ZR2 Bison - a legit TRD Pro killer?

[rihavens]

Ok, so I don't really think that's a relevant point. I admit I do own one vehicle with over 100k miles on it, but that's an antique play thing and here we are at the end of April and it still isn't on the insurance and the battery is still in the basement. (thought it's coming out of storage May1st. Ok disclosures aside. I simply don't own daily drivers past 100k, I personally don't keep my daily drivers that long. I am not a truck guy nor am I a GM guy but to say "oh no, you may have to replace parts after 100k" like it's going to matter is a bit silly.

My point is repaired effect resale value. If it is known for being a garage queen that's expensive to maintain, no one will want it without a warranty. Look at expensive luxury vehicles. Check prices on some exotic sports cars. If they cost a lot to repair, the first owner will take a bath on resale.

 

[jordanrb81]

My point is repaired effect resale value. If it is known for being a garage queen that's expensive to maintain, no one will want it without a warranty. Look at expensive luxury vehicles. Check prices on some exotic sports cars. If they cost a lot to repair, the first owner will take a bath on resale.

have you looked in my garage bud? I drive around in a car with a $117,000.00 window sticker, the ZR2 is not an exotic car. if you off road and really use these vehicles the way they can be used, you won't get 100k out of the shocks. I'm just sayin, it may be a big deal to YOU, but I highly doubt it will impact sales, primary or secondary market sales.

 

[mscot]

Wonder how many sweet jumps they can do...

Damn near spit out my coffee.

 

[rihavens]

have you looked in my garage bud? I drive around in a car with a $117,000.00 window sticker, the ZR2 is not an exotic car. if you off road and really use these vehicles the way they can be used, you won't get 100k out of the shocks. I'm just sayin, it may be a big deal to YOU, but I highly doubt it will impact sales, primary or secondary market sales.

Are you referring to the CLA that's worth less than my 2010 4runner? Kind of proves my point about vehicles depreciating. Nobody wants a high milage AMG, it's only a matter of time before Ethan hand built motor let's loose.

 

[Scramble]

Been there... I wouldn't drive one further than I wanted to walk back - although I did almost impulse buy a Humvee a few months ago... so I can't say I'm always opposed to buying low quality vehicles.

At least someone at GM's heart is in the right place. I used to live pretty close to AEV's shop in Missoula. Back then they were building extended wranglers and wrangler pickups. Looked pretty nice quality wise, but they are were a lot more ICON and a lot less Camburg. They basically cater to the land rover type crowd, meaning in two years of living nearby and offroading the local trails I never once met anyone from AEV at any offroad event or saw or any of AEV's vehicles anywhere off the pavement.

My guess is that $45k is a pipe dream. I'd bet they're $70k. And they sell as fast as they can build them.


Also as a side thought - I'm not sure the proliferation of factory offroad trucks is a good thing. It puts a lot more people on the trails - that's definitely not a good thing. And it puts a lot more people on the trail who have no idea what they're doing and are going to cause a lot of problems for keeping the trails open. ATVs are the worst thing that's ever happened to the offroad community for that reason. I'm concerned that the new flood of these vehicles is going to be a second wave of the same type of shit.

Agreed, you have tons of jerk-offs getting in on the "overlanding thing". The same thing happened with Golf in the 90's. I quit playing because the courses were too crowded. A 3hr game was now taking 4-5 hours & killing the whole day. Same thing with mountain biking in the late 90's early 2000's. Fads are good for vendors but not for us who were into these hobbies before they got popular.

 

[jordanrb81]

Are you referring to the CLA that's worth less than my 2010 4runner? Kind of proves my point about vehicles depreciating. Nobody wants a high milage AMG, it's only a matter of time before Ethan hand built motor let's loose.

I think you're confusing CLS and CLA, the CLA is basically an economy car. The CLS is anything but. Of course all vehicles depreciate, I bought that one when it was 3 years old. It does still have the window sticker and it was $117,000 new. the point is expensive shocks aren't really going to be a deterrent to buyers new or used. That's like saying you shouldn't modify your suspension because the parts are expensive? I mean I replace the OEM tires at 10,000 miles with more expensive tires, not because they were worn, but because I wanted to. It's just a laughable argument to try and make.

 

[jordanrb81]

Are you referring to the CLA that's worth less than my 2010 4runner? Kind of proves my point about vehicles depreciating. Nobody wants a high milage AMG, it's only a matter of time before Ethan hand built motor let's loose.

Also, I am not sure if you think your 4Runner is worth more than it is, or the CLS AMG is worth less than it is but the CLS is about $8,000.00 more than your 4Runner, still picking up a six figure car for $24,000.00 even if it is 11 years old is a pretty good deal.

 

[atalarico]

Boy, you both have big ol' swingin' dicks for sure!

:suspicious:

 

[jordanrb81]

Boy, you both have big ol' swingin' dicks for sure!

:suspicious:

I am simply trying to point out that the presence of $4,000.00 shocks doesn't really have a material impact on the value of a vehicle. People buy cars stock, throw out good new parts and spend more than that every day. it's just a silly thing to even suggest.

