My Career Advice / Ideas / Suggestions

[BrianSD_42]

I thought it was relevant to this thread and is the way most engineers view their Liberal Arts brethren

Interestingly lots of engineers seem to have childewn that major in liberal arts and then move back home after college (my sister).

So aren't the parents a bit to blame for not raising their kids with a proper knowledge of the poverty that awaits their choices?

I'm not a parent but if I was I doubt I would even be willing to pay for a degree that doesn't lead to a job of some kind. I know not everyone is going to be a programmer but everyone should know that poly sci majors have no jobs.

So why would you fund your kids future poverty? And I'm being serious and not trying to be mean. A person at who wants to go "back to school" 24 is in many ways better off with no degree at all than a undergrad that isn't employable. This is because it is so hard to get financial aid for 2nd bachelors. The schools don't give hardly any.

 

[BrianSD_42]

Unless you could get a commission I wouldn't suggest you join enlisted at 24 if you already have a degree. You'd be 30 before you could start school full time.

 

[1engineer]

Interestingly lots of engineers seem to have childewn that major in liberal arts and then move back home after college (my sister).

So aren't the parents a bit to blame for not raising their kids with a proper knowledge of the poverty that awaits their choices?

I'm not a parent but if I was I doubt I would even be willing to pay for a degree that doesn't lead to a job of some kind. I know not everyone is going to be a programmer but everyone should know that poly sci majors have no jobs.

So why would you fund your kids future poverty? And I'm being serious and not trying to be mean. A person at who wants to go "back to school" 24 is in many ways better off with no degree at all than a undergrad that isn't employable. This is because it is so hard to get financial aid for 2nd bachelors. The schools don't give hardly any.

Bear with me on this explanation lol.
My wife (married now for 30 years) and I have two children. My daughter just graduated with her BSN-RN degree this past weekend. She will work in high level trauma center for two years and start her nurse practitioner masters program. My son just finished his 2nd year of BSME (mechanical engineering) and he has an overall GPA of 3.9 so far. Yeah I told him he was slipping too... Anyway he also is a starter for their University's soccer team so he is doing fine.

Since our kids were infants, there has never been any option other than college for them. We both realize the importance of education and we raised them accordingly with this end goal in mind. Now, for us, it worked. We were there for our kids - at games, dances, first relationships, awards ceremonies and such. We vacationed together, ate meals together, went to movies together and laughed and cried together. We gave them space when they needed it. My son just left for Florida and will be playing for a PDL team down there this summer so while we are a tight knit family we are not "smothering" nor did we ever.

Kids are tricky though. As they are growing up, they observe and are influenced by many things like: Peers, environment, family, social settings and stuff. If the kids see the parents unhappy, or fighting, or overhear them complaining about work or life in general or even hear their parents wishing for a better or different life they take that information and file it into their tiny heads to use at a later date. Their friends they make through their pre teen years has a huge impact too.
Point is, it's not surprising that kids would choose to do something other than their parents careers if they didn't think it was cool, or exciting or something.

Now, why would parents pay for an education that had no real hope for a job in that field afterwards? That answer is simple: Love. They love their kids so much and want to make them happy that they won't come down on them with cold hard facts. Love is a funny thing.

I am not bashing liberal arts though. You get that undergrad degree and you can go get your masters or doctorate in law or accounting or finance or business or most anything. Engineering is sort of it's own deal though because its the person as much as the degree. You have to be a "special" type to be an engineer. You can take that "special" to mean nerd, social misfit or you can take it to mean smart and analytical lol. Basically you have to be a little different than the norm, in some way, to be an engineer.

 

[BrianSD_42]

I think in my parents case they had no idea that the job market would be so tough in 2005 that my sister wouldn't be able to find work.

That said I think there is a big misunderstanding between the perception of how tough it is out there and how tough it really is.

At a time when students either have to go into major debt or parents have dip into savings or work longer years to pay for college, you would think its time to start pushing people towards degrees with a career ahead.

Personally I think the government should incentivize financial aid for any STEM with a 3.5 GPA or higher. This seems more important than inventivizing anyone who qualified for income based financial aid to "just get a degree".

