UCA comparison

[Jono.ful]

I have 30k km on my TC's and love 'em. I've had them off the truck twice now for complete cleaning/regreasing, there is no play in the uniball at all, and the bushings are still a very tight fit. I do get some squeaking, but regular grease in the zerks, and graphite spray in the uniball keeps it to a minimum.

 

[bimrunner]

I have similar numbers to Harper on my TCs as well. Don't have as many miles but expect them to work very well. Just regreasing and I'll spray if I need to but not a squeak yet.

 

[Jeremy556]

Mostly* happy with my Gen4 SPC UCAs so far at about 15K miles, but will probably get some of these SS TC UCAs if/when I break anything on the SPCs.

*Mostly - on one side, the upper ball joint boot is nearly worn through from contact with (I think/must be) the spring.

 

[b_w.]

I just installed Total Chaos UCA's a few weeks ago. After doing a lot of research seemed like the best choice. The shop I bought them from sold Icon and TC and said they sold 9 TC kits for every Icon kit.

 

[sandcrawler]

i'm in the market for some new UCAs so i'll wade in here to bump the thread and solicit some more feedback...

[MENTION=45399]thebwlife[/MENTION], [MENTION=76166]Qjake[/MENTION]: did either of you end up getting the Camburg moog ball-joint arms?

evidently there's now a cap kit for Camburg balljoint arms, so at least topside they won't be (as) exposed to dirt, sand, mud, salt, etc... Camburg does not currently offer a cap kit for their uniball arms, however.

also, there's now a cap kit for ICON tubular uniball UCAs... anyone else seen or installed these yet?

 

[thebwlife]

i'm in the market for some new UCAs so i'll wade in here to bump the thread and solicit some more feedback...

[MENTION=45399]thebwlife[/MENTION], [MENTION=76166]Qjake[/MENTION]: did either of you end up getting the Camburg moog ball-joint arms?

evidently there's now a cap kit for Camburg balljoint arms, so at least topside they won't be (as) exposed to dirt, sand, mud, salt, etc... Camburg does not currently offer a cap kit for their uniball arms, however.

also, there's now a cap kit for ICON tubular uniball UCAs... anyone else seen or installed these yet?

I didn't because I've had 50K of over runs on my house being built and the budget for the toy is gone! I'm going to do 5100's at 1.75" in the front now w/ 275/70/17's BFG's and shouldn't need them. It should be in the late winter or early spring when I do all that.

As for a dust cap, just get some silicon (caulk) and fill it up to the greese zerk and get a zerk cap. It would be easy to remove and cost about $2. I don't blame you for looking outside of the LR, they have just had to many problems for me.

You can't go wrong with either brand.

 

[sandcrawler]

I didn't because I've had 50K of over runs on my house being built and the budget for the toy is gone! I'm going to do 5100's at 1.75" in the front now w/ 275/70/17's BFG's and shouldn't need them. It should be in the late winter or early spring when I do all that.

As for a dust cap, just get some silicon (caulk) and fill it up to the greese zerk and get a zerk cap. It would be easy to remove and cost about $2. I don't blame you for looking outside of the LR, they have just had to many problems for me.

You can't go wrong with either brand.

right now i'm going back and forth, wavering a lot... either capped ICON tubular or capped Camburg balljoint—contingent upon being able to get the same alignment adjustability with the Camburg balljoints as you can with the uniballs.

or, should i choose to throw the cap kits to the wind and resign myself to whatever rust and rebuilds may come, it's a tossup between the Total Chaos and Camburg uniballs. seems to be a lot of happy users of both; maybe TC a hair ahead.

 

[thebwlife]

right now i'm going back and forth, wavering a lot... either capped ICON tubular or capped Camburg balljoint—contingent upon being able to get the same alignment adjustability with the Camburg balljoints as you can with the uniballs.

or, should i choose to throw the cap kits to the wind and resign myself to whatever rust and rebuilds may come, it's a tossup between the Total Chaos and Camburg uniballs. seems to be a lot of happy users of both; maybe TC a hair ahead.

The camburgs are a bigger uniball - 1.25" vs 1" I believe. Both of which would be over kill for me.

 

[sandcrawler]

apparently the ICON tubular arms now use a stainless steel uniball too (1") so it evens the field in that respect.

 

[sandcrawler]

also... Camburg uniballs now incorporate flush-mount hardware so they may be able to accommodate a cap kit—like the one available for the ICON tubular UCAs. i've sent Camburg an email asking if they plan to offer a uniball cap kit and will post back up when i hear...

