2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee
- Thread starter Thai
- Start date
Uneek
Super Moderator
:iagree:
I think Toyota's reliability and dependability is still there. However, overall quality is down. But this can be subjective since lower quality parts can lead to reliability issues, etc. Reliability should be is the vehicle doing exactly what it needs to do, things are in working order, functional, etc. Quality is how well is everything put together, rattles, squeaks, etc.
Let me start by saying that I am a huge toyota fan and all of my purchases have been toyota's. My 4runner was recently totalled due to a silly guy driving and texting on the expressway:-(. I am currenlt looking to replace my 4runner with a new 5th gen limited. My main reason for sticking with the 4runner brand is simply because I know the product. I have had 250k trouble free miles out of my last 4runner. Also, geez the resale value of these things are awesome. You guys would never guess what I got for my totalled 3rd gen limited 4runner - lol. But I must admit I dooooo like the new Jeep GC i test drove a limited with the Hemi and geez that thing is a beast. I personally feel that toyota cut some corners big time with the new 4runner. For a 40k+ vehicle toyota left alot of features off the list that were included on the jeep for the same price. The power of the 4runner is good enough for me. But I would love to have some of the features the jeep has on the 4runner. I also like the interior of the jeep better than the 4runner. But being the fan boy I am I will still pick up the 4runner but not at this price competition is getting tough and with the new explorer coming to market that makes it a little tougher for the 4runner and we will probably start seeing a little bit more discounting on the 5th gen. I am starting to see dealers around the area inventories of 4runners increase even though toyota has a low production number for this vehicle. I was reading somewhere that the month numbers for the 5th gen are between 3900 - 4700. While the Jeep isn't at full production and they had a month wehre they sold 12k freaking jeeps. I was recently at my local dealer and he was trying to get rid of some inventory bad and he gave me an agressive number but i figure that the new models of the exp and gc will draw customers from my beloved toyota brand and I will get a more agressive price - lol.
-JD-
New member
Just to revive this thread. I'm currenty in the market for 4runner, but am also considering the GC...
This is the way I see things.
Styling
The front end is a clear win for the GC. The new headlights and the angular 7 slot grille are beautiful. From the side though, the 4runner is the clear winner. The GC does look a little minivanish, and i find it somewhat bland. The 4runner has beautiful lines from the side and the bulge in the fenders looks awesome. The rear is a bit closer, but I've got to give it to the 4runner. The tail lights on the GC look really cheap, and look very 'generic' to any dodge product. I like the 4runners somewhat chunky sytling on the tailgate.
Performance
Comparable really. The Jeep has a V8 option. Not something i want, but if you are in the market for a V8 you might want to consider it. Although, from what I've read the V8 is hardly quicker and gives much less mileage.
Options/Features
GC wins for sure. Much more options and can be loaded up with a lot of features you can't get on a 4runner at all. Like the big panoramic moonroof, ventilated seats, etc
Off-road
This is where it gets interesting. Base 4x4 to base 4x4 the 4runner is more capable and has more ground clearance. The GC is only really competitive at all when you get up to the overland model with quadra drive II and the air lift suspension. But the price of an overland is significantly higher than a TE 4runner...
even still, I would be hard pressed to say that the overland is going to be 'better' off-road. A 4runner can be easily and relatively cheaply lifted and have oversized tires added, and not look ridiculous. This is going to be hard to do with the air lift GC. Not to mention that the GC wont have the articulation that the 4runner has with that air suspension and the GC looks pretty ridiculous when lifted to its full height, so living with a permanent lift or installing oversized tires really isn't an option. Which makes the 4runner a better off road option IMO.
Realiability
Is really what this all comes down too. One big factor that no one has mentioned yet is the currency exchange. It used to be a lot easier for Toyota to compete because US dollars went a long way in Japan. They could sell their models fully load and really "over build" them at a competitive price and still turn a big profit. Now with the rising Yen they've had to cut production costs. This has really 'leveled the playing field' as you hear a lot of journalists saying lately. Thing is, I look at the 4runner and its obvious where toyota has cut costs. Interior plastics, thinner panels, less equipped. When I look at the GC and all the seemingly expensive leathers and technologies and features it leaves me wondering how much quality has been built into the engine/drivetrain.
I currently own a tundra which suffers some of these same issues (cheap interior plastics, less features) but I know that toyota spent the money where it counted and still built a reliable vehicle. lots of tundra owners with over 100K and no serious issues. This gives me much more reason to think the same will be true of the new 4runners.
