All New Bilstein 8112/8100 High Performance Suspension
- Thread starter Battle Born Offroad
- Start date
volpe30
New member
They look amazing and early feedback sounds great. However they are priced for those that can start their campfire at night using $100 bills as kindling. Guess the 6112/5160 combo is for us common working folk and these new ones are for the Jeff Bezos/Elon Musk type 4Runner drivers.
Before anyone fires up their flamethrowers I’m being satirical, sort of...
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Before anyone fires up their flamethrowers I’m being satirical, sort of...
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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MicrowaveOven
New member
Prices are not out of line at all. What is the lead time currently?
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MAST4R
New member
Unfortunately, such are the prices now.
A full Fox 2.5 DSC setup is only about 500$ cheaper and has no bypasses. Icon 2.5 rear with bypasses is even pricier than the 8100!
And Bilstein is the "latest and greatest" bolt on option for a 4R.
Another way to think of it is "top shocks + top bumpstops" which cost like 600$ just for the rear otherwise.
So, yeah, very expensive, but not out of line with everything else.
There is also something to be said about ThyssenKrupp engineering capabilities and quality control.
A full Fox 2.5 DSC setup is only about 500$ cheaper and has no bypasses. Icon 2.5 rear with bypasses is even pricier than the 8100!
And Bilstein is the "latest and greatest" bolt on option for a 4R.
Another way to think of it is "top shocks + top bumpstops" which cost like 600$ just for the rear otherwise.
So, yeah, very expensive, but not out of line with everything else.
There is also something to be said about ThyssenKrupp engineering capabilities and quality control.
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Did you end up going with 8100's yet? If so, how do you like em?
MAST4R
New member
More versions of the 8000 series coming
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImC4KsgPnVE
8112 with dual compression adjusters
8100 with knob adjusters
8100 smooth body
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImC4KsgPnVE
8112 with dual compression adjusters
8100 with knob adjusters
8100 smooth body
MAST4R
New member
I ordered a month ago.
I want to see the 8100s first and then later I may or may not replace the 6112s prematurely with 8112. The compression adjusters would help tremendously. I don't want to replace springs all the time.
The 8112 uses the same springs as the 6112 so this makes me wonder if the 8112 without compression adjusters will feel right in the desert/over rocks. Zone 1 with the soft springs, I am guessing, would be the same in rocks as 6112 with soft springs, i.e. bouncy, hitting.
So being able to stiffen it up offroad while retaining the soft springs would be great. Everyone says the 8112 is superb on road which makes me doubt it is firm enough off road without adjusters. But I am no expert, so there is that.
They perfect excellently in the desert. They really smooth out with speed. I’m fully loaded with camp gear here, passing by at about 60 mph:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwo7mxo_wGE&feature=youtu.be
This next video isn’t mine, but sent to me from the owner in the UAE. He had questions about the 8112/8100s before buying, and has been keeping me updated.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwo7mxo_wGE&feature=youtu.be
This next video isn’t mine, but sent to me from the owner in the UAE. He had questions about the 8112/8100s before buying, and has been keeping me updated.
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I will be interested to hear how it all comes together for you. We are moving back to AZ in the next few months, maybe I'll come take a peep in person
MAST4R
New member
I will be interested to hear how it all comes together for you. We are moving back to AZ in the next few months, maybe I'll come take a peep in person
Well, for now I am the proud owner of one 8100 series shock :der:
I am starting to wonder if the second will arrive in time for summer vacation. I had to alter our Memorial Day outing a little due to using Eibach rear shocks. So I canceled a planned 140 mile 1-day drive of a corrugated dirt road.
The pleasures of 1-shock owners are as follows: fool around with bypass settings and press the shock by hand, very enlightening :reddance:
Anyway. There is a huge difference between fully open and fully closed compression.
Looks like the 8100 will provide the same down travel as the Icon 2.0, which is more than 5" at 1" rear lift. At the same time, it also looks like the 8100 will provide a full 4" of uptravel vs 2.5 for the Icon (I will see how much on the Eibach when I pull them off). The Eibach shocks only have 4" of down travel though they are better than the Icon 2.0 on up travel due to having a shorter body.
The fact that the 8100 maximizes both up and down travel is already a huge benefit for vehicles that are used in both desert and mountain/canyon country.