In short I want a return on my investment as a taxpayer. That is basically how Germany does it. They give aid for science and engineering but you have to keep your grades up.

I also don't think we should discriminate against the middle class by cutting them out of financial aid and raising rates like we do.

 

[BrianSD_42]

Congrats to your son on his ME degree and daughter on the BSN in nursing!

A BSN in nursing is the degree my GF got in 2010. She has been a nurse in San Diego for a few years now and makes good money.

 

[Koko4]

I have done some thinking, and thank you guys for all of the responses. In response to what 1engineer said (which makes a TON of sense): basically, I had always grown up seeing my dad stressed out, and working all the time. I attributed this to his specific choice of career (engineer), however I recently came to the realization that this stress is more attributed to his personality type, not necessarily his job. Meaning, he probably could have been working almost any job and would have had some level of comparable stress. I think it's not only the job, but also the burden of supporting a family, two children, and my grandmother.

I think I chose a Liberal Arts major because I didn't want to be "pigeon-holed" into a specific degree and life path. I always saw myself as one of those adventurous, out-of-the-ordinary types. One of the guys you read about who gives it all up to go live in South America for a few months, or decides to go backpacking across Europe at the drop of a hat, or something of the like. So far, I have gone on two trips abroad (5-week backpacking trip in Europe, and a study abroad in South America), but I would like to do more.

Currently, I think I'm in a rut because I'm scared to choose a path and follow it. Luckily, I have some ample time to think about it because I recently found my way into a good (and not dead-end) job. It involves a lot of travel (about 2 weeks out of each month), and I am learning a skill-set which is totally different from my major. This job is accounting / compliance based..not sure how much detail I can go into.

The funny thing is, I do see myself as more of a "blue-collar" worker type. I just don't want to be put into a position that has little potential for advancement past a certain stage. I always want there to be something ahead and above to be able to climb to, in the future, and it seems like there are less opportunities for that in the blue collar fields.

I studied Spanish in college, and one thing I know for sure is that I want to be completely fluent. Up until now, I haven't had a chance to use it constantly, and at one point it started to slip..I've been practicing recently and have gotten a good bit better, but still far from fluent. University can only prepare you for so much, and then real-world experience has to take the wheel after that.

Another thing is I am one of these "health-types" and I am VERY interested in the food industry in particular - I am one of those that things Monsanto is EVIL and that we, as Americans, are not living as healthily in many regards as compared to our fellow Europeans. With that being said, I can see myself living in a different country (be in South America or Europe) for an undetermined amount of time, at some point in my life. I want to have a job which is in high-enough demand to be able to go over there, find employment (be in some sort of demand) and live a decent lifestyle wherever I choose to go.

I know I am rambling. I'm sorry - there are a lot of factors to consider here. I'm new to this whole "life" thing. At least while I figure it out I can continue working my current job and save up some money to initiate a plan.

Back to my current job, the main thing I don't like about it is that it's very office-orientated. Like I said before, it pays well, and I have lots of opportunity for travel, BUT I am still sitting in front of a desk / computer, sifting through paperwork for the majority of my day. It's not something I can see myself doing for the rest of my life. If it were a similar traveling-based job, and I were doing a different task [I read somewhere that healthcare-technology repairmen / testers make a very decent salary] then I would probably like it a lot more.

So basically as of now, I'd like it to be hands-on, potential to use Spanish on a regular basis, needed in other foreign countries, in demand, and pay well.

WTH, does that even exist?!? Haha.

 

[BrianSD_42]

You sound like a nice guy.

My advice to you is this ...

If you are in any way open to a STEM career (science technology engineering or math) then go start math classes at your local public state Jr college. You may have to start with Trig but that's fine. You take two classes, 4 or 5 months each. Do your best to get an A.

If you can get an A or close in Trig and PreCal then you can probably do a STEM career of some type.

Its sounds to me like you need the confidence and you won't get it unless you try.

These classes are easy and the foundation for all STEM majors.