Given past GC problems I am skeptical that in these hard economic times and amidst ownership changes and other internal shakeups they have been able to, not only engineer a product to a level they haven't in the past, but also include a boatload of expensive features at a competitive price. I'm not saying its impossible, but not sure if I want to gamble on it...
Sure Toyota's had a growing number of issues lately, but they've also started building a growing number of vehicles in the US... From what I've read the 'made in Japan' Toyota's tend to be of much higher build quality...
Really not sure at this point. The overland GC that I would have to have is a little more pricey than the TE 4runner that I would get, but is also better equipped. Things like resale value horrify me however. And I'm still just not sure about the quality of the JEEP. Whereas toyota has decades of proven reliability, and although there has been some obvious cost cutting I have personal reason to believe that they've still maintained quality where it counts...
This is the way I see things.
Styling
The front end is a clear win for the GC. The new headlights and the angular 7 slot grille are beautiful. From the side though, the 4runner is the clear winner. The GC does look a little minivanish, and i find it somewhat bland. The 4runner has beautiful lines from the side and the bulge in the fenders looks awesome. The rear is a bit closer, but I've got to give it to the 4runner. The tail lights on the GC look really cheap, and look very 'generic' to any dodge product. I like the 4runners somewhat chunky sytling on the tailgate.
Performance
Comparable really. The Jeep has a V8 option. Not something i want, but if you are in the market for a V8 you might want to consider it. Although, from what I've read the V8 is hardly quicker and gives much less mileage.
Options/Features
GC wins for sure. Much more options and can be loaded up with a lot of features you can't get on a 4runner at all. Like the big panoramic moonroof, ventilated seats, etc
Off-road
This is where it gets interesting. Base 4x4 to base 4x4 the 4runner is more capable and has more ground clearance. The GC is only really competitive at all when you get up to the overland model with quadra drive II and the air lift suspension. But the price of an overland is significantly higher than a TE 4runner...
even still, I would be hard pressed to say that the overland is going to be 'better' off-road. A 4runner can be easily and relatively cheaply lifted and have oversized tires added, and not look ridiculous. This is going to be hard to do with the air lift GC. Not to mention that the GC wont have the articulation that the 4runner has with that air suspension and the GC looks pretty ridiculous when lifted to its full height, so living with a permanent lift or installing oversized tires really isn't an option. Which makes the 4runner a better off road option IMO.
Realiability
Is really what this all comes down too. One big factor that no one has mentioned yet is the currency exchange. It used to be a lot easier for Toyota to compete because US dollars went a long way in Japan. They could sell their models fully load and really "over build" them at a competitive price and still turn a big profit. Now with the rising Yen they've had to cut production costs. This has really 'leveled the playing field' as you hear a lot of journalists saying lately. Thing is, I look at the 4runner and its obvious where toyota has cut costs. Interior plastics, thinner panels, less equipped. When I look at the GC and all the seemingly expensive leathers and technologies and features it leaves me wondering how much quality has been built into the engine/drivetrain.
I currently own a tundra which suffers some of these same issues (cheap interior plastics, less features) but I know that toyota spent the money where it counted and still built a reliable vehicle. lots of tundra owners with over 100K and no serious issues. This gives me much more reason to think the same will be true of the new 4runners.
Given past GC problems I am skeptical that in these hard economic times and amidst ownership changes and other internal shakeups they have been able to, not only engineer a product to a level they haven't in the past, but also include a boatload of expensive features at a competitive price. I'm not saying its impossible, but not sure if I want to gamble on it...
Sure Toyota's had a growing number of issues lately, but they've also started building a growing number of vehicles in the US... From what I've read the 'made in Japan' Toyota's tend to be of much higher build quality...
Really not sure at this point. The overland GC that I would have to have is a little more pricey than the TE 4runner that I would get, but is also better equipped. Things like resale value horrify me however. And I'm still just not sure about the quality of the JEEP. Whereas toyota has decades of proven reliability, and although there has been some obvious cost cutting I have personal reason to believe that they've still maintained quality where it counts...
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Thai
Elite Member
Reading your extensive review, i think that you made up your mind already!
Congrats on your new 4runner!
-JD-
New member
Reading your extensive review, i think that you made up your mind already!
Congrats on your new 4runner!
haha! not at all! I actually went and test drove an overland GC again today! It drives nice, lots of great features. But it still comes down to the quality thing. I just dont know how it will hold up long term as well as resale.