 

[STX4Runner]

Agreed, you have tons of jerk-offs getting in on the "overlanding thing". The same thing happened with Golf in the 90's. I quit playing because the courses were too crowded. A 3hr game was now taking 4-5 hours & killing the whole day. Same thing with mountain biking in the late 90's early 2000's. Fads are good for vendors but not for us who were into these hobbies before they got popular.

Hopefully "overlanding" will follow that path and all the instagrammers will flee for the next fad.

 

[jordanrb81]

Agreed, you have tons of jerk-offs getting in on the "overlanding thing". The same thing happened with Golf in the 90's. I quit playing because the courses were too crowded. A 3hr game was now taking 4-5 hours & killing the whole day. Same thing with mountain biking in the late 90's early 2000's. Fads are good for vendors but not for us who were into these hobbies before they got popular.

Ever try to play golf on Father's day? it's worse than going to a restaurant on Valentine's day. It may be regional but I think that fad's over now, most of the courses around here play pretty smooth... with the exception of certain holidays.

 

[rihavens]

Also, I am not sure if you think your 4Runner is worth more than it is, or the CLS AMG is worth less than it is but the CLS is about $8,000.00 more than your 4Runner, still picking up a six figure car for $24,000.00 even if it is 11 years old is a pretty good deal.

Well now you're just being insulting. There's ONE Trail with similar miles avaliable nationally. It's going for $24,998. So I know exactally how much its worth.

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inven...45000&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true

So you're right. Your CLS MAY be worth more than my 4Runner. That said you've LOST more than double the original purchase price of my vehicle in depreciation. Again, I wonder why that is...

I think you're confusing CLS and CLA, the CLA is basically an economy car. The CLS is anything but. Of course all vehicles depreciate, I bought that one when it was 3 years old. It does still have the window sticker and it was $117,000 new. the point is expensive shocks aren't really going to be a deterrent to buyers new or used. That's like saying you shouldn't modify your suspension because the parts are expensive? I mean I replace the OEM tires at 10,000 miles with more expensive tires, not because they were worn, but because I wanted to. It's just a laughable argument to try and make.

I am simply trying to point out that the presence of $4,000.00 shocks doesn't really have a material impact on the value of a vehicle. People buy cars stock, throw out good new parts and spend more than that every day. it's just a silly thing to even suggest.

But that's the point of the ZR2. The shocks is what sets it apart from other Colorados. It'd be like buying a CLS and swapping the motor for a CLA engine.

 

[jordanrb81]

Well now you're just being insulting. There's ONE Trail with similar miles avaliable nationally. It's going for $24,998. So I know exactally how much its worth.

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inven...45000&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true

So you're right. Your CLS MAY be worth more than my 4Runner. That said you've LOST more than double the original purchase price of my vehicle in depreciation. Again, I wonder why that is...






But that's the point of the ZR2. The shocks is what sets it apart from other Colorados. It'd be like buying a CLS and swapping the motor for a CLA engine.

yes that is the point, you get everything all kitted up from the factory so you don't have to go through and replace all the parts yourself. anything that is specialty is going to cost more... duh GM's all depreciate pretty heavily have you looked at a 3 year old escalade over new. So I am not saying it won't depreciate, but it won't be because of the shocks, again, laughable argument. For the exact reason you stated, it's the whole reason you want the vehicle in the first place.

Yes, I paid 60k for my CLS in 2010... almost got it for half price, but I beat up the guy and basically stole it, they were going for much more than that. all the same in the last 8 years it has continued to fall basically the price I paid for my NEW 4Runner 36k, ask if I care? In a few more years when the value starts going the other direction like my SL already has and I am 2 to 3 cars past my '17 4Runner I'll be more than ok with it. Also if you think your 2010 4Runner is worth more than $16,000.00 you're high!!! If you don't believe me, go wreck it or report it stolen and wait for the insurance check to come.

 

[rihavens]

Also if you think your 2010 4Runner is worth more than $16,000.00 you're high!!! If you don't believe me, go wreck it or report it stolen and wait for the insurance check to come.

I'm growing tired of this argument.

https://www.kbb.com/toyota/4runner/...e-in&options=6364710|true&condition=very-good

This is assuming it is only in "very good" condition and with no modifications. As for my insurance? I have gap covrage.

Let me know when your Merc starts rebounding in value. I'll be next to you enjoying that cold day in hell.

 

[jordanrb81]

I'm growing tired of this argument.

https://www.kbb.com/toyota/4runner/...e-in&options=6364710|true&condition=very-good

This is assuming it is only in "very good" condition and with no modifications. As for my insurance? I have gap covrage.

Let me know when your Merc starts rebounding in value. I'll be next to you enjoying that cold day in hell.

you only need gap coverage if you owe more than it's worth, which seems to me like you're conceding that it's not worth much. If you don't think an '07 CLS AMG will begin to appreciate in value it just further shows you know exactly nothing about automobiles. This thread isn't about your absurdity or ignorance, or the fact that you still owe money on an eight year old vehicle. it's about the ZR2. For, hopefully the last time, it having expensive shocks will not negatively impact it's value, new or at resale. As a matter of fact, anyone got a price on the Fox Shocks the new TRD PRO is coming with, I assume they're a few bucks.

