Replace Axles with OEM Boots or Extended Boots

[Rock_Rat]

Found a 2002 donor with only 187k. I Picked up both axles, both steering knuckles/spindles and also found my ADD harness with a good connector for just $150.

Boots weren't torn so it's safe to believe the CV joints are still good. My plan is to rebuild both axles with the extended boots or new OEM boots. I still haven't made up my mind on that. No one has sold me on the extended boots.

I'll check the axle hub bearing backlash first and if it's in limits I might just leave well enough alone.

I will however, add the Total Chaos gussets to the knuckle. Good insurance.

 

[BrianSD_42]

Long travel/mid travel does not madder. They tear from daily driving on the road. If your running 2.5"-3" suspension lift the oems will tear from slowly rubbing each other. .

Agreed.

I don't think a 2.5" lift is much of a problem for OEM CV boots. Most of the OEMs tear because they are rubber that is 15 years old with over 150k miles.

The time between my first 2.5" and first tear was over 4 years. Others have not been so lucky.

 

[Rock_Rat]

Agreed.

I don't think a 2.5" lift is much of a problem for OEM CV boots. Most of the OEMs tear because they are rubber that is 15 years old with over 150k miles.

The time between my first 2.5" and first tear was over 4 years. Others have not been so lucky.

Thanks Brian. So far I'm drawing the same conclusion. I'm not convinced the extended boots are the answer. I'm not sure if the quality of the rubber used on the extended boots is the same as OEM so it would be difficult to make a true comparison.

What was your mileage over the four years? Mileage seems to be a better variable than time.

EDIT: I do like the fact that I have two sets of OEM axles to work with. Because of your recent mishap, I'm adding the gussets to my "new" steering knuckles. Sorry to see you go through that experience.

 

[St Runner]

I prefer original equipment, not big on the silicone enhancement ones. I put 20k on the Beck Arnley boots I put on my tacoma with three inches of lift, but I drive mostly with the hubs unlocked.

 

[habanero]

Does stretching the boot work?
For me it did. After having a boot eat holes in itself and replacing it I began to watch much more closely. Didn't take long to see this happening again:

So at 231,000 miles I stretched the boots. I pulled the cv pictured off the truck at a little over 261,000 miles to do a manual hub conversion. That groove pictured had not gotten noticeably deeper in all those miles.

So hooey or not hooey, I'm convinced.
96 4Runner
Sonoran Steel 1.2 lift
w/diff drop
on Michelin A/T2 285/75r16 at the time.

That fusion tape idea sounds interesting. If the 99 ever stands on its tip-toes I'll be watching the new boots (because the old ones WILL tear and need to be replaced and I don't think it'll take long to happen) for rubbing and decide then on doing either the tape or the boot stretch. Will be watching those that tape to see if what it seems would happen...happens.

I'm not all that convinced on the long travel boots....but it's all anecdotal, no personal experience on those.

 

[Rock_Rat]

Does stretching the boot work?
For me it did. After having a boot eat holes in itself and replacing it I began to watch much more closely. Didn't take long to see this happening again:

So at 231,000 miles I stretched the boots. I pulled the cv pictured off the truck at a little over 261,000 miles to do a manual hub conversion. That groove pictured had not gotten noticeably deeper in all those miles.

So hooey or not hooey, I'm convinced.
96 4Runner
Sonoran Steel 1.2 lift
w/diff drop
on Michelin A/T2 285/75r16 at the time.

That fusion tape idea sounds interesting. If the 99 ever stands on its tip-toes I'll be watching the new boots (because the old ones WILL tear and need to be replaced and I don't think it'll take long to happen) for rubbing and decide then on doing either the tape or the boot stretch. Will be watching those that tape to see if what it seems would happen...happens.

I'm not all that convinced on the long travel boots....but it's all anecdotal, no personal experience on those.

Fantastic input. Thanks! Looks like you've got 30K on them so far. I've been following the Aisin Lock Out Hubs link and saw you were one that did the conversion. I still haven't decided on the extended boots or not. I may ship them back when they arrive and go OEM, stretch, tape and silicon spray. Adding the fusion tape, theoretically is like adding a patch to an inner tube. It looks like the valley portion of your bellows is showing signs of cracking. I'm wondering if a thin bead of shoe goo in the valleys would also help extend the life of the boot. Again, great photo. Good info.

 

[jasonochs25]

Does stretching the boot work?
For me it did. After having a boot eat holes in itself and replacing it I began to watch much more closely.

So hooey or not hooey, I'm convinced.

\

Thank you Habanero, for posting that pic. And the info along with it!


Been doing a lot of reading...thinking...and playing with my ORS high angle silicone inner boots. I initially could not see how the boot contacting itself would or could cause a failure as there is no side to side friction or movement.

