V8 vs V6

[Quentin]

I used to be satisfied with the power of the 1GR-FE, until my wife recently got a 2006 GX470. The GX's power is pretty impressive. It comes on smooth, down shifts quickly, and provides plenty of power instantly any time you want it.

On my 4runner, I need to floor it, or use the sport shift (Which annoyingly takes too long to shift) if I ever need power. The sad thing is, the 1GR-FE is of capable of feeling close to as powerful as the V8, it shifting mapping just is horrible. Even putting it in S, doesn't seem to help. I wish that toyota would at least given us the option for an Efficient mapping (in D), and a normal to powerful mapping (in S).

Funny, Consumer Reports measured the 5th Gen 4Runner at 0.2 seconds faster than the 2004 GX470. 0.3 seconds quicker in the quarter mile. A new GX460 has a whopping 0.2 second advantage in the 0-60 run and 0.1 seconds in the quarter mile.

They also just tested the new Jeep Grand Cherokee with the Pentastar V6 and 8AT combo. Exact same city and highway mileage and slower to 60 by 0.3 seconds and the quarter mile by 0.1 seconds.

 

[Lolrax]

I am gonna weigh in on this being a person who switched to a GX 460, not to troll but just to provide comparison and say this:

If you feel like the T4R is underpowered during the test drive, and think you will get used to it you probably won't. I loved the looks, and the potential capability and simplicity of my 4Runner but it just wasn't enough power for me and there was no other way to slice it. The fact that my Limited 4Runner, and its anemic engine cost a couple grand less than a loaded to the gills 5.7L V8 powered Tundra drove me up the wall.

The GX isn't all that much faster on paper, but the extra gear in the transmission and the 30HP and 60lb/ft makes the car a lot more liveable.

 

[Whiplash Willy]

Funny, Consumer Reports measured the 5th Gen 4Runner at 0.2 seconds faster than the 2004 GX470. 0.3 seconds quicker in the quarter mile. A new GX460 has a whopping 0.2 second advantage in the 0-60 run and 0.1 seconds in the quarter mile.

They also just tested the new Jeep Grand Cherokee with the Pentastar V6 and 8AT combo. Exact same city and highway mileage and slower to 60 by 0.3 seconds and the quarter mile by 0.1 seconds.

The 2004 2UZ-FE had 235hp and 320 torques. In 2005, they added VVT-i, which increased to HP to 270hp

 

[Quentin]

The 2004 2UZ-FE had 235hp and 320 torques. In 2005, they added VVT-i, which increased to HP to 270hp

CR didn't have numbers for the revised UZ. Considering the 4Runner falls right between the old and new GX, you could expect the refreshed UZ would have the same numbers as the 5th gen 4Runner.

 

[rox.n.ben]

Update 14 pearl white limited on order!

I had decided to order a GX 460 and it came in yesterday. I received an email asking when I would like to take delivery. I responded with 12/2 13. The salesman called and gave me all of theses reasons why that would not work for him and I must take delivery on 11/30. I cancelled the order and drove directly to Molle Toyota dealer and ordered a 2014 t4R. $18,000 savings later, my t4r will be here mid December and I can take delivery any date in December. Why is the customer less important than the dealership's sales goals? My 08 v8 has been wonderful for the past 5 years and 120,000 problem free miles. I hope that the new one is more of the same. I will think of the 18,000 dollars every time I hit the gas pedal and am disappointed in the delivery of power. It will be just fine thank you! FYI I got the t4R for $350 over invoice and the GX was $2000 under sticker. Toyota dealers have a different approach that is for sure. Comments are appreciated...

 

[13S4]

I'm surprised by all the comments about the V6 sucking. It's got 270hp 278lbs? Thats plenty for the vehicle. The older V6 was significantly worse.

I don't do much off roading (Yet) but the power delivery seems fine to me. I came from a Platinum Sequoia (2008) with the 5.7L and it honestly wasn't anymore impressive than the V6 in the T4R. The Sequoia was so much larger you still had to floor it to get going (especially if towing something).

I don't plan to tow ANYTHING with the 4 Runner but highway cruising I prefer the T4R over the Sequoia. My T4R has the 20" stock wheels that are extremely narrow from factory as you all know, but with less rotational mass it takes far less power to move them.

The amount of power that goes to turning some of those huge tires many members have is incredible. The power difference from the V6 to V8 would be much more noticeable in those cases.

 

[Jeremy556]

The amount of power that goes to turning some of those huge tires many members have is incredible. The power difference from the V6 to V8 would be much more noticeable in those cases.

That's probably a lot of it. Mine feels slow, but is pushing big tires, half a ton or more of extra weight, and fighting 5000-13000 elevation and steep grades. On the plus side, it is feeling a good bit faster now that temps have dropped from 100+ to 20-40f.

 

[Whiplash Willy]

The biggest reason our vehicles feel slow, is that all of the power is in the higher rpms. Our transmission does everything in its power to keep you out of the powerband at all times. There are several areas during my daily commute where I have my foot well into the accelerator, and it still won't downshift. Sure I can floor it and actually get somewhere, but it will only stay in the powerband for a few seconds, then upshift again.

Adding a supercharger won't help either, because your trans will still try to keep you well under 2000 RPMs, where all of the power isn't.

