Sudden braking problem (when not braking)

t4rjc

New member
I was going around a corner today (getting off the freeway) at about 30-35 mph and felt a terrible grinding/braking sensation... my rig didn't really slow down and then carried on as if nothing had happened. I thought maybe my tires, which rub at times, had really rubbed hard, but replicated the steering angle and nothing was touching. Not even close.

This is actually the second time this has happened and it feels like anti-lock brakes activating randomly or something. Any ideas?

I have a 3" toytec lift (spacers up front and coils in back) and 285/60/R20 Duratracs.
 
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I have had the brakes "spring" before although only at lower speeds than that. I can't really describe it, other than I feel the brake pedal move, hear the typical abs/tc clicking, the a springing sound and it stops, maybe 5-10 seconds? I asume its a glitch in brake assist or tc. Not too worried about it, because although it is clearly a brake related problem it didn't actually physically apply, or actually impact the physical brakes. If it continues I might bring it up before I loose warranty, but it's so intermittent finding it would be a needle in a haystack.

Not sure if that's the same thing as what you experienced.
 
No beeps, but yeah, it feels like a glitch in brake control. The noise it makes actually reminds me of the ridiculous noise the vehicle makes when the roll-back-assist thing kicks in. BUT it is actually braking, but only for half a second to a second. I will ask them to look at it next time I take it in, but agree with you that it may be a needle in a haystack effort.

It worries me a bit that it's a safety issue, but it has only happened at relatively moderate speeds... ~30mph. Still concerning.
 
Any beeps? Could have been traction control if you were driving aggressive enough.

No beeps, but yeah, it feels like a glitch in brake control. The noise it makes actually reminds me of the ridiculous noise the vehicle makes when the roll-back-assist thing kicks in. BUT it is actually braking, but only for half a second to a second. I will ask them to look at it next time I take it in, but agree with you that it may be a needle in a haystack effort.

TRAC does not beep, only VSC. There have been people on here who have had to have their sensors 'zeroed' / recalibrated after their lift .Could be as you are going around a corner is is throwing your yaw/roll/pitch sensors for a loop and momentary activating VSC but not enough to cause it to beep. Doubt TRAC is your issue as I am assuming there was no wheel spin. VSC will activate brakes independently when it 'thinks' you are going to spin, like if the sensors were off and you were going around a corner. Just my thoughts.
 
Thanks, but it sounds like you are saying I would hear a beep with VSC? That could well be the issue although I am not hearing the beeping... Thanks all!
 
I was going around a corner today (getting off the freeway) at about 30-35 mph and felt a terrible grinding/braking sensation... my rig didn't really slow down and then carried on as if nothing had happened. I thought maybe my tires, which rub at times, had really rubbed hard, but replicated the steering angle and nothing was touching. Not even close.

This is actually the second time this has happened and it feels like anti-lock brakes activating randomly or something. Any ideas?

Are you sure you didn't drive on the rumble strips: rumble strip video #3.m4v - YouTube ?
 
Thanks, but it sounds like you are saying I would hear a beep with VSC? That could well be the issue although I am not hearing the beeping... Thanks all!

Yeah vsc definitely beeps. Mine may not be the same issue as yours, but mind is definitely not vsc response (although it certainly could be vsc related) as I have had it happen at extremely low speeds in 'level fight'. I also have had it happen per and post lift. I'm making it sound like it happens a lot, but really probably only 3 or 4 times in 10K
 
I was going around a corner today (getting off the freeway) at about 30-35 mph and felt a terrible grinding/braking sensation... my rig didn't really slow down and then carried on as if nothing had happened. I thought maybe my tires, which rub at times, had really rubbed hard, but replicated the steering angle and nothing was touching. Not even close.

This is actually the second time this has happened and it feels like anti-lock brakes activating randomly or something. Any ideas?

I have a 3" toytec lift (spacers up front and coils in back) and 285/60/R20 Duratracs.

Well you have huge tires on (33.5") and it is probably rubbing when the suspension compresses when cornering. It's not the same as when checking when standing still and seeing if it rubs. The outside CO compresses in a turn bringing the wheel up and back. Anything over 33" should have the body mounts chopped IMO as I have some rub marks on mine and they are only 33's. Mine had almost a 1/2" of clearance static but offroad and flexing it would rub a little in the back when the wheels were turned and I even have max caster set.

What's the backspace of your wheels?
There should be telltale marks as to what it's been rubbing on.

You really need to find out what it's rubbing on because if it's as bad as you make it out to be,then it could be dangerous. Especially if you hit a dip going around a curve,it could rip the tire open or make it hop and you loose control.
 
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Well you have huge tires on (33.5") and it is probably rubbing when the suspension compresses when cornering. It's not the same as when checking when standing still and seeing if it rubs. The outside CO compresses in a turn bringing the wheel up and back. Anything over 33" should have the body mounts chopped IMO as I have some rub marks on mine and they are only 33's. Mine had almost a 1/2" of clearance static but offroad and flexing it would rub a little in the back when the wheels were turned and I even have max caster set.

What's the backspace of your wheels?
There should be telltale marks as to what it's been rubbing on.

