2019 SAS 5th gen Build

[4rNCMTNs]

Week 3 update

Sorry the delay in updated and in advance of no photos yet in this thread.

Many things have transpired and the most disappointing item is the tires. I purchased the 40" Mickey Thompson tires roughly 7-8 weeks ago for $471 each and we kept getting excuses on why there were not being delivered. We purchased them from the parent company of 4wheelparts. Many times they told us the truck delivered the tires to our warehouse in FL and you will have them in two weeks.

Now funny how in the middle of this the price of the tires went up about $100 each, so no wonder they didn't deliver them to us. So we cancelled the order and went in a different and more extreme direction which I will share soon but never expected to do so soon.

So what has happened in the past 2 weeks:

1. new tires ordered and revised wheelbase will be a staggering 124"
2. new tires delivered and mounted on the beautiful powder coated wheels.
3. relocating fuse block most likely to original battery position.
4. frame all ground and ready for links
5. gas tank removed - and it's not going back in :tongue:
6. 4 link rear suspension designed and will be installed within 2 weeks.
7. Front 3 link about finished with design but still some thinking to do with all the packaging.
8. Radiator and fan removed - going with a larger 4 core radiator and electric fans.
9. I originally went with a drop pitman arm and need to return it for a flat undrilled on to give us more flexibility.
10. Frame stiffeners will be welded on very soon.
11. Remove final two rear crossmembers.
12. Cut the front ARB bumper about 6" back and rear LFD about the same. We will not cut the rear of the front wheel well nor the front of the rear wheel well. Have a plan in step 2 to cut the rear frame a little and move the rear LFD bumper forward 2+".
13. in the next few days rear aluminum links and 1 1/4" ends for 1" bolts will be ordered. May put top links through the floor in middle of where batteries were relocated to. Will determine this very soon.
14. Block off plate for oil filter and lines rerouted to my original remote filter (to be relocated.
15. thinking of moving air intake to driver side from passenger. this is still a work in process.

So in summary a lot going on and the goal is still bring it to ATR over labor day weekend in TN. It may not be 100% done but goal is to have it drivable and out on the trails.

Stay tuned to start seeing some very awesome photos and videos.

 

[4rNCMTNs]

New tires

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[4rNCMTNs]

mid week update

So here we are in the middle of week 4 and 5 weeks to until ATR.

I was up to see the 4R yesterday but not much to take pictures of just yet, it's coming, I promise.

some changes from my last post which still make me shake my head but we have already gone so far it was an easy decision. Let me explain.

After our tire fiasco and searching up side down and backwards for an acceptable 40" tire the choice came down to some from Interco and a brand i don't remember. the one from Interco was not one I wanted and then we found these other Mickey Thompson's available but naturally it come with a catch. Maybe you see it in the photo above or not but we have purchased stickies and not just 40" stickies but 43" x 14.5" stickies. :boom:. I never in my wildest thoughts imagined going this big at this point but here we are. So yes I will be looking for a second set of tires as I still will drive this on the road some. Mainly short trips, for any wheeling trips far away, i'm currently looking to sell my LC200 and buy something with more towing capacity. for ATR I will not have second set of wheels and tires and it will be towed with BudBuilts F550.

So where are we this week? We are dealing with small things but some great vendors in the midst of the ever present excuse of Covid-19 for shipping late. First the end of last week we determined using the Saginaw steering box just wasn't going to work for us, rear suspension parts, and fuel situation.

So now where are we?

On Monday I spoke with Jeff from Howe about our predicament with packaging the saginaw steering box and we have decided to go full hydro. As has been typical with Howe they had it in stock and shipped it the same day and it will arrive today. I have nothing but great things to say about them and nothing good to say about their main competitor.

On Wednesday all the parts for the rear 4 link were ordered. As above, again nothing but amazing service from Wide Open Design. They produced the rear links to our spec and shipped them along with the heims, rear axle truss, and other brackets yesterday for delivery on Monday. For my links we have ordered the solid 7075 aluminum drilled and tapped to our spec. To connect them, we are going with 1 1/4" heims with 1" bolts. This things will be a tank.