Then it hit me...the bellows contacting each other, although not side to side movement (picture using a piece of sandpaper back and forth. One object moving back and forth against another.), CAN cause friction between each other by UP and DOWN movement or just them pressing together, if you will, over and over again. Basically, one being forced into the other because of the rotation and angle. Throw some road salt, sand, mud, dirt, dust, any kind of debris, into that contact patch, and yes, you will get a failure.

I see that now and want to apologize to JayRolla ("cool story, bro"...had to go there, really? LOL) for trying to argue my point with him. He and several others are correct.

Maybe they cant explain exactly HOW, but they all have pretty good proof from experiencing this problem. And, it does make sense now. I have a thick skull, what can I say...LOL.

I WILL be doing my lift in the next 10 days or so, and WILL be using hose clamps (or worm gear clamps), and WILL be "stretching the boots just enough to where the bellows dont contact each other at full travel.

 

[JayRolla]

Thank you Habanero, for posting that pic. And the info along with it!


Been doing a lot of reading...thinking...and playing with my ORS high angle silicone inner boots. I initially could not see how the boot contacting itself would or could cause a failure as there is no side to side friction or movement.

Then it hit me...the bellows contacting each other, although not side to side movement (picture using a piece of sandpaper back and forth. One object moving back and forth against another.), CAN cause friction between each other by UP and DOWN movement or just them pressing together, if you will, over and over again. Basically, one being forced into the other because of the rotation and angle. Throw some road salt, sand, mud, dirt, dust, any kind of debris, into that contact patch, and yes, you will get a failure.

I see that now and want to apologize to JayRolla ("cool story, bro"...had to go there, really? LOL) for trying to argue my point with him. He and several others are correct.

Maybe they cant explain exactly HOW, but they all have pretty good proof from experiencing this problem. And, it does make sense now. I have a thick skull, what can I say...LOL.

I WILL be doing my lift in the next 10 days or so, and WILL be using hose clamps (or worm gear clamps), and WILL be "stretching the boots just enough to where the bellows dont contact each other at full travel.

Your good man, I could have handled it better. I didnt want to type the explanation and fight any further!! All Toyota love here!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Rock_Rat]

Thank you Habanero, for posting that pic. And the info along with it!


Been doing a lot of reading...thinking...and playing with my ORS high angle silicone inner boots. I initially could not see how the boot contacting itself would or could cause a failure as there is no side to side friction or movement.

Then it hit me...the bellows contacting each other, although not side to side movement (picture using a piece of sandpaper back and forth. One object moving back and forth against another.), CAN cause friction between each other by UP and DOWN movement or just them pressing together, if you will, over and over again. Basically, one being forced into the other because of the rotation and angle. Throw some road salt, sand, mud, dirt, dust, any kind of debris, into that contact patch, and yes, you will get a failure.

I see that now and want to apologize to JayRolla ("cool story, bro"...had to go there, really? LOL) for trying to argue my point with him. He and several others are correct.

Maybe they cant explain exactly HOW, but they all have pretty good proof from experiencing this problem. And, it does make sense now. I have a thick skull, what can I say...LOL.

I WILL be doing my lift in the next 10 days or so, and WILL be using hose clamps (or worm gear clamps), and WILL be "stretching the boots just enough to where the bellows dont contact each other at full travel.

Agree. That picture is worth a thousand words so they say. I've been reading on how to extend the life of rubber and there's a lot of pros and cons on using 303 Aerospace Protectant and other "stuff". Some say it's all a bunch of "snake oil" and there's nothing you can do, while others swear by it. A real big "no no" is petroleum distillates. UV, and heat are the two biggest reasons for the deterioration of rubber. Some say the CV boot deteriorates from the inside out. Anything you do on the outside is purely cosmetic. I'm "learning" (using that term loosely, mind you), a lot about rubber and CV boots.

 

[D Farms]

one solution ive seen is using o rings in the grooves of the boot to prevent the ribs from touching. alternatively you could use the self fusing tape to do the same thing, except you can apply it with the cv on. it would need to be done very evenly though.

 

[jasonochs25]

Agree. That picture is worth a thousand words so they say. I've been reading on how to extend the life of rubber and there's a lot of pros and cons on using 303 Aerospace Protectant and other "stuff". Some say it's all a bunch of "snake oil" and there's nothing you can do, while others swear by it. A real big "no no" is petroleum distillates. UV, and heat are the two biggest reasons for the deterioration of rubber. Some say the CV boot deteriorates from the inside out. Anything you do on the outside is purely cosmetic. I'm "learning" (using that term loosely, mind you), a lot about rubber and CV boots.

