Long Crank Time

[jross20]

So it case it helps at all, I'm running new injectors and as far as I can tell they made absolutely no difference to starting speed at all.

I honestly just think that the starter isn't turning over the crank fast enough.

Anyway... Just adding info

 

[Skulking]

Status:
- After picking up from the mechanic, the loss of power issue while driving has stopped. I'm concerned because it only lasted three days and nothing was done to fix it.
- The long crank time has evolved. It's gotten longer and it's not just a long crank. It now has kind of an exasperated sound right before it starts. It's doing this every time now.

If you look at my recent posts on this thread, you'll see I'm thinking this could be an electrical issue. If for no other reason than I've essentially replaced the fuel system

I have videos my daughter recorded of the last three starts. I can't seem to upload the videos so I saved them to google drive. Let me know if you have access issues.

IMG_1866.MOV - Google Drive

IMG_1865.mov - Google Drive

IMG_1863.mov - Google Drive

To my ear the starter sounds slow like the battery isn't well charged. I know you replaced the battery already, but I'd be curious to see what happens if you jump the car to get it started.

 

[Bad Luck]

I'd also recommend checking the power wire to the starter for voltage drop while cranking. You may have high resistance in that wire causing a slow crank. If you haven't cleaned your ground connections in the engine bay now would be a good time to do that as well.

 

[gruenegenes]

Solved

The problem is solved. And I'm not real proud of myself for throwing so many parts at it. I'm good at taking things apart and putting them together. Not so good at diagnostics.

The problem turned out to be a vacuum leak from a worn out hose clamp that secures the air intake hose to the throttle body. I found it with a homemade smoke tester that I mostly copied from this guy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9CDZ9lu6Rs

Pics attached. Here is a link to a video of my tester in action with the smoke escaping.
IMG_1928.MOV - Google Drive

The vehicle also had a slightly rough idle when warm. More of low grade rumble. That appears to be fixed as well.

If anybody has a long crank or rough start, for the love of all that's good, please start by changing the stupid hose clamps

 

[19963.4lsr5]

Yes the ECU does not like air bypassing the MAF.

Somewhere on here I posted the normal idle air flow reading of the MAF. Anything less is a vacuum leak.


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[gruenegenes]

Yes the ECU does not like air bypassing the MAF.

Somewhere on here I posted the normal idle air flow reading of the MAF. Anything less is a vacuum leak.


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I don’t recall you posting it, but it’s in the manual and the value was within spec prior to finding the leak. Spec is 3.3-4.7 gm/sec at idle. Prior to repair it measured 3.64. Now it’s 4.07.

 

[Mudeprived]

The fuel pump only starts pumping once you turn the key to the start position. It doesn't have a prime with key on like most domestic vehicles.

I am curious about this. I have a thread that I recently posted regarding longer than usual crank time. My 4runner always started up right away with no cranking. It has been taking about 3-4 seconds and sometimes have to try twice. A friend of mine on Irate4x4 said to turn key to ON for 30 seconds and see if anything changes. The truck now starts up instantly when i do this. If the pump in these vehicles don't prime then what is occurring on mine that is improving the crank time with key turned to "on"?

 

[alia176]

If the pump in these vehicles don't prime then what is occurring on mine that is improving the crank time with key turned to "on"?

I too am curious about this solution and will try it with my daughter's '97.

 

[alia176]

This thread has me wondering about fuel pressure as the fuel pump is prolly from '97. This is my first step in dealing with any engine issues like starting, stalling, rough idling. Second step is to look for vac leaks.

I'd like to find a place to tap into the fuel system and install a fuel rated shrader valve for a test gauge. Has anyone done this? Apologies for this dumb question as I'm new to this platform.

 

[Bad Luck]

I am curious about this. I have a thread that I recently posted regarding longer than usual crank time. My 4runner always started up right away with no cranking. It has been taking about 3-4 seconds and sometimes have to try twice. A friend of mine on Irate4x4 said to turn key to ON for 30 seconds and see if anything changes. The truck now starts up instantly when i do this. If the pump in these vehicles don't prime then what is occurring on mine that is improving the crank time with key turned to "on"?

No idea, but if you don't believe me crawl under the fuel tank and have someone turn the key to the on position. You won't hear anything or feel anything in the fuel tank.

 

[gruenegenes]

I spent many hours researching posts related to this issue. If I had this to do all over again, this is what I would do, in this order.

Buy a $30 bluetooth scanner connector from Amazon and download a free scanner app. Before doing any work, get baseline values and compare to those in the manual. Save screenshots so you can compare later.

