Traction control

[ovrrdrive]

Thanks overdrive, for giving us the moron reply of the day. I don't recall Ricky asking for safety advise or soliciting opinions of the effectiveness of VSC. And yes, it makes total sense that Ricky should buy a different, much more expensive SUV simply because he'd like to disable a feature on the vehicle he has now. How much do you know about the integration of the various systems on the 4Runner?

Tell you what, you get over my post and I won't nominate this one from you... :rolleye2:

While it's true that with this head cold I have at the moment I may be a little more sensitive to bitching than usual, I still stand by my earlier post.


I could care less what he, or you for that matter, do with your trucks but you should understand they are purpose-built and if that purpose doesn't meet your needs then being a smartass to every member of this board that points that out to you won't buy you any points in my book...

My reply was in response to the attitude in the posts above, not the question. I just have a hard time understanding why people get so nasty when they don't hear the answers they want.

The way I see it, at this point I have only pissed off two of you with my response. I'm ok with that.

 

[OUTRNNR]

...I can hang the ass end of my 4Runner 3 FEET out to the side before VSC wakes up and starts beeping at me...

I'm betting you were going pretty slow. Try doing that at 60 mph and it will react alot faster.

At speeds over about 15 mph the VSC will intervene more dramatically because the computer knows how fast the vehicle is moving and, obviously, the faster the speed the more VSC needs to take control of the vehicle safely in the event of a pending loss of control.

So, if you are on the highway trying to pass someone and VSC kicks in, you just got your ass saved. Because, either A) you are driving too fast for conditions on bad roads, or B) you are driving WAY too aggressively on dry roads. (Or maybe you just confused the VSC for ATRAC when you tried to accelerate past a vehicle in poor traction conditions the computer cut the throttle to keep the wheel from spinning).

I've made some pretty dramatic maneuvers in the 4Runner at faster than slow speeds, both planned and unplanned, and I've never engaged the VSC. Remember, the computer senses the vehicle dynamics thousands of times per second, so even though it may have felt like nothing was going to happen, a complex computer algorithm based on multiple real time sensors can actually predict an impending skid, and keep the vehicle in control.

As good of a driver as everyone think they might be, we are all still humans and we make mistakes in judgement. The VSC is there to keep control (or at least attempt to) in a situation where we may be giving less than 100% attention to the road. As much "electronic crap" as you think it may be, chances are it will probably save your ass when you least expect it.

 

[GatorGreg]

It's threads like these that make me happy to own a '00, the last year before VSC and ATRAC came standard and the last year of the stick shift. As much as I like technology, it takes some of the fun away from the driving experience. Pretty soon we'll have the computers doing our own parallel parking for us - oh, wait - it's already on the new Lexus LS

 

[Iowa4Runner]

Tell you what, you get over my post and I won't nominate this one from you... :rolleye2:

While it's true that with this head cold I have at the moment I may be a little more sensitive to bitching than usual, I still stand by my earlier post.


I could care less what he, or you for that matter, do with your trucks but you should understand they are purpose-built and if that purpose doesn't meet your needs then being a smartass to every member of this board that points that out to you won't buy you any points in my book...

My reply was in response to the attitude in the posts above, not the question. I just have a hard time understanding why people get so nasty when they don't hear the answers they want.

The way I see it, at this point I have only pissed off two of you with my response. I'm ok with that.

I'm sorry, but your original post was garbage. Stand by it all you want.

 

[Iowa4Runner]

I'm betting you were going pretty slow. Try doing that at 60 mph and it will react alot faster.

At speeds over about 15 mph the VSC will intervene more dramatically because the computer knows how fast the vehicle is moving and, obviously, the faster the speed the more VSC needs to take control of the vehicle safely in the event of a pending loss of control.

So, if you are on the highway trying to pass someone and VSC kicks in, you just got your ass saved. Because, either A) you are driving too fast for conditions on bad roads, or B) you are driving WAY too aggressively on dry roads. (Or maybe you just confused the VSC for ATRAC when you tried to accelerate past a vehicle in poor traction conditions the computer cut the throttle to keep the wheel from spinning).

I've made some pretty dramatic maneuvers in the 4Runner at faster than slow speeds, both planned and unplanned, and I've never engaged the VSC. Remember, the computer senses the vehicle dynamics thousands of times per second, so even though it may have felt like nothing was going to happen, a complex computer algorithm based on multiple real time sensors can actually predict an impending skid, and keep the vehicle in control.

