my slow build/wheeling/everything thread.

[nevada]

batteries.

i got a take-out red top optima. we replaced it, because it was "old" it still worked fine, but the guy wanted to replace it just in case. i think he'd been running it for like 10 years.

i snagged it, and bought a heavy duty winch/battery solenoid. just did basic wiring with heavy battery cables, and an in cab switch.
i didn't have matching batteries, and i had to manually switch it, but damnit, i had DUAL BATTERIES!

after a few years using it like that, and forgetting to turn my electric fans off after getting home, those batteries were toast. too many complete discharges.

i headed down to the local Interstate shop, and picked up a couple red top Optima blems. i don't remember the reason they were blems, but both had been checked, and tested very good. better than the rating on the sticker in fact. i got the pair for $100.

i used these for a few years...and again after forgetting to turn off the fans, the batteries were toast.:ybrick: damnit! i got a couple years for $100, i was happy.
i really needed a thermostat switch! i did add one eventually, but then it died during a competition, and i almost burned up the engine, im back to the manual switch...for now.

back to Interstate i go.
this time, i was after a better battery, one more equipped for how i was going to use it. i landed on the blue top marine deep cycle battery.

Marine Battery | RV Battery | BLUETOP® | OPTIMABATTERIES


even running it through my shop, my cost was like $180 each. ouch!
i bought one, then a month later got another.

these batteries are GREAT. im doing better at not letting the fans run..
but, im not doing a great job keeping them charged...they do discharge a bit from just SITTING, and i don't wheel nearly as much as i used to. but these batteries will survive that type of "use" better than the previous ones. so i stick them on a trickle charger every couple months.

im still using a manual battery switch, but will be getting a good dual battery switch, and monitor soon.

 

[nevada]

Just so everyone knows amazon has that winch for 247 or so

nice.

i expected there were cheaper ones out there. i just didn't search for them. but, good to know, thanks.

edit: im adding the link here in case anyone is interested.

http://www.amazon.com/Rugged-Ridge-15100-01-500Lb-Winch/dp/B0033LZ63Y

I may snag another one at that price.

 

[wallytoo]

enjoying the tale.

fwiw, i've had an optima red top for many years now. it was in my cj for at least 6 years; i put it in my 4runner when the wal-mart pos that came with it failed (right after i brought it home). it's a great battery, especially on a vehicle that gets regular use.

[my best battery might be a "generic" napa battery, a big one, that fits in my '48 dodge dump truck. it sat for 2 years, and when i finally finished rebuilding the engine, it started the truck up without a recharge. still in the truck 3 years later, too]

 

[nevada]

I just ordered a winch.
got the rugged ridge 10,500. got it for $359 shipped.

 

[KidVermicious]

I've toasted my red top twice now to where my Sears charger wouldn't bring it back. Each time, a night spent on a friend's Optima charger has brought it back from death.

I wonder if that's one of the reasons Optimas are getting a bad rap, is some guys aren't charging them right.

 

[nevada]

I've toasted my red top twice now to where my Sears charger wouldn't bring it back. Each time, a night spent on a friend's Optima charger has brought it back from death.

I wonder if that's one of the reasons Optimas are getting a bad rap, is some guys aren't charging them right.

yes, im sure. but they did have a few years after they switched plants where they had lots of issues.

 

[nevada]

I found some more pics of when I rolled.
you can see the stump in these.

the stump itself isn't TOO tall, but the ground at the road is a bit lower, making the overall height a bit too much

here we are later in that trip,

you can see where the top of the cab goes up right in the middle. we used the hi-lift jack on it.




random pic, and short story

we came across this spot in winter, when there was a bunch of snow.
after driving through that section a few times and stabbing the throttle, I figured I could probably lay the truck over on its side. it would be nice and gentle, and land in deep snow.


it took a few tries. the first couple times, we just drove on 2 wheels before it settled back down.
NEED MORE SPEED!

I think the 4th try it flopped over. a few of us just pushed it back on the tires. that was the first time on its side, it has happened a few times since then..mostly on purpose :lol:


another random pic..

you cant tell because of the snow, but there is a bridge under me, and I drove off the left side of it.
had to winch me backwards to get back on.
good times.