Speaking of tanks; I went up yesterday to discuss and research further the fuel tank / cell. I purchased and have received the very first reduced height #Air down gear up platform and drawers. Our plan in to install a fuel cell in place of one drawer. Do do this we may need to modify the center legs to achieve a full 18" wide fuel cell. We are still looking to find a fuel cell in the 18x22 range and depth tbd but no issue as we will cut the floor and have the cell partially above and below the body.

I will have new pictures / videos up next Saturday, 7 Aug. By that time the frame plating, rear suspension will be just about fully installed, and front steering with at least orbital and ram mounted to front axle. This is a lot more exciting the me posting photos of the frame ground to bare metal.

 

[4rNCMTNs]

End of week 4 update

Week 4 ended the 4R going on a diet.

Yesterday there as a bit of cutting of the body / bumpers to get the tires to fit. this is all done until the suspension is installed to test everything. The photos below show was should be full compression.

The engine has been raised 2" and due to the whipple supercharger we will also have to trim a little of a few of the hood braces.

Tomorrow the rear links will get welded in and steering ram mount mocked up.

Hopefully by the end of the week the last two parts from Howe will arrive so we can start to mount the steering system since we would like to finish rear suspension this week and start on the front.

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[4rNCMTNs]

A sad day

As we are progressing with this build I have made the difficult choice to sell my '13 LC200 and get something larger for towing to further away places.

For Sale - 2013 LC200 Hickory NC - $42,500 - 133,500 miles | IH8MUD Forum

I fully intend to have a second set of tires to drive the 4R locally but driving to TX, UT, CA, etc just doesn't sound fun.

 

[4rNCMTNs]

Rear Axle almost ready to be mounted

Now we will start seeing a lot more building and less tearing apart.

Today as I mentioned last week we started on the rear axle. All parts arrived yesterday so mounting the rear axle is immanent.

We didn't want to mount the upper links so high up but that's what gave us the best results. It will be braced and be plenty strong. We have measured and checked and measured again and should have no interference with the floor under full compression but it will be close.

The following items were accomplished:

1. Welded truss to rear axle
2. Mounted and welded the pinion tie in guard
2. Mounted lower link tabs
3. Mounted half of the upper link tabs
4. Welded sliders to frame
5. Tacked the lower link tabs to frame
6. Upper link tabs welded together and will be tacked to frame first thing in morning

Tomorrow rear axle will be mounted with 4 links and then check all clearances, work on coilovers, and finish any cutting required.

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[rdruss]

Good thing you're having to cut a lot off because that rear axle doesn't look light! What's it from, a D8 Cat?

 

[4rNCMTNs]

Good thing you're having to cut a lot off because that rear axle doesn't look light! What's it from, a D8 Cat?

Yes it looks heavy but both axles on the pallet weighed in the very low 900# range so without pallet let's say 425-440 on average each. It's a very common rear axle to use in back for SAS's but not as common to use for both front and rear. Their origin is from HD trucks.

The 14 bolt axle was originally from chevy/gm in vans, HD trucks, and the suburban. As I mentioned in first thread, the foundry who made these has closed so new ones are hard to find if not impossible. However hope shouldn't be lost as there's still the junk yard, which is not as easy as it was in past. Now I've discovered the new Ford super duty trucks are using a new 14 bolt which I suppose is sourced from AAM. No idea with Chevy and Dodge use in back today on their HD trucks.

 

[4rNCMTNs]

Week 6 update

Sorry been a bit slow in getting updates or photos as this forum for some reason is just a pain for uploading photos. ih8mud is so much better. In any case.

Since my last update a little bit has changed:

1. We have moved the rear 4 link forward 1".
2. We have decided to forgo the 3 link front with panhard bar and go with a 4 link in the front as well. this was the reason for changing the rear and increase ride height by 1.5". this was a compromise we decided to make. Of course going up 1.5" and now full 4 link all around it will be crazy flexy and sexy.
3. The engine has been been raised 1.5" and we had to trim some hood supports a little for the hood to close due the supercharger.
4. Front Ram has been mounted with some additional protection built in.
5. Front pinion guard installed and tied into the ram mount protection. this was featured on Wide Open Designs instagram page this week
6. today we started on the link placement and installation of front 4 link.
7. Also today we identified a suitable gas tank to use and will order on monday.

It's crazy to think but we are still planning to be at ATR on 2 September.

 

[BorotHex]

^^^ Put Tapatalk on your phone and load pics almost as fast as you can take them!