I'm with you RockRat. I have been reading, re-reading, and re-re-reading to figure out the best out for this...I'm just going to go for it...i'll get some hose clamps and use the original boots (226,000 miles...cross your fingers) and hope for the best. At this point, with that many miles, I'll chance it and order new NAPA axles when I need them. I WILL stretch the originals though, and see how long I can get them to last.

There is a lot of great info on here...Loving it!!!!

 

[Rock_Rat]

High Angle and Extended CV Boots Arrived

I ordered the boots on December 21st from Offroad Solutions and All Pro Offroad and I just received them this week. Customer service from both companies was superb after I followed up with them.

Here's a few pics so you can see what they look like:

Off Road Solutions
High Angle Inner CV Boot X 2
Total Cost = $124.07

Includes:
Clamps
CV Grease

All Pro Offroad
Extended Boots
Order: 3501T-AP-CV-KIT - Tacoma CV Boot & Clamp Kit

Includes:
Clamps
Awesome stickers to go with the rest of them - in the toolbox

Right now the fusion tape is holding up great. Fantastic field repair so to speak. I re-enforced the other boot in the suspect areas as well. Both are good. However, when time permits I'll rebuild these and replace, along with new spindles with Total Chaos Gussets and new bearings.. The cost so far to rebuild each side for me should be:

OEM Axle from Junkyard - $40 each
One High Angle Boot - $62 per side
One Extended Boot - $40 per side
Total = $142

The big bonus is I now have a spare set of OEM axles once I replace mine. I never have to worry about a core as long I just keep rebuilding them.

When I get time, I'll throw the rebuild into my build thread and I'll track the mileage etc.

NOTE: I will not be using those cheap clamps. I expected better quality clamps for the price I paid.

 

[NHRunner]

I like those skinny screw clamps with the black boot kit. In case anyone's wondering, NAPA sells the exact same adjustable clamps you got with the red silicone boots. They worked well for me when I stretched my inner oem boots and they're only a dollar each.

 

[Rock_Rat]

I like those skinny screw clamps with the black boot kit. In case anyone's wondering, NAPA sells the exact same adjustable clamps you got with the red silicone boots. They worked well for me when I stretched my inner oem boots and they're only a dollar each.

I'll be using the CV band clamps on both inner and outer. I'm more concerned with the quality and the design of the boot. How many miles on your boots since you stretched them? We're trying to collect some data we can all use in the future to try and extend the life of our boots after a lift.

 

[Rock_Rat]

one solution ive seen is using o rings in the grooves of the boot

The red high angle boots came with an "O" ring in the largest fold on the boot. I'm not sure why they didn't do it to the rest of the boot. Cost perhaps or additional stress on the boot??

 

[Dubk_trd]

shouldve just ran some Porsche 911 cv boots they are them same and cheaper.

 

[NHRunner]

I'll be using the CV band clamps on both inner and outer. I'm more concerned with the quality and the design of the boot. How many miles on your boots since you stretched them? We're trying to collect some data we can all use in the future to try and extend the life of our boots after a lift.

My boots have 248k miles on them, but only 3000 since stretching the inners. They have held fine, except I can tell the innermost ribs are rubbing, so its only a matter of time before they let go.

 

[Rock_Rat]

CV Boot Replacement - Frustration Today

So I figured I would spend the afternoon putting together a decent tutorial for replacing OEM CV boots with the following:

• All Pro 3501T-AP-CV-Kit
• Off Road Solutions ORS-HB201.

Well, no tutorial because it just didn't happen. Frustration level went up instead. I'm not happy with the aftermarket boots.

***********************

After removing the inner boot and CV joint I decided to slide the outer boot (All Pro) over the axle to see how it fits. Obviously this is NOT designed for our 4Runners. I must have the wrong part number.

Next, I decided I would test fit the inner boot (Off Road Solutions) OVER the saved portion of the OEM boot which is designed to accommodate the scallops on the tulip. HA! I'm not sure how I'm going to get that to happen.

As always, I'm usually prepared. I have new OEM boots on my shelf ready to be installed on the axles that are on my rig now. I think I'm going to install them (stretched) on these axles and put the aftermarket boots up for sale.

The "feel" of the OEM boots out of the box are far superior to the general "feel" of the other boots.

Anyway, I'm done for the day. When I get to building these I'll take some pics and put it in my build thread.

Here's some pics.

 

[Rock_Rat]

So I think I'm going to cycle through OEM boots as [MENTION=116877]fourfive[/MENTION] suggested. Just wondering what direction [MENTION=132311]SilvFx[/MENTION] and [MENTION=72272]RussToy[/MENTION] went with your replacement.

How are they holding up?

 

[fourfive]

I'm at about 12k on my oem cv shafts/ boots and so far everything has held up without leaks or tears.