 

[Steamfitter]

I was kind of like you. I have a ba in the humanities, but started a steam fitter/pipefitter apprenticeship at 25. Now I'm a journeyman at 30, making over $100 grand a year. Take a trade... pipefitter, millwright, electrical, instruments are my top picks. Get your journeyman, get some money, then if you want to go back to school you have something to fall back on. Getting a trade ticket is a solid foundation for many other jobs in the construction/power/resource industry. If you want a fancier position down the road where you're not on the tools, you will have 1000 times more credibility and real world knowledge having a trade ticket than some egghead who pretends to have a clue. This translates to more respect, credibility, jobs opportunities------ my 2 cents.

 

[RandyDaytona]

So basically as of now, I'd like it to be hands-on, potential to use Spanish on a regular basis, needed in other foreign countries, in demand, and pay well.

Other than the "needed-in-other-foreign-countries" part, have you considered the U.S. Border Patrol? Lots of Spanish, outdoor work, challenging and well-paying at $70-100K a year.

A step up from that is a Special Agent with HSI - Homeland Security Investigations (what used to be U.S. Customs agents and Immigration agents, who were merged after 9/11). Still using the Spanish and they actually have posts overseas. Also pays very well, with journeyman agents at the GS-13 grade making annual salaries of well over $100K.

Also, you might try some of the natural resource law enforcement agencies - federally, there's the Forest Service, BLM, US Fish & Wildlife Service, who have both uniformed officers and plainclothes criminal investigators. On the state side, most states are hurting for decent game warden applicants with clean backgrounds, yet who don't mind working alone and being dirty, wet, cold, tired, hungry most of the time. As much outdoor, hands-on work as you can handle and, depending on the location, plenty of Spanish-speakers needed.

And ANY degree will do - I've spent almost 20 years in law enforcement and mine is in History and German. I know others who've majored in everything from Criminal Justice to Philosophy. With a degree and a clean background, you'd be a strong applicant. The only hurdle these days is the push by federal agencies to hire veterans, which leaves some non-vets feeling as if they've been left out in the cold. However, non-vets are still getting hired.

 

[MStudt]

I've got a Bachelor's in Industrial Technology with an emphasis in Industrial Management. I also have a Master's in Small Business Entrepreneurship. On top of that I'm Six Sigma certified Lean, Green Belt, and Black Belt. People with Six Sigma Certificates are highly sought after in the manufacturing world. People with Six Sigma Black Belts can easily walk into an $80k a year job with ease. Now find that perfect job is something that is hard to find. I've been looking for a good 12 years now. I've found what I want to do, just need to find that perfect company. I love buying in purchasing, and it gives me a lot of control. Being a Senior Buyer I have control over my companies inventory, all product that comes in/out, and the department below me. I work every Friday from home just to get away from the office.

 

[VolcanoT4R]

[MENTION=106787]Koko4[/MENTION], have you considered HVAC technician? Or, Network Installer (don't think that is the appropriate job title)? If I could do it all over again, I think that's the direction I would go. Both are areas that lend themselves to starting your own company if you ever tire of working for "the man". Just my $0.02

 

[Koko4]

Thank you guys for all of the responses. It's hard to choose a path and just "go for it". I have so much uncertainty swirling around in my head, the only way I think I will know for sure if it's a good match is to just get out and try something.

Right now I am still working in an office, and lately the traveling and the computer work have REALLY been getting to me. My stress levels are up there..and I just need to be on my feet, or at least moving around and using my hands / eyes / not just staring into a screen and at papers all day.

I guess some people are built for that type of work, but I don't think I am one of them.

I have considered HVAC technician before, but I also have a friend that does it and is at about the same salary as me. From his descriptions of his boss's antics / coworkers / clients, sometimes it feels like I'd be walking out of one fire and into another.

I don't know if I am interested in any STEM career. I feel like if I could find that little "niche" that would interest me / that I would be passionate about, I could excel and really dedicate myself to it. It's just the fact that I KNOW the majority of my day would be spent behind a desk (once again, what I'm trying to avoid here).