 

[Jetboy]

Lots of Mercedes and Land Rovers end up at the salvage yard as a result of suspension issues. Hell, my next door neighbor has a mid 2000's S500 that's headed there soon for that exact reason. Air suspension isn't worth fixing anymore. It's been sitting on the bumps for a year in the driveway. City's going to take it if they don't get rid of it.

S500's are basically disposable cars due to low build quality in general, but the shocks failing is only one of many issues that leaves them dead in the driveway. So it's often the nail in the coffin. There's a lot of reasons a 2005 LS430 is worth 2-3 times what a 2005 S500 is, even though it cost about $20k less new. The crap suspension is probably the biggest one.

The multimatic shocks are at least easily replaceable with standard ones. And wearing out doesn't make them unusable like air suspension does. I'm sure you can buy a $100 set of 5100's to replace them.

Now a VM Motori 2.8 diesel with 200k miles - no one in their right mind would touch it with a 10 foot pole. No one has to worry about the shocks at 200k because they'll almost all be scrap metal by 200k miles as a result of the engine. When's the last time you saw a Liberty DIesel (same motor series) driving around? Very few of those lasted to 100k miles.

 

[jordanrb81]

Lots of Mercedes and Land Rovers end up at the salvage yard as a result of suspension issues. Hell, my next door neighbor has a mid 2000's S500 that's headed there soon for that exact reason. Air suspension isn't worth fixing anymore. It's been sitting on the bumps for a year in the driveway. City's going to take it if they don't get rid of it.

S500's are basically disposable cars due to low build quality in general, but the shocks failing is only one of many issues that leaves them dead in the driveway. So it's often the nail in the coffin. There's a lot of reasons a 2005 LS430 is worth 2-3 times what a 2005 S500 is, even though it cost about $20k less new. The crap suspension is probably the biggest one.

The multimatic shocks are at least easily replaceable with standard ones. And wearing out doesn't make them unusable like air suspension does. I'm sure you can buy a $100 set of 5100's to replace them.

Now a VM Motori 2.8 diesel with 200k miles - no one in their right mind would touch it with a 10 foot pole. No one has to worry about the shocks at 200k because they'll almost all be scrap metal by 200k miles as a result of the engine. When's the last time you saw a Liberty DIesel (same motor series) driving around? Very few of those lasted to 100k miles.

I agree with you, at least on the first two paragraphs, I confess you sort of lost me after that. I have been through 4 daily drivers since purchasing that CLS in 2010, an S500 is a throw away vehicle, it's just a daily driver. they're not special. the first gen C-219 CLS created a market, without it there wouldn't be an Audi A7 BMW Gran Turismo or any other "4 door Coupe" also 2007 was the first year AMG became a wholly owned part of Mercedes allowing it to be a 100 point car at a concourse event. all earlier models would have points deducted for modification despite being partially owned by Mercedes. Add the fact that the M156 engine was the first that AMG was allowed to produce from the ground up, as opposed to earlier AMG's that were modified factory engines. We are way off topic here, but there is no doubt amongst the car collecting community that this will be a very valuable car in a few years. I am sure I'll have it way longer than I'll have my 4Runner.

But again, or still? this is supposed to be about the ZR-2 and I was specifically responding to an absurd comment about expensive shocks ruining the vehicle (which it won't ).

 

[rihavens]

Lots of Mercedes and Land Rovers end up at the salvage yard as a result of suspension issues. Hell, my next door neighbor has a mid 2000's S500 that's headed there soon for that exact reason. Air suspension isn't worth fixing anymore. It's been sitting on the bumps for a year in the driveway. City's going to take it if they don't get rid of it.

S500's are basically disposable cars due to low build quality in general, but the shocks failing is only one of many issues that leaves them dead in the driveway. So it's often the nail in the coffin. There's a lot of reasons a 2005 LS430 is worth 2-3 times what a 2005 S500 is, even though it cost about $20k less new. The crap suspension is probably the biggest one.

The multimatic shocks are at least easily replaceable with standard ones. And wearing out doesn't make them unusable like air suspension does. I'm sure you can buy a $100 set of 5100's to replace them.

Now a VM Motori 2.8 diesel with 200k miles - no one in their right mind would touch it with a 10 foot pole. No one has to worry about the shocks at 200k because they'll almost all be scrap metal by 200k miles as a result of the engine. When's the last time you saw a Liberty DIesel (same motor series) driving around? Very few of those lasted to 100k miles.

That's because nobody is stupid enough to purchase DaimlerChrysler garbage.

Oh, wait.

 

[jordanrb81]

That's because nobody is stupid enough to purchase DaimlerChrysler garbage.

Oh, wait.

Daimler dumped Chrysler in 2006... Chrysler is owned by Fiat now, keep up

 

[rihavens]

Daimler dumped Chrysler in 2006... Chrysler is owned by Fiat now, keep up

Oh my god. It was designed in 2001 and entered into production in 2004. How do you profess to know everything about automobiles and be able to predict the future of the value when you don't even know who designed it?