Then relevant tune up items
- Replace plugs and wires
- Replace fuel filter
- Replace air filter
- Replace PCV valve

Then, in this order, I would do these
- Replace hose clamps on air intake hose (this is first because I’m still mad at myself!)
- Check and clean all grounds in the engine compartment
- Test battery
- Test front (AF) and rear O2 sensors
- Clean MAF sensor
- Clean throttle body
- The 2002 doesn’t have an IAC, but if yours does, clean it
- Check for fuel odor in the fuel pressure regulator vacuum line
- Test fuel pump
- Replace fuses for the fuel injection and ECU. They’re inexpensive.
- I never tested fuel pressure because the shop did it when I took it to them. Seems like a pain on our engines to hook it up, but it should be done.
- When you’re done, disconnect battery for however long it takes to clear memory – 30 minutes?
- Reconnect the scanner and compare values to the baseline. You'll probably have to put some hours on the engine after disconnecting the battery for the computer to relearn. Each time I disconnected, I had funny issues pop up for one to two days then they were gone forever.

If none of this works, build the homemade smoke tester to check for vacuum leaks. It’s cheap, quick and easy. If you don’t find any then I would consider replacements for the big three based on symptoms and what your find during your tests.
- Replace fuel pressure regulator
- Rebuild fuel injectors
- Replace fuel pump and pump screen

Of these three, replacing the fuel pump was the most difficult because dropping the tank was hard for me. For the fuel injectors, I took some off an engine at a junkyard and sent them to Fuel Injector Specialists (fuelinjectorspecialists.com) in Denver. The guy was awesome and fast. Taking them from a junkyard kept my car on the road while they were being rebuilt. It was also good practice for how to do it on my engine. I replaced the fuel pressure regulator when I installed the injectors. Quick and super easy.

 

[Mudeprived]

No idea, but if you don't believe me crawl under the fuel tank and have someone turn the key to the on position. You won't hear anything or feel anything in the fuel tank.

Not saying I don't believe you, I am wondering what could be correcting the long crank when I leave key at "on". It literally starts like a new truck when I do this.

 

[photoleif]

I spent many hours researching posts related to this issue. If I had this to do all over again, this is what I would do, in this order. [snip]

thanks for posting such a complete and clear list of troubleshooting, and for also clarifying what the actual cause was in a previous post. i replaced my intake snorkel shortly after buying the vehicle because the old one was cracked and getting brittle. good thing, apparently...

 

[19963.4lsr5]

thanks for posting such a complete and clear list of troubleshooting, and for also clarifying what the actual cause was in a previous post. i replaced my intake snorkel shortly after buying the vehicle because the old one was cracked and getting brittle. good thing, apparently...

I’m getting to that point myself real soon.


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[TX4Running]

I have an iPhone and I use Car Scanner Pro. It’s freemium:

Car Scanner ELM OBD2 on the App Store

The app has some really good features and you can customize dashboards. See the photo, that’s the dashboard I leave up every time I drive. Keep my phone up in a dash holder.

And I use this Bluetooth OBD2 unit:

LELink Bluetooth Low Energy BLE OBD-II OBD2 Car Diagnostic Tool for iPhone/iPod/iPad and Android. New: Configurable Auto On/Off Amazon.com: LELink Bluetooth Low Energy BLE OBD-II OBD2 Car Diagnostic Tool for iPhone/iPod/iPad and Android. New: Configurable Auto On/Off: Automotive

How did you get the ATF temperature? Thanks.

 

[cl4Rk]

How did you get the ATF temperature? Thanks.

From the main menu screen, select “All Sensors”. There are two entries for ATF temperature. IIRC, it’s the first one that we care about “(AT) ATF temperature var. 1” (should be clear which one you want since the other entry will have no live data).

The screenshot I posted was of my customized dashboard. I played around with the layout, colors, fonts, and which sensor data I wanted to see. From the main menu screen, select “Dashboard”. Then select the gear icon to edit the screen.

 

[TX4Running]

From the main menu screen, select “All Sensors”. There are two entries for ATF temperature. IIRC, it’s the first one that we care about “(AT) ATF temperature var. 1” (should be clear which one you want since the other entry will have no live data).

The screenshot I posted was of my customized dashboard. I played around with the layout, colors, fonts, and which sensor data I wanted to see. From the main menu screen, select “Dashboard”. Then select the gear icon to edit the screen.

Unfortunately, my version of Car Scanner Pro (purchased today) does not have any sensors for ATF temperature. I found a video from Australia with a guy showing how to add it but I'm not sure of the formula he used if it will apply here and give results in °F. I'll see how it works when I go home today.

 

[cl4Rk]

Unfortunately, my version of Car Scanner Pro (purchased today) does not have any sensors for ATF temperature. I found a video from Australia with a guy showing how to add it but I'm not sure of the formula he used if it will apply here and give results in °F. I'll see how it works when I go home today.

Maybe check that you’re using the correct vehicle profile / protocol? See attached

 

[TX4Running]

Maybe check that you’re using the correct vehicle profile / protocol? See attached

Thank you for the help. I needed the connection profile you are using.

 

[KissShot]

I'm having the same issue but mine has intermittent start, especially after driving the car and starting it again ~15 mins later. I did a lot of the same changes you did from dropping the fuel tank to changing vacuum lines etc. From what I've search the contacts in the starter needs to be replaced and its pretty cheap on RockAuto Starter motor repair kit. I'll be updating this when I find the time to change it out on the weekend.