It isn't necessarily about needing a ton of power, and being thrown back in your seat. It would be nice to have the transmission mapped a little less conservatively, just for better driveability. Its not like it would cost us that much more MPGs. My Wife's GX470 gets about 1-2 mpg less then my 4Runner. Also, when you floor it in drive, or try to use the S mode to sequentially shift gears for decent acceleration, its like your transmission forgets how to shift, and you get rough, clunky shifting, at the wrong rpms.

With the GX470, and every other traditional automatic vehicle I have driven, you just have to press the accelerator a little to get it to downshift, and it will actually hold that gear for a reasonable amount of time. You shouldn't have to floor it to get it to downshift whenever you are in need for moderate acceleration. I wish the S mode did more then just limit the top gear, and downshifted quicker and held gears longer. I wish the ECT PWR button would make a comeback!

The sad thing is that our 4runners have all they need to feel like we actually have a 4.0L engine, that has 270HP and 278 Torques, its just poor programming that makes it feel like a slug.

 

[philsey]

.... Its not like it would cost us that much more MPGs....

Unfortunately it's not about you, it's about Toyota's ability to meet gubmint fleet CAFE mileage standards. I'm sure Toyota engineers sweat every 1/10th mpg on every vehicle. Your complaint is really with gubmint oversite, not Toyota.

....
You shouldn't have to floor it to get it to downshift whenever you are in need for moderate acceleration...

I have learned how to make mine downshift, and it's not flooring it. I have found that it's not how far you push the accelerator, rather how fast. Pushing it gradually, say 1", results in not-so-much - but pushing it quickly that same 1", results in a fairly prompt downshift.

You ever tromp hard on your 4R on the highway at, say, 60 mph? This thing has serious power - you're just going to have to learn how to get it.

 

[Yotta]

What I actually want is a manual transmission.

Give me a stick to shift and I am sure the engine will turn out to be perfectly fine.

 

[1engineer]

What I actually want is a manual transmission.

Give me a stick to shift and I am sure the engine will turn out to be perfectly fine.

Two words: Sport mode.

 

[Yotta]

Two words: Sport mode.

Yes, it's a passable substitute but still not quite the real thing

 

[philsey]

What I actually want is a manual transmission.

Give me a stick to shift and I am sure the engine will turn out to be perfectly fine.

Two words: Sport mode.

^ Yup, this. You actually already have one, MOL.

I don't understand this romanticism with a manual transmission. Don't y'all ever drive in traffic? A modern AT is sooo easy, and reliable.... maybe I'm just old.

 

[Yotta]

A modern AT is sooo easy, and reliable....

Note that half of this thread is precisely *****ing about the deficiencies of the 4Runner AT...

 

[nevada]

^ Yup, this. You actually already have one, MOL.

I don't understand this romanticism with a manual transmission. Don't y'all ever drive in traffic? A modern AT is sooo easy, and reliable.... maybe I'm just old.

while its not a 5th gen, I would REALLY like a manual trans in my 2006.
ive always preferred them over autos. I really like being in absolute control of whats going on. being able to push the clutch in to remove the power to the drivetrain is nice.
I know, with the auto, you just pop it in neutral, but it just not the same.

 

[cbdeedy]

They want to deliver it to meet their numbers. I sold cars the dealer owner will give incentives of selling x amount of cars in a month, and if he was close to being the leading salesman, delivering your car by the end of the month could have meant $1,000+ difference in his pay check.

I love my 4runner btw. Just giving insight into the car dealership's mindset.

 

[Jeremy556]

Don't y'all ever drive in traffic?

Nope.

I prefer a real manual with a clutch in most vehicles, but not for off-road. If they offered the 6 speed from the FJ/Taco in the T4R, I'd still pick the auto.

 

[M1911]

I don't understand this romanticism with a manual transmission. Don't y'all ever drive in traffic? A modern AT is sooo easy, and reliable.... maybe I'm just old.

I first started driving in '75. My '03 4Runner is the first car that I've owned that has an automatic. If the 4Runner had been available in a manual, I may well have bought a manual. My previous cars were all manuals. I live in the Boston area and have commuted into Boston and Cambridge in stop-and-don't-go traffic since 1991. As long as the clutch isn't heavy (and most aren't these days), I actually prefer a manual in traffic.

 

[13S4]

I first started driving in '75. My '03 4Runner is the first car that I've owned that has an automatic. If the 4Runner had been available in a manual, I may well have bought a manual. My previous cars were all manuals. I live in the Boston area and have commuted into Boston and Cambridge in stop-and-don't-go traffic since 1991. As long as the clutch isn't heavy (and most aren't these days), I actually prefer a manual in traffic.

I would love to have a manual 4Runner.... You have way more control, and the Sport mode really isn't good for anything besides descending large hills. Ours is my wifes DD so that wouldn't work for her, but I can always dream.

My DD is a 6MT and I don't mind it in traffic at all. It's got enough low end torque that I just slightly release the clutch to start going. If it's stop and go I don't touch the gas.

 

[NoDak]

They want to deliver it to meet their numbers. I sold cars the dealer owner will give incentives of selling x amount of cars in a month, and if he was close to being the leading salesman, delivering your car by the end of the month could have meant $1,000+ difference in his pay check.

I love my 4runner btw. Just giving insight into the car dealership's mindset.

thats funny, cause now he still lost the incentive and the sale instead of just losing the incentive.