How much below or over invoice did you pay? Did you pay the TDA on your 5th gen T4R?

[Noob]

I was at the dealer last weekend and was getting ready to sign my life away on a 2010 TE and noticed that on top of $500 over invoice, there was a roughly $700 charge for TDA...Toyota Dealer Advertising. I told them I wouldn't buy it unless they subtracted the TDA. They wouldn't budge, so I left.

What are other people's experiences with pricing? Specifically, did you pay above or over invoice (as listed by Edmunds, KBB, Nada Guides, etc)? Did you pay the TDA?

Am I being unreasonable by asking them to remove the TDA from their "lowest price"? I understand it's a cost of doing business, but it's not my responsibility to pay for their advertising...I don't get to dictate how many commercials they run per day and at what time, etc.

 

[Will733]

I was at the dealer last weekend and was getting ready to sign my life away on a 2010 TE and noticed that on top of $500 over invoice, there was a roughly $700 charge for TDA...Toyota Dealer Advertising. I told them I wouldn't buy it unless they subtracted the TDA. They wouldn't budge, so I left.

What are other people's experiences with pricing? Specifically, did you pay above or over invoice (as listed by Edmunds, KBB, Nada Guides, etc)? Did you pay the TDA?

Am I being unreasonable by asking them to remove the TDA from their "lowest price"? I understand it's a cost of doing business, but it's not my responsibility to pay for their advertising...I don't get to dictate how many commercials they run per day and at what time, etc.

True you can't approve the amount they spent on promoting the 4runners but they have that expense and feel it's worth it to get people aware and interested. It's not really right for them to charge for it but they basically are just showing their costs for the vehicle but what they dont show you is all the hidden $$$ they're getting from the manufacturer, so in actuality...they can sell for below invoice and make a profit. Move on to the next dealer. I got $600 below invoice and my TDA was about $500 so still ended up a bit below invoice. 2011's may be tougher to get a good deal right now though since they just came out this week.

Good Luck

 

[Snowfox]

I was at the dealer last weekend and was getting ready to sign my life away on a 2010 TE and noticed that on top of $500 over invoice, there was a roughly $700 charge for TDA...Toyota Dealer Advertising. I told them I wouldn't buy it unless they subtracted the TDA. They wouldn't budge, so I left.

What are other people's experiences with pricing? Specifically, did you pay above or over invoice (as listed by Edmunds, KBB, Nada Guides, etc)? Did you pay the TDA?

Am I being unreasonable by asking them to remove the TDA from their "lowest price"? I understand it's a cost of doing business, but it's not my responsibility to pay for their advertising...I don't get to dictate how many commercials they run per day and at what time, etc.

$700.00 is too high, but here are other charge you will have to pay one way or the other if you would buy a Toyota.
TDA $400
Gasoline $10.60
Dealer Holdback $625 and
Whsl. Fin. Reserve $312
Destination charge 810

 

[LongBallLarry]

$700.00 is too high, but here are other charge you will have to pay one way or the other if you would buy a Toyota.
TDA $400
Gasoline $10.60
Dealer Holdback $625 and
Whsl. Fin. Reserve $312
Destination charge 810

You paid for holdback?? Maybe I am not understanding what you mean by your post by saying you have to for it but holdback is the amount the dealer gets from the manufac to cover some of the dealer's costs. If the dealer charges the buyer holdback then the dealer has in effect doubled their holdback. I have heard of shady dealers trying to scam buyers into tricking them that it is a charge from the manufac.

As for TDA, I have never been asked to pay for advertising by any dealer and if they did, I'd walk.

And for Whsl Fin Res, gas, and holdback, that is already included in invoice. If you pay for that on top of invoice, again like with holdback, they double popped it.

 

[Quentin]

You paid for holdback?? Maybe I am not understanding what you mean by your post by saying you have to for it but holdback is the amount the dealer gets from the manufac to cover some of the dealer's costs. If the dealer charges the buyer holdback then the dealer has in effect doubled their holdback. I have heard of shady dealers trying to scam buyers into tricking them that it is a charge from the manufac.