I do also find that the GC feels like a luxury crossover thats had some 'doo-dads' added to make it able to go off road, whereas the 4runner feels more like an off-roader thats been civilized enough to use on road...
Really what might seal the deal for the 4runner is the price. I can't get the quadra lift air suspension and quarda drive 2 without going up to the overland model, which is significantly more than a TE or even a limited 4runner....
CookieRoe
Senior Member
I don't doubt the Overland model is very nice (nicer than a t4r limited for sure), but they are some flags here. I don't know off hand what mechanical pieces are shared with the current ML (prbly very little), but that dreaded "Jeep legacy" of reliability (or lack thereof). Please don't forget air suspensions (even the best ones from whatever manufacture) eventually fail, prematurely that is. When they do, are extremely expensive. Coupled this with "Jeep reliability"....... I think the answer is still NO (no matter how nice it is).....
HOWEVER, there is an "X" factor, If you plan on keeping the rig for a limited time (when the warranty runs out), then yes, perhaps it would be a good option. If long-term, well.......... the jury is still out on this model, but most bets are NO.
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-JD-
New member
I totally agree with what you guys are saying. My personal history with chrysler products has been very very poor. After getting on the Jeep forums I see that numerous people are already having problems with their air suspension, and it sounds like most dealers are clueless about how to service them.
But i also know that jeep has always been the best chrysler brand and, i think, the only division of chrysler that actually MAKES money... Given their ownership by diamler (a company that knows at least something about cars) I would like to think that they would have really stepped up the quality of one of their only profitable models when it came time for a big overhaul.
I would like to think.
I just dont know if I could actually buy it though, just feels like to much of a 'gamble' in terms or reliability and resale value. I want to keep my next vehicle for quite awhile as I plan to go back to school soon so I would need something reliable for at least 4 years, and it'd be nice if it was still worth something when i decided to get rid of it
I guess what I really want is the a GC with a 4runner drive train and price tag, or a 4runner with the features of a GC...
But i also know that jeep has always been the best chrysler brand and, i think, the only division of chrysler that actually MAKES money... Given their ownership by diamler (a company that knows at least something about cars) I would like to think that they would have really stepped up the quality of one of their only profitable models when it came time for a big overhaul.
I would like to think.
I just dont know if I could actually buy it though, just feels like to much of a 'gamble' in terms or reliability and resale value. I want to keep my next vehicle for quite awhile as I plan to go back to school soon so I would need something reliable for at least 4 years, and it'd be nice if it was still worth something when i decided to get rid of it
I guess what I really want is the a GC with a 4runner drive train and price tag, or a 4runner with the features of a GC...
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Ive owned 1st, 2nd, 3rd gen Grand Cherokees. 98 4.0, 00 4.7, 02 4.7HO, 06 Hemi
Every one of them had diffs rbuilt by 40K miles. The 02 Overland needed $4500 worth of warranty work in ONE MONTH. This was at about 40K miles. My 06 needed entire front axle assembly and rear diff rebuilt at 7500 miles. They needed to be rebuilt again at 16000 miles. Chrysler service is horrible. I mean horrible. I fought for months to get that stuff taken care of under warranty. The 2011 sure looked promising but go lurk jeepgarage.org. They are complete junk still. Engines failing, vehicles CATCHING FIRE, water leaking in the cabin during a car wash? The list goes on and on. Do NOT risk your hard earned money on Chrysler JUNK. You will get burned, possibly literally. Lol
Every one of them had diffs rbuilt by 40K miles. The 02 Overland needed $4500 worth of warranty work in ONE MONTH. This was at about 40K miles. My 06 needed entire front axle assembly and rear diff rebuilt at 7500 miles. They needed to be rebuilt again at 16000 miles. Chrysler service is horrible. I mean horrible. I fought for months to get that stuff taken care of under warranty. The 2011 sure looked promising but go lurk jeepgarage.org. They are complete junk still. Engines failing, vehicles CATCHING FIRE, water leaking in the cabin during a car wash? The list goes on and on. Do NOT risk your hard earned money on Chrysler JUNK. You will get burned, possibly literally. Lol
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I rented a 2011 GC Ltd for a fairly extensive driving vacation with it and enjoyed it quite a bit. Very competent on road vehicle and loved all the gadgets. With that said I've looked at them over the years several times when buying and due to reliability issues and lack of true frame and other compromises, I'm a happy 4Runner owner.
Satter
New member
United Auto Workers Union. Making American products less and less significant since 1935.