I want opportunity for advancement and to stay away from a desk. Hopefully not STRAIGHT manual labor (I wouldn't mind it for now, but I'm thinking in the future my body wouldn't be able to handle it).

I really don't want it to be regional-specific. I don't want to move to LA for an oil-based job, for example. I'd like to be able to live in one of the four-corners states (AZ / CO / UT / NM) or just stay here in GA. I need something that's in demand everywhere. And I'm getting to the age where I need to think about having a house / responsibilities. I'd like to eventually have some sort of passive income streams going on for me, so being able to save and invest my excess would be preferable.. I don't want to be stuck in the paycheck-to-paycheck rut that many people seems stuck in, regardless of their pay. A person's "base requirements" always seem to increase as the salary does...

 

[4gin007]

Not sure if its been said as i skimmed through this thread after reading your first post and understanding you like the outdoors, i was thinking a game warden position would fullfill some of your core interests.

 

[Logan714]

If you're interested in the four corners states, try pinnacle west.

Careers - Pinnacle West Capital Corporation (PNW)

My mom just retired from APS after 35+ years. Almost 60% of their workforce is at or near retirement age. Plenty of jobs throughout the state at any of the plants. Palo Verde which is nuclear, and then coal and gas turbine plants.

That's where I'm going to try and get a job at when I'm out of the navy and while getting my degree.

 

[BrianSD_42]

It seems like motivation is an issue here. You clearly know your situation isn't ideal but can't seem to do something else.

I'll list some careers that are not engineering but you could get into with schooling.

* Nursing (lots of male nurses now and they make decent money)
* Law Enforcement Officer
* Plumber (they really do make a lot of money)
* Automotive Technician (I'm not sure what the formal term is but it is very respected and makes good money in most US cities)
* Sales

Anyways those are just a few off the top of my head.

BTW you will never know if you are capable of a STEM degree if you don't take a math class at your local community college and find out.


//////////////////////////////////


Planet Money goes back to community college to take a look at America's future health care workers

NPR Profile of 2 very different Students in one of Nursing School's hardest Prerequisite classes. One is a 40 year old ex-marine with no college degree who has been working odd jobs for years since leaving the Marines. The other is a young 24 year old women who has a strong background in school in Math & Sciences. They are both profiled and the follow up will be months later.

---> The Toughest Class In Nursing School Is The First One | Public Radio East (Just 4 minutes of audio)


The follow Up .... Who passed and who is falling behind might surprise you.

---> Episode 595: The Rest Of The Story, 2014 Edition : Planet Money : NPR (skip to the 14:30 mark on the player for the update)

 

[Millerad1651]

Thank you guys for all of the responses. It's hard to choose a path and just "go for it". I have so much uncertainty swirling around in my head, the only way I think I will know for sure if it's a good match is to just get out and try something.

Right now I am still working in an office, and lately the traveling and the computer work have REALLY been getting to me. My stress levels are up there..and I just need to be on my feet, or at least moving around and using my hands / eyes / not just staring into a screen and at papers all day.

I guess some people are built for that type of work, but I don't think I am one of them.

I have considered HVAC technician before, but I also have a friend that does it and is at about the same salary as me. From his descriptions of his boss's antics / coworkers / clients, sometimes it feels like I'd be walking out of one fire and into another.

I don't know if I am interested in any STEM career. I feel like if I could find that little "niche" that would interest me / that I would be passionate about, I could excel and really dedicate myself to it. It's just the fact that I KNOW the majority of my day would be spent behind a desk (once again, what I'm trying to avoid here).

I want opportunity for advancement and to stay away from a desk. Hopefully not STRAIGHT manual labor (I wouldn't mind it for now, but I'm thinking in the future my body wouldn't be able to handle it).

I really don't want it to be regional-specific. I don't want to move to LA for an oil-based job, for example. I'd like to be able to live in one of the four-corners states (AZ / CO / UT / NM) or just stay here in GA. I need something that's in demand everywhere. And I'm getting to the age where I need to think about having a house / responsibilities. I'd like to eventually have some sort of passive income streams going on for me, so being able to save and invest my excess would be preferable.. I don't want to be stuck in the paycheck-to-paycheck rut that many people seems stuck in, regardless of their pay. A person's "base requirements" always seem to increase as the salary does...