As for TDA, I have never been asked to pay for advertising by any dealer and if they did, I'd walk.

And for Whsl Fin Res, gas, and holdback, that is already included in invoice. If you pay for that on top of invoice, again like with holdback, they double popped it.

There is invoice (as shown on cars.com, etc) and real invoice. Real invoice is what the dealer payed the manufacturer for the car. Invoice includes 3% dealer holdback and financial reserve.

If you paid "$600 below invoice", it was not real invoice, so you still paid a portion of dealer wholesale and financial reserve. A dealer isn't going to lose money on a vehicle that is moving as well at the T4R.

FWIW, I'm a Toyota employee and my price is real invoice + dest + TDA. TDA should be no more than $500 on an SR5 4Runner. (It seems to vary by area.) TMC compensates TMS (the dealers) for the financial reserve and dealer holdback as part of our benefits package.

 

[J.A.]

I was at the dealer last weekend and was getting ready to sign my life away on a 2010 TE and noticed that on top of $500 over invoice, there was a roughly $700 charge for TDA...Toyota Dealer Advertising. I told them I wouldn't buy it unless they subtracted the TDA. They wouldn't budge, so I left.

What are other people's experiences with pricing? Specifically, did you pay above or over invoice (as listed by Edmunds, KBB, Nada Guides, etc)? Did you pay the TDA?

Am I being unreasonable by asking them to remove the TDA from their "lowest price"? I understand it's a cost of doing business, but it's not my responsibility to pay for their advertising...I don't get to dictate how many commercials they run per day and at what time, etc.

Tye this page for answers to some of those questions. Toyota 4Runner Purchasing and Invoice Pricing

 

[4RBob]

I paid ~$1k under invoice on my 2010 Trail in April. Invoice including all the fees listed above (TDA, holdback, reserve). It's just something Toyota does including the holdback in the cost of the vehicle, then the dealer gets that amt back when selling. I don't think Edmund's is including it in their invoice pricing, so it is confusing when you first see it. Edmunds also says an advertising fee is normal, although $700 seems high.

 

[Snowfox]

You paid for holdback?? Maybe I am not understanding what you mean by your post by saying you have to for it but holdback is the amount the dealer gets from the manufac to cover some of the dealer's costs. If the dealer charges the buyer holdback then the dealer has in effect doubled their holdback. I have heard of shady dealers trying to scam buyers into tricking them that it is a charge from the manufac.

As for TDA, I have never been asked to pay for advertising by any dealer and if they did, I'd walk.

And for Whsl Fin Res, gas, and holdback, that is already included in invoice. If you pay for that on top of invoice, again like with holdback, they double popped it.

You maybe right about they should not charge buyers those BS, but when i bought mine i went through my AAA Insurance, and notice that my bottom price came out about the same as everybody else in this forum, so i think I get a fair deal but again how do I know. Like i post earlier You paid oneway or the other. because you don't know for fact what they show you is the real invoice or not.

 

[bosslj]

My Rant

Try this on for size. When I bought my 2010 TE. Toyota had on a special $1,000.00 off for preferred customers. Now if you read the fine print, it stated "not for 2010 4runner customers". I went to my dealer and complained about this. I will give them credit. They did call Toyota to see what, if anything, they could do. Toyota came back with "TOO BAD"!! It is a new model and therefore NO incentives for it. Does anyone, other then me, know why they call us "preferred customers" when they do not care about us?? This was my 3rd new vehicle with my dealer, so they came me $500.00 off as a dealer promotion. I believe that was nice of them, but it should have been the $1000.00 and that Toyota Canada should have had to pay it. Sorry for the rant...
I will admit, I still love my decision to buy Toyota and a 4runner to boot.

 

[XJeepguy]

I've never heard of that TDA . Is that every Toyota model that a dealer sells , it gets a advertising fee from the customer ? Or is this just for the new 4Runners ?
In my area , Toyota is very popular and I have yet to see a print ad in any of our newspapers . I hear a lot of Kia and Dodge ads on the radio but not much from Toyota . Sounds like a racket to me :boink:

 

[Will733]

If you paid "$600 below invoice", it was not real invoice, so you still paid a portion of dealer wholesale and financial reserve. A dealer isn't going to lose money on a vehicle that is moving as well at the T4R.

