Irish Mike
New member
OK, well it comes to us in Toyota branded packaging. I am fully aware of who makes the oil. Just saying that is what we are required to use when we perform a Toyota Care service.
5th Gen Oil Recommendation? New Owner!
- Thread starter Hammer0313
- Start date
OK, well it comes to us in Toyota branded packaging. I am fully aware of who makes the oil. Just saying that is what we are required to use when we perform a Toyota Care service.
delloro
New member
I think we all know that.
"Rebranded" What is the original "brand"?
"Low end"? Says who? Just what are those "ends" you speak of?
"Mobil oil"? Which one?
It sounds like you believe ExxonMobil is slapping a different label on their cheapest "synthetic" retail motor oil. Given that nobody has identified an available motor oil with the same composition, it is much more likely that Toyota outsourced their motor oil production to one of the biggest producers of synthetics, and spec'd a unique product. That's more like "custom" or "tailor-made" than "rebranded."
Respectfully, how would you (or any of us, for that matter) know what a nice additive package is? What are your qualifications to determine what is nice, better, or worse? I did well in the usual subjects (O-chem, physics, calculus), but that just helps me be literate in reading the pros' work. It does not put me in a position to advise them on their work.
Do they offer measurable operating benefit to the consumer? What data do you have that Toyota Genuine Motor Oil 0w-20 does not protect adequately for the realistic life of our cars? 300,000 miles or more? If an oil was twice as good in whatever specs bandied about on BITOG, but offered no measurable difference to the consumer, except a slimmer, low-drag pocketbook, how is that "superior"?
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LandCruiser
New member
Somewhere, not on this forum, in the far reaches of Hell traffic of the bay area, is the fourth owner of a fifth generation with 240,000 miles on it who inherited from an aunt who got it from her brother who got it from his dad who doesn’t remember when was the last time they had the oil changed at Shitty Lube and it still is running fine.
2016 4Runner SR5
Senior Member
Every dealer service bay I’ve ever seen pulls their oil from a 500 plus gallon drum of who knows what brand oil. I’ve yet to see a dealer use oil out of a Toyota branded bottle. It’s just whatever bulk oil they get. Maybe the dealer you work for is different, who knows.
1000MPH
Senior Member
Yeah they contract with a local distributor. You can usually tell from signage around the shop or the windshield sticker or even on their website. I would expect these distributors can also supply TGMO.
Flyers Energy Dist has taken over around here
Mobil Lubricants - Mobil Oil Products Distributor
Here’s what my local dealer’s webpage looks like.
Flyers Energy Dist has taken over around here
Mobil Lubricants - Mobil Oil Products Distributor
Here’s what my local dealer’s webpage looks like.
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Tuco S.
New member
Well surely they must have changed the factory fill at 1000 miles, then the next one at 3000 miles, and the next at 5000 miles, and so on, otherwise the engine would have exploded by now.
ElectroBoy
Banned
That’s why the fifth owner is now doing a $35 UOA to monitor the “wear metals” and oil chemistry every 5000 miles. :lmao:
Irish Mike
New member
We definitely have bulk oil, it is pumped through overhead reels and we have multiple grades available. However, for Toyota Care vehicles we have to use bottled "Toyota" oil.
I don't think it's any better than the bulk stuff we get from the local Mobil supplier but that is what we have to use per Toyota.
Hammer0313
New member
Did 5000k+ miles in 13 days out west wheeling and back to Florida and dialed in a Fantastic report. Had low octane gas for about 1300 miles and the engine ran poorly but it didn’t have any negative affects. I must say this report really surprised me; bad gas, a vicious head wind and loaded down with gear at elevation put some severe duty on the engine and transmission but all is good under the hood.
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What octane was used to make engine ran poorly?
Hammer0313
New member
86 octane!
EddieV4runnin
New member
Probably filled up and got a bad batch of gas. High alcohol content will cause engines to ping under load.
MidniteTRD
Member
incredibly low iron (steel parts) wear. flashpoint looks...bizarrely high, but blackstone isn't known for accuracy on that and its not an issue with our engines anyway.
you could easily extend your changes, but otherwise do nothing else different and drive it as hard as you want.
Hammer0313
New member
If anyone is an oil nerd like me you've heard of Rat 540; he's either loved or hated like most everything in life. However his latest test on the "NEW" Quaker State Full Synthetic oil that replaces the older Quaker State Ultimate Durability oil is in the top spot. Ranked Number 1 out of 242 oils tested.
Thoughts?
Rat 540:
5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” (abbreviated QSFS), dexos 1 Gen 2, ILSAC GF-6A, API SP = 152,674 psi
And that psi value sets a WHOPPING NEW ALL-TIME RECORD for motor oils that I have put through my Engineering Torture Test on motor oil. It was tested in Spring 2021.
