems as other people on my 2001 4runner 2wd with 88000 miles ;bad vibrations and shimmying when going over bumps or just bad sections on freeways at higher speeds (50 to 70+mph). Very noticeable vibration not really pulsing when hitting the brakes. Front tires showed some cupping so had them rebalanced at Americas Tire. This helped the speed related vibration quite abit. Replaced the rack bushings ( got them at Karetech in Corona Ca. for $15) this really helped on the shimmying on rough roads or bumps. I had the rotor turned at Kragen and they screwed them up so had to buy 2 new ones. This cured the braking issues. Things were getting much better now but not perfect . Replaced the front stuts and rear shocks ( bottom bolt that holds strut assembly in is a !!@#!!! To line up by your self. Rear shocks had to cut the shock inhalf because top nut in a real pain to get socket or wrench on. Took it to alignment shop and now things our great except for some roads at high (50+) speed you can very slightly feel every seam on some freeways. The shocks seemed to be the least noticable improvement , dollar for dollar . After removing them from the 4runner they all seemed Okay , but I wasn't going to put same ones back in , especially the cut in half rears!!
Cost :
Wheel balance free lifetime with tire purchase. Americas Tire recommends every 5000 miles!?
Rack bushing kit $15
Rotors for 2 + $114
Shocks and struts(2+2) = $225 for Monroes Sensa track
Alignment $119 at Ramonas Tire

 

[Fitz]

Fitz,

I also had the same issue when I had my 1998.

Thanks for the input p nut and woodpecker. I am still having the problem, and had an appointment at the dealer for this morning, but was getting another noise which I believe I have pinpointed to be the rear driver side axle bearing going out. I put the Runner on jackstands with wheels off and lugnuts holding the rotors and drums in place. With my wife at the wheel, she ran it up to about 40mph and I found where the bearing noise was coming from. I will have the new bearing and seals tomorrow. The plan is to repair that tomorrow night. Then I can get back to the original problem.

I'm not so sure I made a good choice buying a Runner, but hopefully it will work out in the long run.

 

[p nut]

Well, you will run into issues with any other SUV's, though they may be different. I had a Jeep and I was so scared that I'd get the infamous death wobble. Sold it and now I'm back in a Toyota. Toyota's really are better made, and if you can get that issue resolved, it will serve you and your fam for a long time.

If anything, you could sell it and get a 4th gen.

 

[Fitz]

I agree, this Toy is definitely better made, even though I have been a little frustrated about it lately. At 126K, it's in great shape. I was impressed when I looked everything over from underneath. There is no rust on this 8 year old vehicle in northern IL. I see a higher level of quality in the design in many areas. The 4WD system is great- if it had a solid front axle, I could 'wheel it most places I used to take my built Jeep rockcrawler. If I had a Tahoe or something similar with similar miles, I'd probably be putting a trans in about now.....

The other night I replaced the rear wheel bearing and seals, so now I can concentrate on correcting my original problem. Soemtimes I think about an SAS, which would take care of my steering issue.

 

[oxfordethan]

I've got a '99 with 32k on it. i notice the shimmy around 70mph also. Seems like i read something about a certain type of wheel balancing machine that will correctly balance 4runner wheels. i know sounds weird.

 

[00t4rlimited]

yes there is a balancing machine that will balance tires while on the vehicle, not too many places have them but they work great! It is the most accurate way to balance but also like 4 times more expensive, I beleive only the dealers spend the money on them.

 

[Fitz]

Check the balancer out here .

You can click on "Locate a GSP9700" to find a shop with one near you. There are a lot of them around here at dealers and tire shops.

 

[Rocky Mtn High]

Hey guys. I just purchased a 99 SR5 yesterday and drove about 40 miles home with a similar shimmy. I had the same issue with my 01 Lex GS430 and replacing the steering rack bushings did quite a bit to help minimize the problem but what finally eliminated it all together was to tighten the steering pretentioner. I dont know if there is one on this truck but it was the only fix I found. The truck had a brake service done a few months ago and it was noted that the rear bearings needed replacement. I am still researching to see if that may be part of the culprit. Any info appreciated.

 

[Fitz]

I had the same issue with my 01 Lex GS430 and replacing the steering rack bushings did quite a bit to help minimize the problem but what finally eliminated it all together was to tighten the steering pretentioner. I dont know if there is one on this truck but it was the only fix I found.

Where is the pretensioner in the system? Is it part of the rack? Does anyone know if this applies to 4Runners?

 

[Rocky Mtn High]

here's what the Lexus one looked like

 

[Fitz]

Thanks. That looks like the rack on my Runner. I remember from changing my rack bushings, but I don't remember if it has that socket head adjustment screw. Can you tell me how much you turned it, which direction, etc. to get rid of your shimmy? Was it just that fraction of a turn indicated by the marks?