The "$600 below invoice" may not be off of true invoice but it matched edmunds based on an MSRP of $34,960. Edmunds said invoice was $31,400...they took $600 off that and then added $500 for TMV making it $100 below edmunds invoice. $31,300 for a 4x4 SR5 with Bluetooth, back up camera, sliding cargo deck, sunroof, power seats, floor mats, etc... So I'd try to get it for less than the edmunds invoice price since it is possible.

 

[Mike G.]

That is almost exactly the same deal I got, and I don`t feel totally violated.
The dealerships are going to make money off of you, and they should, it`s a business. Someone will always get a better deal, or so they say, so it comes down to how you feel after the purchase. The bottom line is, just don`t let them totally screw you, because they will if you let them.

The "$600 below invoice" may not be off of true invoice but it matched edmunds based on an MSRP of $34,960. Edmunds said invoice was $31,400...they took $600 off that and then added $500 for TMV making it $100 below edmunds invoice. $31,300 for a 4x4 SR5 with Bluetooth, back up camera, sliding cargo deck, sunroof, power seats, floor mats, etc... So I'd try to get it for less than the edmunds invoice price since it is possible.

 

[BuckeyeGen5]

You should not be paying over invoice for any 2010 car/truck/suv unless it's a GT-R or something in HIGH demand. The TE is an in-demand model (less than 2% of all 4Runners are TEs) and I was able to have my local dealer (Columbus, Ohio) first agree on a price (over $500 under invoice) and search all over the region to find and secure one (mine came from PA).

I would add that you probably shouldn't be paying over invoice for a 2011 (unless it's a TE without KDSS or other rare models). You should also work with the "Internet" departments of the dealerships. They usually have a little more freedom to quote the "low" quotes because they know Internet-savvy customers are better researched customers than the walk off the street into the dealer customer. You then could always play the dealers' quotes against each other. I would however try to build a relationship with a dealer, be frank but respectful, and see where it goes. It worked out for me. But every person's circumstance is different.

Good luck!!!

 

[4RBob]

^^^ Yes, absolutely call first and ask for the internet sales manager! I was quoted the ~$1k under invoice over the phone before I even went in to the dealership. When you go in, the internet sales manager or sales manager will typically set you up with a regular sales person. But, they still honor the price quoted over the phone (unless they are shady, in which case you should just get up and leave).

 

[JohnJerk]

^^^ Yes, absolutely call first and ask for the internet sales manager! I was quoted the ~$1k under invoice over the phone before I even went in to the dealership. When you go in, the internet sales manager or sales manager will typically set you up with a regular sales person. But, they still honor the price quoted over the phone (unless they are shady, in which case you should just get up and leave).

I don't believe that you paid $1K under invoice. There must be more to the story. Maybe you gave them some money on a trade in, got a $500 military rebate, bought aftermarket lift and tires with high mark up, or something else. The numbers don't allow them to sell it at $1K under invoice and make any money. At invoice the only money they get is the holdback and that's $700 or so, maybe a doc fee if they charged that. They may get some other money from high volume or other back door dealings with toyota but your story seems incomplete. Best case scenario, they made no money on your deal - so why would they do it?

People need to be armed with a realistic expectation when they go into a dealer to purchase and I worry some of the stories on the internet set up unrealistic expectations and create frustration for the buyer and seller.

Prove me wrong and I'll eat dirt.

 

[BuckeyeGen5]

Don't be a jerk John

I don't believe that you paid $1K under invoice. There must be more to the story. Maybe you gave them some money on a trade in, got a $500 military rebate, bought aftermarket lift and tires with high mark up, or something else. The numbers don't allow them to sell it at $1K under invoice and make any money. At invoice the only money they get is the holdback and that's $700 or so, maybe a doc fee if they charged that. They may get some other money from high volume or other back door dealings with toyota but your story seems incomplete. Best case scenario, they made no money on your deal - so why would they do it?

People need to be armed with a realistic expectation when they go into a dealer to purchase and I worry some of the stories on the internet set up unrealistic expectations and create frustration for the buyer and seller.