You really need to find out what it's rubbing on because if it's as bad as you make it out to be,then it could be dangerous. Especially if you hit a dip going around a curve,it could rip the tire open or make it hop and you loose control.



Hi Harper7 - thanks for your thoughts. All good questions and suggestions. A few thoughts and questions for you too:

1) 5" backspace (0 offset on this 9" wide wheel).

2) How do you chop the body mounts?

3) The only way I get rubbing is when the wheel is fully cranked. In this case,
since I was going around a very large freeway offramp at about 35 mph (thus not much steering angle), it is nowhere close to rubbing on the body mount or wheel well. Perhaps there is some suspension part I'm not thinking of that it might be rubbing on though? Additionally, in this case I was about 1/3rd into a very casual cloverleaf shaped offramp, there were no big humps/lumps that I noticed, and the rubbing (if there was some) did not continue or repeat although my steering angle did not change. I also stopped shortly thereafter and noticed no tire damage at all.

4) This has now happened 2x in 2500 miles. If it was truly a rub issue, wouldn't it have occurred more than that and wouldn't I have noticed it?

5) Now that VSC has been brought up, I realize that is very much what the noise/feeling is like. The truck is braking on its own and makes that strange grind noise that it makes when the truck is rolling backwards on a hill and the engine/brake system takes over to keep it in place. Very similar noise and feeling. Now, obviously that still doesn't seem like the right thing and I may need to get it checked out, but seems like a less worrisome safety issue. This would also be consistent with the fact that in both cases I was traveling pretty quick while making a turn and it seems possible the VSC panicked (or is not properly calibrated).

Anyway, just some thoughts, thanks for all the advice and thoughts Harper7 and others.
 
Similar problem, and solution

For anyone looking for answers to this same question, My rig began doing the same thing as soon as I put the lift/larger tires on it. At times, it happened in situations that would have been very dangerous if there were any snow on the road, as you momentarily lose control of the steering when the ABS/VSC kicks in.

While there was no rubbing on my wheel wells when static, I could see the marks on there where contact was made at speed. After moving the wheel well liners further forward, the problem was eliminated entirely.

It appears to me that the slight rub of the tires sends the signal that this one of the wheels is slipping, and the ABS/VSC system kicks in to adjust.

Solution: find out where it is rubbing, and make adjustments liners/body mounts as necessary to eliminate the problem!
 
I realized that when the terrain changes suddenly, or when I change gear from R to D too abruptly, the traction control light will start blinking and the ABS will kick in, it happened several times to mine...
 
I was going around a corner today (getting off the freeway) at about 30-35 mph and felt a terrible grinding/braking sensation... my rig didn't really slow down and then carried on as if nothing had happened. I thought maybe my tires, which rub at times, had really rubbed hard, but replicated the steering angle and nothing was touching. Not even close.

This is actually the second time this has happened and it feels like anti-lock brakes activating randomly or something. Any ideas?

I have a 3" toytec lift (spacers up front and coils in back) and 285/60/R20 Duratracs.

I have 3" Toytec Ultimate lift (coilovers in front) and 285/70/17 BFG All Terrains on 17 x 8 ProComps (0 offset I think). I have absolutely no scraping in the wheel wells. I cut out the areas that would touch on full turn or compression. Experienced the same thing you did a couple of times on freeway offramps. I'm certain it's the VSC kiciking in. I can recreate it on pretty gentle curves by suddenly cranking the wheel and forcing the truck to sway. At first it was pretty scarey but now I'm totally alright with it. Recreate it for fun sometimes. Might be my imagination but it seems like the system "learns". Each time it takes a little more cranking to get it to react.
 
Traction control. I got it the other day, same situation.

I believe that is it....or some type of Toyota Acronym basically boiling down to the same thing. I hit a corner hard coming into an on ramp the other day and it did just as the OP described. I can do it there time after time. I am fairly certain it is not tire rub for me as I'm still running 275/70 BFG A/T on a stock Trail Edition wheel, with an Icon lift. I wish the truck would let me drive it and stop trying to correct things that do not need to be.
 
To Blacksunshyne did you ever figure out wjat was causing the noise /abs to kick in, I just bought my 2001 4 runner 2 months ago installed a OME lift and this issue has come up more often. The suspension was shot so on hard turns Id get the same problem but not as often. I already did the zero point calibration no help so Im looking for the yaw & de-acceleration sensor
 
Might wanna post this or search around in the 3rd gen section if you have an '01 model. The 5th gen has a completely different braking system that's partially controlled by the canbus system. Pretty sure the 3rd gen does not have a dedicated yaw rate that's tied to the abs system via ecu.
 
I've been having this issue too. I had the zero point calibration last time I had an alignment but this random braking has almost tossed me off the road a couple times when going around a turn, most recently this morning.

I know someone is thinking I was going too fast but this occurs around 30-40mph and the unexpected braking was much more dangerous than my speed around a corner. It has almost caused me to crash twice and startled me more than a few times. If there was any snow on the road it could easily cause a slide into opposing traffic.

Are there any real solutions to this issue beyond the ZPC that seems to have not worked for me?
 

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