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/05_19/b3932001_mz001.htm
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My '03 4Runner got totalled 2.5 weeks back and I'm looking for a replacement. Checked out a couple of '11s and really didn't like the looks. Looked for something like an '08 and found them all over the place in price and condition but felt fine with them. So, still looking.
My buddy has a Jeep Rubicon and suggested I try Jeep. Yesterday, I did, and test drove a '12 Wrangler Unlimited 4dr. I found it amusing but didn't know how long it would be airtight and repair free. At a meeting last night, I spoke with a another long time friend who is into Jeeps and he just took his 4 month old '11 Jeep GC into the shop because of peeling paint. Service gave him a hard time and said they wouldn't cover it unless "headquarters" OK'd it and it might take weeks to get an answer. He's furious. I'm convinced that I'll stay with 4R!
My buddy has a Jeep Rubicon and suggested I try Jeep. Yesterday, I did, and test drove a '12 Wrangler Unlimited 4dr. I found it amusing but didn't know how long it would be airtight and repair free. At a meeting last night, I spoke with a another long time friend who is into Jeeps and he just took his 4 month old '11 Jeep GC into the shop because of peeling paint. Service gave him a hard time and said they wouldn't cover it unless "headquarters" OK'd it and it might take weeks to get an answer. He's furious. I'm convinced that I'll stay with 4R!
CookieRoe
Senior Member
To keep this thread "fresh", I thought I would throw in a link. User McKaresh link:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/27641-toyota-4runner-reliability-how-does-compare.html
In his study, if you scroll down about half way, you will see the current generation Jeep Grand Cherokee. You will see that they rated very low.
Toyota 4Runner Reliability
Link to problems: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Problems and Repair Histories
Anyway, wow.
This should quell some opinions that "they set out to make a world class SUV" / this generation will be different. Well, figures aren't looking good. The more things change (JGC), the more they stay the same (Jeep=Junk).
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/27641-toyota-4runner-reliability-how-does-compare.html
In his study, if you scroll down about half way, you will see the current generation Jeep Grand Cherokee. You will see that they rated very low.
Toyota 4Runner Reliability
Link to problems: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee Problems and Repair Histories
Anyway, wow.
This should quell some opinions that "they set out to make a world class SUV" / this generation will be different. Well, figures aren't looking good. The more things change (JGC), the more they stay the same (Jeep=Junk).
DannyLlama
Elite Member
I Like how it has an option for Rock, so the suspension goes down... That's just an air suspension, correct?
CookieRoe
Senior Member
yes, they have air (bag) suspension. QuadraCrap, I mean, QuadraLift suspension:
2012 Grand Cherokee | Off Road Performance | Jeep
In my family we've owned all generations of the GCs. 98 Orvis, 99 Limited, and 05 Laredo. I recently got rid of a 98 Cherokee.
The 98 and 99 GCs were junk. We had constant issues. The Cherokee's water pump went out before 100k miles and the rear end and transfer case were going when I sold it. The 05 didn't give us any major problems, but that's likely due to the fact that we bought it with 54k miles and sold it with 62k. We owned it about 6 months.
None of them could touch the peace of mind I have had with my 4Runners. I would have driven my first 3rd gen cross country and not thought twice about it, and once I do some maintenance on my current 3rd gen I have no doubt I'll feel the same way. The Jeeps I wouldn't feel safe leaving the state. They're just cheap junk, pure and simple. I am not at all surprised to see the information in this thread about the WK2's already showing signs of trouble. There's a reason Chrysler is continuously fighting off financial issues and that's because they sell crap and have for years.
The 98 and 99 GCs were junk. We had constant issues. The Cherokee's water pump went out before 100k miles and the rear end and transfer case were going when I sold it. The 05 didn't give us any major problems, but that's likely due to the fact that we bought it with 54k miles and sold it with 62k. We owned it about 6 months.
None of them could touch the peace of mind I have had with my 4Runners. I would have driven my first 3rd gen cross country and not thought twice about it, and once I do some maintenance on my current 3rd gen I have no doubt I'll feel the same way. The Jeeps I wouldn't feel safe leaving the state. They're just cheap junk, pure and simple. I am not at all surprised to see the information in this thread about the WK2's already showing signs of trouble. There's a reason Chrysler is continuously fighting off financial issues and that's because they sell crap and have for years.
CookieRoe
Senior Member
still believe good things about the JGC? Look here
2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee probed for fire risk - Bottom Line
Some things will never change. Enjoy all
2012 Jeep Grand Cherokee probed for fire risk - Bottom Line
Some things will never change. Enjoy all
