Modifying or hitch replace on 5th Gen
- Thread starter emarvin1
- Start date
Koz
New member
This was on a Toyota web site;
Class I Hitches—Light-Duty
• 2,000-lb. maximum trailer weight
• Tongue weight 200-lb. (300-lb. with weight-distributing hitch)
Class II Hitches
• 3,500-lb. maximum trailer weight
• Tongue weight 350-lb. (500-lb. with weight-distributing hitch)
Class III Hitches
• 5,000-lb. maximum trailer weight (7,500-lb. with weight-distributing
hitch)
• Tongue weight 500-lb. (750-lb. with weight-distributing hitch)
Class IV Hitches
• 10,000–12,000 lb. maximum trailer weight—varies by
manufacturer
• Tongue weight up to 1,000-lb. with weight-distributing hitch
Class V Hitches
• Class V receiver hitch can be more than 12,000 lb.
Just keep in mind; even with a WD system you can not exceed the combined gross weight rating.
Koz
jetboy1975
New member
These are standard weight classifications for ALL hitches, They are not vehicle specific and are not just for Toyotas. These ratings are usually based on frame mounted receivers which have the strength to handle the stresses placed by a WDH system.
Antman, you may still want to consider the fact that the 5th Gen hitch is only cross member mounted. There's a reason why the manual only states weight carrying numbers. You'll probably be ok lightly loaded with light tension on the bars ( I did it with my 3800lb hybrid for a summer) but you could easily over stress the x-member. All it will take is a loaded hitch with the bars tensioned up and then hit a big bump/dip in the road to flex the system and over load it. For me it wasn't worth the stress. Wait for an upgrade to come out or have one custom fit.
Antman
Elite Member
Crap !! I am not over the limit, but close- 450 tongue and 4500 lbs. I have towed this trailer easily with an Envoy- had WD hitch but less HP -and my Titan hardly knew it was there until I tried to stop.. The torsion arms help the rear end from sagging with the twist they provide. I guess I need to use a non WD setup and airbags then? You seem llike you have much more experience in this area than most! I don't usually go more than 100 miles or so each trip. What's your suggestion Jetboy?
jetboy1975
New member
You're going to want a wd setup at some point. Airbags will help with the sag problem but it won't transfer any weight to the front axle for stability. I'm not going to tell you to do it, but you'll probably be ok, the cross member is pretty solid but be careful how you load it. Get the airbags and light rated spring bars (600/6000lbs) which will allow more flex. Get the upgrade as soon as it's available.
Also, get the trailer and tongue weighed. 450lbs sounds a little light for a 4500lb trailer, you may be surprised. Recommended tongue weight is 12-15% of trailer.
Also, get the trailer and tongue weighed. 450lbs sounds a little light for a 4500lb trailer, you may be surprised. Recommended tongue weight is 12-15% of trailer.
Koz
New member
What are the specs on the trailer you are pulling and what set-up you are using?
Koz
Antman
Elite Member
It's a Jayco Jayfeather 19H exp. I'm pretty sure I have the weights correct. I got the hitch setup when I purchased the camper new in 2005, and I think it's a Reese setup. It has bars that hook to the trailer tongue and chains to adjust the torsional force. Sorry I can't be more specific, but it's in storage currently. Honestly, I thought the purpose of this setup was to level out the Butt Sag in the towing vehicle! I am thankful for your guys' expertise!
Koz
New member
Air springs/bags do a lot more then just help with sag and they absolutely do smooth and stabilize the ride (BIG difference). By increasing the spring rate and leveling the trailer with the TV you not only improve the ride you also improve the braking, steering control, sway control, body roll, increases shock and tire life, help prevent bottoming and increases ground clearance for the TV and trailer. If you are lucky enough to have an adjustable height setup you have the convenience of being able to adjust the ground clearance of the tongue and the rear of the trailer with the push of a button. Also with auto leveling you don’t have to play with (adjust) different pressures. It makes a BIG difference when approaching/descending driveways. Air bags/springs are one of the best/cheapest ways to improve the overall ride quality of your towing experience. I would not tow without them!
Koz
Koz
New member
The trailer's dry weight is 3500lbs. (4500 combined gross). With a mild WD system you will be fine. Get a Prodigy brake controller (maybe a $100 set of air bags) and you're set.
Koz
EdinAthens
New member
I put Firestone airbags on my TE and they have been great. I pull a 2 axle utility trailer with a Polaris Ranger and the Airbags keep the TE level and a smooth ride.
Trailer brake controller is a must though in my opinion.
Trailer brake controller is a must though in my opinion.
jetboy1975
New member
Valid points but airbags only play a small part in stability equation. They will level the vehicle and trailer but will not greatly improve steering or sway control. Airbags will stop sag but cannot account for the fact that you have 500lbs hanging off the back of the T4R which is unloading the front steer axle. The best way to increase steering control and therefor stability is to redistribute weight onto the front axle through the use of a WDH. Aside from the use of sway controls, distributing the weight over both axles as well as back onto the trailer axles will help with sway issues more than airbags.
The fact that you feel you need airbags to deal with tongue weight and sag shows the necessity to use a WDH. Take a look at how many 1/2 ton trucks towing similar trailers on the road still use WD hitches. It's not because they can't handle the weight, it's for stability and safety. It's cheap insurance.
Trailers usually go by 3 weights
Dry weight - from factory with no options(propane, battery etc)
unloaded or empty weight - dry+options (usually 3-500lbs above dry wt)
GVWR - Gross vehicle weight - max weight you can load it to with your gear.
Combined weight is (GCVWR) is for your tow vehicle. tow vehicle + loaded trailer= GCVWR
Antman, nice trailer, my inlaws have the same one and it's nearly identical to the one I'm selling. My '03 V6 struggled with it on the highway because of gearing and the frontal area drag. The 5th gen should be better with more power and extra gear.
philsey
New member
All these weight designations are well-explained in the owners manual.
Koz
New member
Where did you see me recommending air bags/springs to deal with tongue weight? I stated that the tongue weight rating can increase with use of a WD system and recommended the Hensley Cub. I posted about the air bags/springs because you brushed them off as nothing but a way to help with sag. The fact is, for the price of air bags and the improved ride they provide, anyone who tows should use them (even you). If you research on RV forums you will see how many people are now using them (especially with heavy trailers) and are very happy.
Koz
jetboy1975
New member
Koz, this was directed at Antman and the OP. Never said anything about you recommending airbags, nor did I brush them off. I simply stated that your points were valid but airbags weren't the solution to all the problems that the posters were concerned about. They do improve ride but they don't take away from the need of a WDH for the trailers the posters have.
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I do have airbags and am well researched on the rv forums. I'm not out to butt heads or egos, nor do I think I'm a towing guru, but I have spent a lot of time researching and have a lot of towing experience with different setups. Like you, I'm simply out to answer the concerns and educate from experience. Never said you were wrong.
Koz
New member
Last edited:
Thanks for all the input. Sorry to say I was having a tough time with it. I traded my 5th Gen for a 4th Gen with V8 and w.d. hitch. Looking at labeling on the door sill, it says max cargo and passenger capacity about 900 pounds. Whats the deal with that. With myself and 3 passengers totaling weight of 670 and than an approx tongue weight of 500-600. I'm 300 over. Am I missing something. Please help. Getting frustrated.