This new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil replaces the previous 5W30 Quaker State “Ultimate Durability” (abbreviated QSUD) synthetic.
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD
The psi value of this new oil, which came from testing it at the normal operating test temperature of 230*F, put it in the FANTASTIC Wear Protection Category. However, I went on to also test this oil at the much higher temperature of 275*F. At that elevated temperature, most hotter and thinner oils typically experience a drop in Wear Protection Capability. But, even at that elevated temperature, this oil produced an extremely impressive 148,133 psi, which was only a small 3% drop in capability. And that value still kept this much hotter and thinner oil in the FANTASTIC Wear Protection Category.
I also tested this oil to find out its onset of thermal breakdown, which was 290*F.
This new oil was purchased at Walmart. And its truly amazing performance is further proof that Walmart is selling legitimate motor oil, even though their prices are extremely low compared to typical Auto Parts Stores.
Many of us who have been devoted users of the previous Quaker State “Ultimate Durability” motor oil, were concerned that Quaker State’s Corporate bean counters might get their hands on this new Quaker State “Full Synthetic” oil, and cut costs that would ruin the oil. Fortunately, as it turned out, that did not happen. And in fact, now this latest new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil, is BY FAR, the BEST PERFORMING motor oil that I have ever tested. This is absolute proof that Quaker State REALLY knows how to formulate motor oil.
This new “Full Synthetic” motor oil has set the bar so high, that it is the oil I will be using in my own vehicles from stock to High Performance, from now on. And it is the motor oil that I will recommend to my Blog readers for most water cooled, gasoline powered engines, that can use 5W30. This is especially THE “go to” motor oil for traditional flat tappet engines to provide the utmost in protection against wiped cam lobes.
Never say never, but it is hard to imagine another motor oil ever producing numbers this amazing.
Here is a back to back comparison of the new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” and the old 5W30 Quaker State “Ultimate Durability”.
NOTE: The Higher the psi value, the Better the wear protection capability. And the Higher the onset of thermal breakdown value, the Higher the oil temperature can reach before the oil begins to deteriorate due to heat.
QSFS at 230*F = 152,674 psi
QSFS at 275*F = 148,133 psi
QSFS onset of thermal breakdown = 290*F
*****
QSUD at 230*F = 133,125 psi
QSUD at 275*F = 115,764 psi
QSUD onset of thermal breakdown = 275*F
The only possible concern about this amazing new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil, is that it might be “too good” for use in wet clutch motorcycles. Because of the potential for possible clutch slipping. So, testing will be required to determine that.
Thoughts?
Rat 540:
5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” (abbreviated QSFS), dexos 1 Gen 2, ILSAC GF-6A, API SP = 152,674 psi
And that psi value sets a WHOPPING NEW ALL-TIME RECORD for motor oils that I have put through my Engineering Torture Test on motor oil. It was tested in Spring 2021.
This new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil replaces the previous 5W30 Quaker State “Ultimate Durability” (abbreviated QSUD) synthetic.
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD
The psi value of this new oil, which came from testing it at the normal operating test temperature of 230*F, put it in the FANTASTIC Wear Protection Category. However, I went on to also test this oil at the much higher temperature of 275*F. At that elevated temperature, most hotter and thinner oils typically experience a drop in Wear Protection Capability. But, even at that elevated temperature, this oil produced an extremely impressive 148,133 psi, which was only a small 3% drop in capability. And that value still kept this much hotter and thinner oil in the FANTASTIC Wear Protection Category.
I also tested this oil to find out its onset of thermal breakdown, which was 290*F.
This new oil was purchased at Walmart. And its truly amazing performance is further proof that Walmart is selling legitimate motor oil, even though their prices are extremely low compared to typical Auto Parts Stores.
Many of us who have been devoted users of the previous Quaker State “Ultimate Durability” motor oil, were concerned that Quaker State’s Corporate bean counters might get their hands on this new Quaker State “Full Synthetic” oil, and cut costs that would ruin the oil. Fortunately, as it turned out, that did not happen. And in fact, now this latest new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil, is BY FAR, the BEST PERFORMING motor oil that I have ever tested. This is absolute proof that Quaker State REALLY knows how to formulate motor oil.
This new “Full Synthetic” motor oil has set the bar so high, that it is the oil I will be using in my own vehicles from stock to High Performance, from now on. And it is the motor oil that I will recommend to my Blog readers for most water cooled, gasoline powered engines, that can use 5W30. This is especially THE “go to” motor oil for traditional flat tappet engines to provide the utmost in protection against wiped cam lobes.