I was in a similar situation to you. BA in Fine Art, pretty much useless in the real world. I always worked around construction, and love working with my hands. I have also always been interested in technology, but not computer programming stuff, more AV type things. Long story short, I went back to school, and got my MBA in Applied Management. I learned a lot about managing projects and the sort.

I am now in project management for the IT dept. at a local university. Its a pretty good job, I get to work with others and design IT aspects of new construction projects, or renos around campus. I'm also working on my PMP Certification.

Once I get a couple years under my belt, I can expand my job search to larger construction projects if I want to. It may take a few years, but head project managers on large jobs make pretty decent money.

May not be interesting to you, but its definitely something worth looking in to.

 

[Stgo2019]

...Or police, firefighter, or EMT? They are not tied to a desk and work outdoors a lot.

Both of these are fantastic suggestions. With a degree and work experience you meet the minimum requirement for federal law enforcement jobs. The language ability is sought after as well.

 

[RandyDaytona]

Both of these are fantastic suggestions. With a degree and work experience you meet the minimum requirement for federal law enforcement jobs. The language ability is sought after as well.

A caveat to this: these days, "minimums" are probably not going to get anyone hired at the federal level. Every eligible person who meets the standard is at the same point, so an applicant needs something more to separate him/her from the rest of the pack.

But with the current push to hire veterans, anyone who isn't a vet is going to have a tough road. That's not to say it isn't possible, but it's not as easy as it once was.

Anyway, for any kind of natural resource law enforcement, I'd stick with the state positions. As a state game warden, there's more freedom, (usually) less bureaucracy, and often a better retirement system.

More importantly, most states are hurting for quality applicants, for many reasons. Believe it or not, many people don't want to work outdoors in a law enforcement capacity. Hunting and fishing guide or some other "cool" environmental job profiled favorably in Backpacker magazine? Sure.

But being the guy or gal that most outdoorsmen don't want to see, always working alone, being cold and wet, etc., with only a truck for an office. Not nearly as many people lining up for that kind of work, especially when you factor in that it's a mission that isn't universally-supported.

So due to these factors, the field is wide open for anyone who wants to make a serious run at a job.

A degree (any degree - mine is in History and German) that gives you some decent writing skills, a clean background, and a bona fide interest in protecting natural resources - one that you can articulate to an interview panel - will likely get a person hired. Work experience that gives an applicant the ability to effectively deal with people helps greatly, too. Most states have a skills test involving identifying species within a state and basic firearms knowledge. Knowing those things are fairly easy if you're already a hunter and/or fisherman, but even if you're not, that's stuff that can be studied and learned beforehand.

 

[MedicLt]

The Border Patrol can always use help.:uzi:

 

[Koko4]

All of these have been great suggestions!! Just an update, to bring this thread back from the dead. I have taken an interest in IT and the opportunities within (limitless, it seems).

It's a good field - ALWAYS going to be in demand, pays well, and there's always a way to move UP .. always something new to learn. There are different caveats to it, so chances are I will be able to find my own niche that will interest me.

Right now I am studying for the CompTIA A+ certification, which I've been told is good basic knowledge to have (although the actual significance in the real world is negligible, from what I hear). After this, I plan on starting my job search for one of the above-mentioned positions. I don't expect much in the way of salary..possibly $30k/yr if I'm lucky?

After A+, I will study for Network+ and Security+, and then I'd like to get a position as maybe a Jr. Level Network Admin or Jr. Systems Admin.

Hopefully this is a good path for now.. and if it turns out to not be such a good choice, then I will change. Working my current job (2 weeks literally GONE every month) has made me realize that yes, I do want the stability of a 9-5, yes I want my weekends free (as the rest of the world doesn't care that I have a random Wed/Thurs off once a month), and yes I want to be able to buy a house / have a family / have my LIFE not be tucked away in some suitcase or hotel!