As good of a driver as everyone think they might be, we are all still humans and we make mistakes in judgement. The VSC is there to keep control (or at least attempt to) in a situation where we may be giving less than 100% attention to the road. As much "electronic crap" as you think it may be, chances are it will probably save your ass when you least expect it.

Here lies anther dead mind in the great battle of marketing hype vs. reality. Put away your product brochures and SUV Weekly magazine and learn to drive. Your comment "you just got your ass saved" made me laugh out loud. Yikes, my previous vehicles must have killed me at least a dozen times. This reincarnation thing is pretty cool

 

[sharp4runr]

Come on fellas, let's keep this civil. No need for name calling. If someone wants to modify their truck to remove the VSC or whatever safety feature, then let them. It's like adding a lift to a truck. Now it's a little higher so more prone to tipping over right? How come we don't give those guys grief?

I do find this comment funny though:

I bought a 2WD 4Runner with the XREAS suspension for a reason; because I intended to use it as it was designed.

Ricky

Like this truck was designed attack corners. It does a good job, but let's not fool forget it is a 4500lb truck.

 

[RickyCRX]

4200lb...


And a Cayenne wouldn't do what I bought the 4Runner to do. Just this evening I had a trailer hitched up to my 4Runner that weighed 8,800lbs loaded with two 3,300lb pallets of landscaping bricks. Try doing that in a Cayenne AND being completely in control of the situation.

For the most part, I can't complain about the 4Runner... Once again, I said to keep the preaching about safety OUT of this thread. I only wanted TECHNICAL DISCUSSIONS in here. There are a few of you had to enter the "moron" category and ignore what I said. YOU are the people that this system was invented for -- those that DON'T FSCKING PAY ATTENTION!!!

Ricky

 

[LV4R]

4200lb...


And a Cayenne wouldn't do what I bought the 4Runner to do. Just this evening I had a trailer hitched up to my 4Runner that weighed 8,800lbs loaded with two 3,300lb pallets of landscaping bricks. Try doing that in a Cayenne AND being completely in control of the situation.

For the most part, I can't complain about the 4Runner... Once again, I said to keep the preaching about safety OUT of this thread. I only wanted TECHNICAL DISCUSSIONS in here. There are a few of you had to enter the "moron" category and ignore what I said. YOU are the people that this system was invented for -- those that DON'T FSCKING PAY ATTENTION!!!

Ricky

8800 LBS!!! UH OH THE WEIGHT POLICE SHOULD BE ARRIVING SHORTLY TO CHIME IN ON THIS ONE!! :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2:

 

[RickyCRX]

Let 'em.... I only had to pull it ~3 miles and never got over 45mph. The 4Runner had PLENTY of power to pull it in overdrive with the torque convertor locked up at ~1300-1400rpm and I had no problems stopping it with electric brakes on the trailer.

Ricky

 

[Koz]

I read an article in one of the rag mags where a professional race car driver was testing the new Z06. He was asked to drive as fast as he could on a race track. He had to use each nanny setting and compare it to a lap with NO help at all. It turns out, after all was said and done, he was asked which was his fastest lap. He said he was sure the lap without any electronic was. It turns out the lap with the mid setting was his fastest lap. He also said that with the mid setting the system had kicked in several times and cut throttle. I was always a FIRM believer that a very good/expert driver, not using any nannies, would be faster then being assisted. WRONG!

Koz

 

[Iowa4Runner]

I read an article in one of the rag mags where a professional race car driver was testing the new Z06. He was asked to drive as fast as he could on a race track. He had to use each nanny setting and compare it to a lap with NO help at all. It turns out, after all was said and done, he was asked which was his fastest lap. He said he was sure the lap without any electronic was. It turns out the lap with the mid setting was his fastest lap. He also said that with the mid setting the system had kicked in several times and cut throttle. I was always a FIRM believer that a very good/expert driver, not using any nannies, would be faster then being assisted. WRONG!

Koz

Anyone who saw Jenson Button's Q3 session in Brazil knows that electronics can help race car drivers. The problem is that not all systems are created equal. The Corvette example above is interesting but nothing more than an anecdote which really proves nothing. How different were the times, how many laps did he turn at each setting, did he have the track to himself, did he get fresh tires before each test? These are only a few of the questions that would need to be answered in order to give this story some teeth. I'm curious how many times the Corvette driver spun off the track as a result of disabling the safety nannies. That's the relevant question.

VSC on the 4Runner is not the same as a Formula1 car or a Corvette. Toyota is far from reaching perfection in their electronic control systems and gives us no reason to put blind faith in them.