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MAST4R
New member
I also am the proud owner of exactly one 8100 shock!
Haha, I know, right? Yes, only rear right ones were recently produced. I think the rear left ones should be currently in production.
It is great to have race style shocks on a family wagon (remember that when you try to adjust rebound even with the tire off!
).
MAST4R
New member
OK, so here is what I have found as the best way to make 8100 adjustments on the vehicle:
1/ Hex goes
2/ into an adaptor that goes
3/ into a 1/4 inch STUBBY flexible head ratchet
Lift vehicle by rock slider or flex it in order to expose the rebound bypass tube--the rest is easy though each movement is probably 1/8 turn. I roughly figure 8 per one full turn. One can also learn to measure the exposed thread as an alternative.
So what about on-trail adjustments?
I have a small secondary garage jack that won't be hard to carry but need to figure out an extender. The Harbor Freight aluminum racing jack 1.5t (mine is bigger and heavier) would be perfect for serious outings. I have carried my heavy one when not with the kids/dog. In any case, having a reliable quick jack is a good idea.
EDIT:
So the tool above takes about 6 movements per 1 rotation on compression. So, 6 for 10% stiffer from fully open, roughly 60-70 for full closed.
The rebound, lol, involves smaller movements so they are countless, possibly double those needed for compression. So here I just measured the difference in length of the treads to see how to get it to half way, maybe a little softer than half way.
Clearly making finite adjustments with this will be...yeah, very finite with like 120 movements on rebound (hence you need a ratchet not to go insane).
1/ Hex goes
2/ into an adaptor that goes
3/ into a 1/4 inch STUBBY flexible head ratchet
Lift vehicle by rock slider or flex it in order to expose the rebound bypass tube--the rest is easy though each movement is probably 1/8 turn. I roughly figure 8 per one full turn. One can also learn to measure the exposed thread as an alternative.
So what about on-trail adjustments?
I have a small secondary garage jack that won't be hard to carry but need to figure out an extender. The Harbor Freight aluminum racing jack 1.5t (mine is bigger and heavier) would be perfect for serious outings. I have carried my heavy one when not with the kids/dog. In any case, having a reliable quick jack is a good idea.
EDIT:
So the tool above takes about 6 movements per 1 rotation on compression. So, 6 for 10% stiffer from fully open, roughly 60-70 for full closed.
The rebound, lol, involves smaller movements so they are countless, possibly double those needed for compression. So here I just measured the difference in length of the treads to see how to get it to half way, maybe a little softer than half way.
Clearly making finite adjustments with this will be...yeah, very finite with like 120 movements on rebound (hence you need a ratchet not to go insane).
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MAST4R
New member
I was looking at prices of Fox 2.5 just because of another thread, in comparison to Elka.
What struck me is that Fox seems to have upped the prices quite a bit. I may be wrong but they are asking more for their old-fashioned front shocks than Bilstein was asking for 8112 until recently.
Considering that Bilstein is adding adjusters to the new batches of 8112s, I fear the price may get a pretty serious boost to maybe close to 2,500 for a pair!
I wonder if they will keep the option without adjusters. I personally feel that the adjusters would make a big difference considering the lack of mid-spring option (a 600 would be nice).
What struck me is that Fox seems to have upped the prices quite a bit. I may be wrong but they are asking more for their old-fashioned front shocks than Bilstein was asking for 8112 until recently.
Considering that Bilstein is adding adjusters to the new batches of 8112s, I fear the price may get a pretty serious boost to maybe close to 2,500 for a pair!
I wonder if they will keep the option without adjusters. I personally feel that the adjusters would make a big difference considering the lack of mid-spring option (a 600 would be nice).
MAST4R
New member
So just in case you thought rebound adjustment on 8100 cannot be any worse than it is on the rear pax, wait till you try the rear driver!
My 1/4in ratcheting stubby with the hex works well on pax side, but its head is too big for the driver side. And in both cases, a shorter tool would be better.
Bilstein say they are working on a knob. That will have to be a tiny little knob because there is very little room between the adjuster and the main shock tube.