Never say never, but it is hard to imagine another motor oil ever producing numbers this amazing.
Here is a back to back comparison of the new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” and the old 5W30 Quaker State “Ultimate Durability”.
NOTE: The Higher the psi value, the Better the wear protection capability. And the Higher the onset of thermal breakdown value, the Higher the oil temperature can reach before the oil begins to deteriorate due to heat.
QSFS at 230*F = 152,674 psi
QSFS at 275*F = 148,133 psi
QSFS onset of thermal breakdown = 290*F
*****
QSUD at 230*F = 133,125 psi
QSUD at 275*F = 115,764 psi
QSUD onset of thermal breakdown = 275*F
The only possible concern about this amazing new 5W30 Quaker State “Full Synthetic” motor oil, is that it might be “too good” for use in wet clutch motorcycles. Because of the potential for possible clutch slipping. So, testing will be required to determine that.
ElectroBoy
Banned
Brace yourself, you’re gonna get a load of shit for invoking the name of Rat. LOL!
BTW, I’ve been using QSUD 5W30 and it works great for me. I’ll take a look at QSFS for future oil changes.
BTW, I’ve been using QSUD 5W30 and it works great for me. I’ll take a look at QSFS for future oil changes.
DougR
Member
I found published reasoning for why Toyota recommends 0W-20 in the USA and higher viscosities in other countries in a Google search. “When was 0W-20 motor oil introduced in Europe?” revealed this link The Rise of SAE 0W Lubricants - Lubes'N'Greases
“The European market traditionally leaned toward slightly heavier oils than North America, but German carmakers Daimler, BMW and Volkswagen are all expected to introduce original equipment manufacturer specifications that include, SAE 0W-16 and 0W-12 as early as 2020.” (10 years after the US)
I think the historically high percentage of diesel powered passenger vehicles that typically use higher viscosity oil affected the pace at which 0W oils are adopted in foreign markets. Fundamentally, it’s about marketing … selling what people will accept or are mandated to accept.
Toyota’s oil viscosity recommendations for the 2021 EURO Land Cruiser, and 2021 UAE FJ Cruiser specify 5W-30 and 10W-30 and up to 15W-40 for operation at high speeds or extreme load conditions.
I’m using QSUD 5W-30 and also looking at QSFS 5W-30 ILSAC GF-6A.
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MidniteTRD
Member
my last oil change used QSUD 5W-30 and while wear performance was "fine", the TBN was pretty weak. i was down to 3.6 by 5200 miles. i've seen other UOAs showing it under 2 at 7,000 miles. i'll consider running it again if i see that it's got an improved additive package to last longer.
Lexington
Member
When I first got my 4Runner I noticed a ticking noise. Originally I thought I had a engine problem. After a long investigation I learned that it was a normal characteristic of this engine. I experimented with different oil weights to see if it would reduce the ticking noise. Heavier oil weight did reduce the ticking noise dramatically. Heavier the oil the quitter is was. However, I also noticed the heavier the oil was the more the mpg dropped. I think the heaviest I put in there was a 10W-30. The engine ran much quieter but gas mileage drop from 18mpg to 15mpg. Now that I’m used to the tick I went back to 0W-20.
Hammer0313
New member
Well I’m in on the new QSFS; I’ve used the QSUD a few years ago with my old GMC 6.0 with good results. UOA’s looked good for an America engine. I think both are a solid 5k off the shelf engine oil.
I’m not a fan of thinner oils but all have their place, years ago when I was canyon racing in the north Georgia mountains I religiously ran a 0w20 in my 5.7 Hemi, trying to free up every last pony chasing power. But after 50k of very hard miles it was Ticking Very Bad. Now with my 4Runner the engine is very happy on 0w30 and 5w30, the focus being longevity. Oil weight is definitely application specific.
I think the push for thinner oils is a double edge sword; in order for a 0w16 or a 0w8 to perform it will need to be engineered/formulated very well, pushing formulators to produce better lubricants.
Oil pressure being the first thing of concern with super thin oils.
I’m not a fan of thinner oils but all have their place, years ago when I was canyon racing in the north Georgia mountains I religiously ran a 0w20 in my 5.7 Hemi, trying to free up every last pony chasing power. But after 50k of very hard miles it was Ticking Very Bad. Now with my 4Runner the engine is very happy on 0w30 and 5w30, the focus being longevity. Oil weight is definitely application specific.
I think the push for thinner oils is a double edge sword; in order for a 0w16 or a 0w8 to perform it will need to be engineered/formulated very well, pushing formulators to produce better lubricants.
Oil pressure being the first thing of concern with super thin oils.
2016 4Runner SR5
Senior Member
0W30 vs 5W30, which do you like better in the 4.0 and why?