 

[gonzo]

this thread says track off,Unplug this:
http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=45793&page=15&pp=25

i may have missed it, but did this work?

 

[POS Racing]

I read an article in one of the rag mags where a professional race car driver was testing the new Z06. He was asked to drive as fast as he could on a race track. He had to use each nanny setting and compare it to a lap with NO help at all. It turns out, after all was said and done, he was asked which was his fastest lap. He said he was sure the lap without any electronic was. It turns out the lap with the mid setting was his fastest lap. He also said that with the mid setting the system had kicked in several times and cut throttle. I was always a FIRM believer that a very good/expert driver, not using any nannies, would be faster then being assisted. WRONG!

Koz

Would you happen to have a link to the article??

Thanks!

 

[Koz]

Iowa4Runner - Anyone can find fault with anything or anybody. The fact is, these systems are life SAVERS and the government is going to make them mandatory on ALL vehicles shortly. I personally feel that the systems in the 4Runner work very well and have stepped in for me on several occasions. I'm a very aggressive driver and consider myself to be a very good driver. I have pulled myself out of many situations (without nannies) that I know not many people could have. I have no fear of speed and react extremely fast and accurately in emergency situations. With that said I feel these systems are great and well worth the LITTLE quirks they exhibit. These systems do things that are IMPOSSIBLE for a human to do. At first I opposed them but now I see they are LIFE SAVERS. I would like for someone to give me an example of how any of these systems are unsafe! Sometimes they are annoying/inconvenient but if I had the choice to pay more for this safety I surely would.

POS - I go to Barns and Noble and read just about every truck, car and motorcycle mag on the market. I do remember the article was in a popular rag like C&D or Motortread a couple months ago.

Koz

 

[OUTRNNR]

Here lies anther dead mind in the great battle of marketing hype vs. reality. Put away your product brochures and SUV Weekly magazine and learn to drive. Your comment "you just got your ass saved" made me laugh out loud. Yikes, my previous vehicles must have killed me at least a dozen times. This reincarnation thing is pretty cool

 

[GatorGreg]

Hey all, please remember to abide by RULE NUMBER TWO, thanks

 

[jwyshrek]

Well, not to go off in a tangent...but this thread is a lot like the state of America right...too sensitive and not enough understanding...just my feeling. Quick to judge and easily offended....know it all, not listening to experience society.

If someone wants to modify his/her vehicle, then let them...let them deal with the outcome.

But to be honest, even if I knew how to do this mode (disable the VSC), I would not tell anyone.

Why? Again, it goes back to the state of America.

I've heard that schools are banning the game of tag...you guys remember tag? Well, they are banning it because the schools are afraid of getting sued by the parents if the child gets hurt.

So, it is a liability issue. As far fetched as it may sound...probably one of the reasons our 4runners and other vehicles have so much 'big brother' electronics...I know they say it is for safety...but...well...


Oh yeah...TAG! you it...

 

[jwyshrek]

er, state of America right now...

 

[ovrrdrive]

Not to offend anyone (yeah right ) but if you had the Cayene and could powerslide out of corners would we see a thread on the Porche forums about how it sucked you couldn't tow a lot?

Or if you bought a truck a thread about not enough passenger carrying capability...

Or a car and a thread about lack of ground clearance...

Say, you're not one of those guys that sues the cigarette companies after they smoked for 20 years and got cancer are you?

:chair:

 

[Iowa4Runner]

Iowa4Runner - Anyone can find fault with anything or anybody. The fact is, these systems are life SAVERS and the government is going to make them mandatory on ALL vehicles shortly. I personally feel that the systems in the 4Runner work very well and have stepped in for me on several occasions. I'm a very aggressive driver and consider myself to be a very good driver. I have pulled myself out of many situations (without nannies) that I know not many people could have. I have no fear of speed and react extremely fast and accurately in emergency situations. With that said I feel these systems are great and well worth the LITTLE quirks they exhibit. These systems do things that are IMPOSSIBLE for a human to do. At first I opposed them but now I see they are LIFE SAVERS. I would like for someone to give me an example of how any of these systems are unsafe! Sometimes they are annoying/inconvenient but if I had the choice to pay more for this safety I surely would.

Koz

The 4Runner's VSC system suffers from much more than little quirks. Sure it CAN do things that are impossible for a human to do, yet it has chosen not to at times it should have.

There are enough soccer moms, geezers, and boozers behind the wheel these days to warrant mandating just about any mediocre safety feature.