EDIT: ok, so modifying an L hex did not work because of hose clearance duh. What does work is to use a hex into an adaptor and then into a flexible screw driver. That makes it pretty easy. Of course, now you need to mark the screwdriver so you know when you made one full turn. Because nothing is really easy when it comes to adjusting the 8100s, the screwdriver does not work as well on the pax side but it still works. Fit is worse but possible.
I modified the Icon 2.0 boots to fit the 8100. It is pretty easy to do with the lower end loose so crap goes out. Bilstein says there is no need for boots but I would rather be safe than sorry.
When installing the driver side, I cut some plastic off the 4R's splash guards or whatever it is called, as it seemed it might rub on the hose.
EDIT:
With 1" rear Eibach spring and a completely empty cargo area, down travel is exactly 5.5" on the pax side. The driver side rear sits 1/4" lower at rest. Looks like there is 4.5" to bump stop.
My 1/4in ratcheting stubby with the hex works well on pax side, but its head is too big for the driver side. And in both cases, a shorter tool would be better.
Bilstein say they are working on a knob. That will have to be a tiny little knob because there is very little room between the adjuster and the main shock tube.
EDIT: ok, so modifying an L hex did not work because of hose clearance duh. What does work is to use a hex into an adaptor and then into a flexible screw driver. That makes it pretty easy. Of course, now you need to mark the screwdriver so you know when you made one full turn. Because nothing is really easy when it comes to adjusting the 8100s, the screwdriver does not work as well on the pax side but it still works. Fit is worse but possible.
I modified the Icon 2.0 boots to fit the 8100. It is pretty easy to do with the lower end loose so crap goes out. Bilstein says there is no need for boots but I would rather be safe than sorry.
When installing the driver side, I cut some plastic off the 4R's splash guards or whatever it is called, as it seemed it might rub on the hose.
EDIT:
With 1" rear Eibach spring and a completely empty cargo area, down travel is exactly 5.5" on the pax side. The driver side rear sits 1/4" lower at rest. Looks like there is 4.5" to bump stop.
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MAST4R
New member
UPDATE:
The 8100 are perfect for me. I am not sure what more one can realistically want. The issue is that even at the softest compression they are more capable than the front on stiffer springs
The front can take a tiny bit of air with no issues but bottoms easily on specific types of rough spot (think narrow dip then a sharp rise).
The new 8112 with compression adjusters is delayed half a year. The 8112 without adjusters is not available at the moment.
The 8100 are perfect for me. I am not sure what more one can realistically want. The issue is that even at the softest compression they are more capable than the front on stiffer springs
The front can take a tiny bit of air with no issues but bottoms easily on specific types of rough spot (think narrow dip then a sharp rise).
The new 8112 with compression adjusters is delayed half a year. The 8112 without adjusters is not available at the moment.
UPDATE:
The 8100 are perfect for me. I am not sure what more one can realistically want. The issue is that even at the softest compression they are more capable than the front on stiffer springs
The front can take a tiny bit of air with no issues but bottoms easily on specific types of rough spot (think narrow dip then a sharp rise).
The new 8112 with compression adjusters is delayed half a year. The 8112 without adjusters is not available at the moment.
6 months?! Thats crazy. Are you able to preorder them or are we stuck waiting until they are finished being produced?
dezertbomber
New member
What springs do you have in the rear? Have any video of it in some whoops?
MAST4R
New member
Dunno. I want to see if they really do put adjusters. If I am to pay that much, I would rather have it all. I think for most people adjusters are totally unnecessary in the front, but for those of us who really use them, they sure can help.
Eibach 1" but considering the Bilstein 1.5" which is about 16lb/in softer. There is no way I bottom out the rear with the current front setup.
I don't care for higher lifts, as I want my downtravel in rocks, but I may go another 0.5" higher on the 8112 (probably 8-10 months away) just so as to increase compression travel in the front. So 1.75sh.
The only true whoops nearby are on the other side of town. I may go there soon enough. Thankfully, whoops are not part of the regular 4x4 AZ trails. Sure, you can go around Parker and other racing areas but if you don't seek them, you don't get them. For bumps of all sorts, I am mostly fine in the front as is.
What we do have is thousands of narrow, sharp transitions and that's where the current front suffers.
I cannot push the 8100s with the current front. The 6112 is a great adventure shock but even with the stiffer springs, which make it great in rocks, it cannot compete with the 8100 at speed.
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