Prove me wrong and I'll eat dirt.

John,

$1000 under invoice isn't unbelievable....yes it's a great price but entirely possible.

You stated yourself the most likely reason a dealer would sell any vehicle at any discount: the major auto manufacturers (i.e., Toyota, GM, and even VW) make their money on volume. Dealers have HUGE incentives to meet sales goals, beat same store sales figures, etc. Let's say a dealer is a few vehicles away from meeting a store goal, they will sell a few cars at a loss to meet the goal (if this means thousands of dollars in bonuses, consideration for promotions, a pat on the back from the owner, etc). Salespeople also have incentives to sell (my salesperson earned a 42-inch LCD TV with my sale-arond $700 under invoice). So if you can strike a deal during the second half of a month you're more likely to get a better deal. Invoice, moreover, IS NOT what the dealer pays for the vehicle. Invoice-like MSRP-is just a measure or guideline to go from. There are too many things going on to know exactly what a dealer has in any vehicle. The variables include the previously mentioned sales goals (which can be corporate and/or dealer-specific), incoming stock of 2011s, a glut of 4Runners in the area, etc.

In short, the chances of 4RBob's $1000 under invoice quote is more likely than you eating dirt even if 4RBob proves you wrong.

 

[4RBob]

I don't believe that you paid $1K under invoice. There must be more to the story. Maybe you gave them some money on a trade in, got a $500 military rebate, bought aftermarket lift and tires with high mark up, or something else. The numbers don't allow them to sell it at $1K under invoice and make any money. At invoice the only money they get is the holdback and that's $700 or so, maybe a doc fee if they charged that. They may get some other money from high volume or other back door dealings with toyota but your story seems incomplete. Best case scenario, they made no money on your deal - so why would they do it?

People need to be armed with a realistic expectation when they go into a dealer to purchase and I worry some of the stories on the internet set up unrealistic expectations and create frustration for the buyer and seller.

Prove me wrong and I'll eat dirt.

I don't care if you believe me or not, I'm just happy it is a true story.

It was a better deal than I would have expected. No, the trade-in was not even discussed prior to getting this price (still got KBB on the trade in, Jeep Wrangler). I did get several more thousand of equity from the trade-in, but I did not include that in the $1k under invoice price. No Military rebates or any other rebates, unless Toyota had something going on with dealer incentives (I did not see on Edmunds at the time, doesn't mean they didn't exist). I did not have ANYTHING installed or accessorized. I did pay a doc fee, I forget how much exactly, less than $200. If you want to talk about doc fees/registration/sales tax, of course that was extra above the $1k under invoice price. Maybe they sold it cheap because I bought it in late April and it had been on their lot since last fall? Don't know, don't care. BTW, they still (last time I was there) still have some other 4R's (including Trail's) on their lot. I guess they aren't selling well around here.

As far as expectations, I would not expect this to be an everyday price for most people shopping out there. I have bought 7 new vehicles for myself and my wife in the last 11 years and this was the best deal I got and I always negotiate hard. The other 6 vehicles I bought, I got from a few hundred under invoice to a couple of hundred over invoice. I've walked out of so many showrooms, I can't even count them all. Sometimes I am pissed off, but usually just take it in stride.

 

[JohnJerk]

Yummy dirt, mmmmm.

Fair enough, guys, I'm on board. I'm an invoice payer over here for an SR5 and that was a multi-day battle (same deal was available on the TE, but $500 over for the FJ). I don't think 4x4s sit on the lot out here like they do in the northeast. And they have to pay for thier new LEED certified building and free coffee (which is pretty good BTW). Good work!

 

[T4Fun]

TDA has been around for atleast 10 years on any new toyota. I have the invoice on my 2000 corolla and it was on that. You will have a hard time getting dealer to budge from that. Either they pay or you pay

 

[badburro]

Try this one on...$1800 over invoice and they will not budge from their posted price which is about a grand less than MSRP on a 5th gen LTD! They claim it's their no-hassle pricing scheme. Their motto: "The Northwest's Only No-Bull Dealer".