 

[nevada]

more random pics.

pretty deep snow that day. a lot of it was drifted, and hard to drive in.

we are actually sitting at an angle on the road. due to being locked in the rear the ass end swung out, and we crabbed walked the trucks up to that point. the snow was a lot deeper and hard packed on the right side.

it looks like my back tire is almost off the edge. its close, but the ground dips down a tiny bit right there, before it drops off the edge.

just by chance we both had our extra doors on, and they were both red.
I swapped them on, after I rolled. but I ended up putting the original doors back on, since they fit the crushed cab better. haha. I think he was in the middle of building half doors out of the originals.


here it is later, after he painted it.

as you can see, mine are still red.

you can kind see the flatbed he built. it turned out really nice, with built in jerry can holders. one on each side.

hes running 38" swampers, and 4:10 gears, welded in the rear, and an 87 22R. it did amazingly well.

it shouldn't have even moved, but it actually wheeled pretty good.


he wheels a jeep now...traitor!

 

[nevada]

heres a few vids from my last trip.

the snow wasn't too deep, but I was open in the front on 35's, and I had to work just to follow him and his 37's. you can see his rear diff drags pretty heavily a lot of the time.

37's and a curry hi-pinion 9"


















screw not being able to break trail, im taking my truck this weekend.

 

[nevada]

ooh, my new winch showed up today!

 

[Hyde802]

Nice snow videos!

 

[nevada]

Nice snow videos!

thanks.

I got some more this weekend, this time in my truck.











pretty sure those aren't in order lol.

there are a couple more uploading now.

 

[nevada]

oh, as much as ive praised rugged ridge winches...

mine no longer free spools. the lever turns, but it never releases the drum.
I did a bit of research, im pretty sure its just a pin. possibly bent, but I think its slid out of place, causing it to be locked in at all times.

my truck has set on my trailer for over a year, I was slightly concerned some corrosion may have set in, and wasn't sure if it would work.

I ended up using it a few times on Saturday, other than the free spool issue, it worked great. its fairly quick, so I don't really miss the free spool option too much. I intend to pull the end cap off and check it. that in itself is easy, but unfortunately, due to my bumper design, I have to remove the winch completely for this. damnit.

i'll try to get some pics of this when I tear it down.


also, even with that issue, I wouldn't hesitate to buy another.
I think FOR THE MONEY, there isn't a better one out there.


hopefully the RR 10.5 I just got is equally as good.

 

[nevada]

a couple more vids from the last trip. the snow got pretty deep in places.

these videos actually came before the ones I posted above. oops.











love that sound!

 

[mistersnowman97]

[MENTION=84120]nevada[/MENTION]

please! post these on the video thread with a sticky http://www.toyota-4runner.org/classic-t4rs/159319-video-thread.html

 

[nevada]

[MENTION=84120]nevada[/MENTION]

please! post these on the video thread with a sticky http://www.toyota-4runner.org/classic-t4rs/159319-video-thread.html

all of them?

no 4runners tho...

 

[KidVermicious]

no 4runners tho...

you fired

 

[nevada]

ok so I tore the winch down yesterday.

first a couple things:

I think it was my 1st or 2nd time using it, but the cable got wound up all on one side(thanks spotter), and put pressure against the connecting bar that goes across the top, and snapped the mounting ear off. OOPS. totally my bad.

I have been using it like this for a few years now, and haven't noticed any separation, or any other issues. which means the rear bar, and base are doing a good job keeping things in place.

the other thing, since new free spool worked, but it took quite a bit of effort to pull the cable off, and there was also a bit of a hard spot. it was just a PITA. I just kept it locked and powered it out. its fairly quick, so hasn't been an issue.

a buddy has the same winch, and said his free spool has never worked since new, and asked me about mine. last weekend while wheeling, I tried to use it, and NO GO. even with my foot against the bumper, pulling as hard as I could I couldn't budge the drum.

now to the tear down to find out WHY.


start by removing the 10 4mm cap screws, with a 3mm allen wrench.

once the screws are out, the cap just pulls straight off.

leaving you with this.

the inside of the cap, showing the heavy grease, and free spool lever.

there is the small gear at the end, its just sitting there, pulling it straight out.

then there are 3 sets of planetary gears.


this is with the first(smallest one) removed.

oh, I didn't get a pic of it, but after you remove the first gear set, you can then easily remove the outer main gear. the one with the scallops around the outer edge.

and here with the last, largest removed.

apparently I forgot to get a pic with the second one.

and lastly there is a smallish gear right in the center, you can see it in the last pic.

here it is removed.

now we can see inside the drum. what a mess!