 

[csommers]

Great progress so far! Looking forward to seeing the end result.

 

[sansin]

Whoa amazing work!


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[4rNCMTNs]

Here's a few photos from the past few weeks.

Hopefully within this week I will be able to post more pictures of the front four link and the completely welded rear four link.

The goal is to have it on the ground under its own weight by the end of this week.

It's awesome that both the front and rear links are all the same size so I'll be carrying one spare with me along with a one spare tie rod for the front steering.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

 

[4rNCMTNs]

A few more photos from beginning of this week.

Front links will be done at laser cutter on Thursday so links should all be welded up by Friday morning for front 4 link.

Today frame stiffeners cut and tacked up. They will we welded along with all rear links tomorrow.

Below is the nearly finished front axle steering rack mount. The front is removable for front diff maintenance.

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[4rNCMTNs]

Missed one photo

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[Chrisw023]

Great looking build so far! Cant wait to see some trail action with it. Makes my 80 series on 37's look little lol.

 

[ahtoxa11]

Thanks for keeping the updates going, man. I've been following closely.

You don't have to answer this, but what is your projected budget for the swap? Knowing how these things go and how quick changes and unexpected expenses run up, I'd be really interested in the ballpark. Also, how much of your own labor are you putting in vs. a shop having to do it all?

 

[4rNCMTNs]

Great looking build so far! Cant wait to see some trail action with it. Makes my 80 series on 37's look little lol.

Me neither. Once done with phase 2 which is this part of the build I will start putting more videos up on my youtube channel which is very sparse at the moment. I hope to get an update video up this saturday.

I'm sure your 80 with 37's is very capable.

 

[4rNCMTNs]

Thanks for keeping the updates going, man. I've been following closely.

You don't have to answer this, but what is your projected budget for the swap? Knowing how these things go and how quick changes and unexpected expenses run up, I'd be really interested in the ballpark. Also, how much of your own labor are you putting in vs. a shop having to do it all?

I went into the project with a budget and we are staying relatively close to it. I planned for some of the "unexpected" which always happens regardless how much pre-planning happens. I have not added up everything yet to see where I am on the parts, as we still have a few more small things to purchase. As I wrote in the beginning of this, a large part of the expense were the brand new 14 bolt axles front and rear. I could have gone with less expensive options but the labor / time would have gone up to clean them up, change gearing, add lockers, etc. This is not a project for the faint of heart, but it will give my family years and years of fun and memories.

One could certainly go with radius arms or a more simple suspension, smaller tires, smaller axles like D60's at a lower price. We have refined the rear suspension three times before the final welding which is happening today. We played with the suspension calculator a lot for the both rear and front suspension to find the optimal suspension choice while keeping all 8 links the same length, making keeping a spare very easy.

The items which have changed from the beginning are:

1. Originally were going to go with a reverse 4 link like T40R in the rear and not remove stock gas tank. Of course this is gone and we have now done a 4 link in the rear and replacing the gas tank with something different.
2. Started with 3 link in front with semi-hydro steering and now going full hydro and 4 link in the front.
3. 40" DOT legal tires now 43" stickies due to crazy lead time issues. This was a big unexpected change in the entire build.
4. May still change stock radiator for something larger, not sure yet.
5. Went with 16" shocks originally and thought about going to 14" but lead time was crazy so we are staying with 16" and should not have to go through the hood.

We only have small items left like brake lines, etc to purchase so we are close to having all parts on site. Only missing some minor pieces like RCV big bell front axle shafts where were ordered the end of May, steering pump, and pressure relief valve from Howe. We may have a short term work around if we do not get the new pump, but without front axle shafts it may prove to not matter

This is all I can remember now.

As for who is doing the work, I have not done much and it's all BudBuilt in Hudson, NC. I performed the entire battery relocation short of the physical building and bending of the box. I rerouted all wires and cleaned up from what I had done previously. Past that since I travel a lot, and I only see the build in person on Saturday's, I help with just simple general labor things or watch the amazing work being done.

The primary builders are:

Bud Rosenberger
#wheelin_with_willy
Chip Rosenberger
@azuber45 - don't know his last name but very strong on the suspension design and other items. He works at a shop in Charlotte which does a lot of LS swaps.

 

[JAXJeremy]

that's freaking stout..you certainly didn't spare any expense.