 

[hrod79]

What will the out of spec Caster do to tire wear and drive characteristics?

 

[Jeremy556]

What will the out of spec Caster do to tire wear and drive characteristics?

Nothing on tire wear, but it will be twitchy at higher speeds.

 

[Ttn333]

What will the out of spec Caster do to tire wear and drive characteristics?

It could be damn scary and dangerous in high speed.

 

[sandcrawler]

Camburg uniball cap kit = SOON

hey y'all.
did some more digging and wanted to post my findings again here in this thread.

i spoke with Camburg yesterday... super friendly, knowledgable, and happy to answer questions. i hung up the phone impressed. good news: in ~6 weeks Camburg will have a cap kit for their 1.25" uniball arms. apparently the cap will be backwards-compatible with existing Camburg (flush-mount) uniball UCAs in the field too, so that's cool. :trophy:

obviously a cap doesn't entirely prevent a uniball arm from requiring additional care, lubrication, or service; the underside is still exposed, of course. but the cap does at least prevent muck from constantly making itself at home topside, where you don't have gravity working with you to purge debris as you do on the underside.

apart from that, another point of comparison between brands is materials and a helpful read on that can be had on this thread here....

in a nut, ICON tubular arms are made from 1026 DOM steel tubing with a 4130 chromoly uniball cup, whereas Camburg and total Chaos are made of entirely (non- heat-treated) 4130 chromoly tubing. Camburg heat-treats thinner chromoly tubing for race applications to boost material strength while still achieving critical weight-savings, but they've been making a rock-solid product for applications like our own for years with the non- heat-treated chromoly. the ICON rep who posted in the referenced thread adequately explains their rationale for the 1026 steel tubing, so i won't reiterate it here.

honestly, my takeaway is that for most of us here we're not going to push either material beyond its limits, so simply choose whatever suits you better.

 

[sandcrawler]

also, [MENTION=76166]Qjake[/MENTION]: a little more info on Camburg's moog balljoint arms i forgot to include yesterday...

basically, Camburg developed the moog balljoint arms as a "happy compromise", so to speak. the moogs are not manufactured to the same tight tolerances as the Toyota balljoint (which is very, very well made). you can of course reuse and press your existing factory balljoints into the Camburg arms, but by the time someone is in the market for new UCAs, they likely have X,000 miles on their OEM balljoints, and since you can only buy the Toyotas as part of a complete arm assembly for $$$, the moogs provide an option for a brand new part, at a significantly reduced cost, but at a lesser quality than OEM.

 

[thebwlife]

also, [MENTION=76166]Qjake[/MENTION]: a little more info on Camburg's moog balljoint arms i forgot to include yesterday...

basically, Camburg developed the moog balljoint arms as a "happy compromise", so to speak. the moogs are not manufactured to the same tight tolerances as the Toyota balljoint (which is very, very well made). you can of course reuse and press your existing factory balljoints into the Camburg arms, but by the time someone is in the market for new UCAs, they likely have X,000 miles on their OEM balljoints, and since you can only buy the Toyotas as part of a complete arm assembly for $$$, the moogs provide an option for a brand new part, at a significantly reduced cost, but at a lesser quality than OEM.

Moogs also have a grease zerk vs a "lifetime" grease on OEM.

 

[YotaDan]

We do offer the Camburg BJ UCAs with Moogs Pre-Installed.
Camburg UCA - 310040 "Ball-Joint" Upper Control Arm Set with Moog Ball Joints Pre-installed

 

[Qjake]

[MENTION=29376]sandcrawler[/MENTION], Thanks for taking the time to share the info from your research, much appreciated! :thumb:
[MENTION=87036]YotaDan[/MENTION], Are both the Camburg arms, ball joint and flush mount uniball a +2 caster as compared to the stock arms? Also do you have an idea of when the new "capped" uniball arms will be available to you? TIA

 

[RG79]

Here is a link to a video of a 4th gen with icon uca's. I now have a new level of respect for all icon products and feel they are one step ahead of the competition.

ICON Vehicle Dynamics S2 Modular Performance System Barstow, CA High-Speed Test - YouTube

 

[thebwlife]

Here is a link to a video of a 4th gen with icon uca's. I now have a new level of respect for all icon products and feel they are one step ahead of the competition.

ICON Vehicle Dynamics S2 Modular Performance System Barstow, CA High-Speed Test - YouTube

I don't have a dog in either fight but Camburg is pretty well known in the offroad racing community also. As is total chaos...