I tried to used a flashlight and get a pic down inside the drum to show how bad it was. its hard to see in the pic, but the entire inside of the drum is coated. probably 1/4" thick all the way around.


anyway, as I pulled the parts out, I layed them IN ORDER, and in orientation on a rag.

I found out as I was cleaning things, that this wasn't entirely necessary, as it will really only go together one way. but, its good practice just in case its not so simple.

down to the cleaning. this "grease" was terrible. I would say it was closer to glue than grease. I cut the bottom off a plastic antifreeze jug, and soaked the parts in brake cleaner. then transferred them to the parts washer, and then one more time in the brake cleaner. it was a bit of work, that is nasty, sticky grease.


but finally, clean parts!

before these were cleaned, I could barely turn those individual gears. the grease had them glued in position.

cleaning the inside of the case was a bit more difficult, as I couldn't soak it, and those gear teeth in there were a *****. I ended up using a small screw driver and scraped one spline at a time.


now, as to why it wouldn't free spool, I had an idea that the pin in the lever had bent/broken/fallen out.

once cleaned up, you can see things are as they should be.

the pin is intact, and the lever turns freely.

i had read other threads online, that said the pin was bent, and this caused the issue. for the hell of it, i removed the pin. it slid easily, out so far, then stopped. weird.

i finally used a pin punch and removed it.
sure enough, it was bent.

except, its more CURVED then bent. i think this is done purposely to prevent the pin from sliding out during use.
i didn't realize this at the time, so for piece of mind, i replaced the pin with a roll pin. it went in with a bit of force, as a roll pin should. theres no chance it will just slide out. i believe a roll pin should have been used originally.



so the free spool lever turned, but it still wouldn't free spool. mechanically, that's not possible due to the design.

the free spool lever has a small, just over half circle on it, this locks into the scallops on the outer gear, thus locking them together, TO the outside case. letting the motor drive the gears, which turns the drum.

when in the free position, the half circle turns into a void, placing the flat spot in the scallop, and leaving the outer gear free to move/turn, thus allowing free spool. the motor is no longer engaged to the drum.

quite genius in design really. it takes very little pressure, due to the compound gearing, to lock that outer gear to the body of the winch.

also note how small the drive shaft is. i didn't measure it, but id guess its 5/16". this is with a 5.5 hp motor, and a 8500lb rating. again, this is due to the compound gearing.



i greased everything back up with some NLGI EP #2 grease. basically its wheel bearing grease that we had here at the shop. most places online suggested aeroshell #17, or moly1. but, any EXTREME PRESSURE grease should be fine. and really, just about ANYTHING will be better than what was in there. i didn't get any pics of this, obviously i was covered in grease.

oh also, most places say to "not use too much grease" because it will make it hard to free spool. well, i packed that ish in there. anything that moved, turned, touched, or rubbed got a liberal coating of grease. i made sure to spin all the gears until they spun freely.

install is the opposite of the tear down, the only thing id like to note is the 2 plastic shims.

seen here.

they go over the center gear, top left.

that's pretty much the only thing that can be put in incorrectly.



ok, so i mentioned when new, free spool had a hard spot.

one of the 3 gears on this set was hard to turn. it would turn about 75% of the way easily, then get hard. i think the pin is slightly bent. i was able to turn it with my fingers, but it got pretty hard. i think that explains the hard spot.

one last thing,

i haven't torn down many other winches, so i cant say if this is an extra feature, or standard for this design. but in the pic, the upper middle and left gears, you can see a large C-clip.


the center gear is staked into the plate, that C-clip prevents it from backing out. a pretty good idea, makes it that much more durable.


ok, so this ended up longer than i expected. but at least i had pics.:clap2:
also, even tho i had the camera IN MY POCKET i still forgot to take pics of some things...

later today im going to tear down my new rugged ridge 10,500, and clean and regrease it.

i think this is something that should be down to ALL winches when new. regardless of brand, or price.

its a bit different design, so i'll take pics again. i'll try to keep the write-up shorter tho.

 

[KidVermicious]

You've got me tempted to tear mine down now, and I haven't wired it up yet.

 

[nevada]

You've got me tempted to tear mine down now, and I haven't wired it up yet.

do it. i haven't heard of one yet that had GOOD grease in it from the factory.

i just pulled the cap off the 10.5, its got the same sticky glue/grease in it.
it did free spool decently, but it should work much better when im done.

also, it should run faster, and have a bit more power, since it doesn't have to overcome that sticky crap.