Biker Gang Incident

bofa said:
This just keeps getting more absurd.... yeah let the $10/hour station attendants deal with the bikers to make your life easier. Not to mention, these vehicles get insanely high MPG, so unless you are going to try to implement a ban for a couple hundred miles, this will do nothing. Oh yeah, and they could always just fill gas cans instead.
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They're clearly busy doing real police-work somewhere else in the city.




Oh, and Internal Affairs was there too. WHO THE FUKK IS WATCHING THE WATCHERS? And I don't mean AS they commit crime.

Another New York City Police Department officer has reportedly come forward and admitted that he was riding with a group of bikers who allegedly assaulted the driver of an SUV in an extreme case of road rage.

This latest officer is a five-year veteran of the police force who began working in the Internal Affairs Bureau's command center about a month ago, according to DNAinfo, a New York City online news website.
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NYPD Internal Affairs Cop Reportedly Among Bikers Involved in SUV Attack - ABC News
 
How many of us non-LEO types could get away with this defense?

Braszczok's attorney said his client is accused of breaking "what was already broken." There was a "gaping softball [sized] hole" in the window that the detective is accused of breaking, Arlia said during the court appearance.
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bofa said:
He may be right though... when you have a larger pool of people, there are more people to be tempted - and while that doesn't affect the "rate" necessarily, once it starts, corruption grows like a virus, so now we're talking multiplication factors. You need strong ethical people to make the right decision and that's hard to come by, especially in a group that thinks they can skirt the law and get away with it. Again, not classifying all officers, but I could see how it would be more prevalent in a larger population.
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i don't buy it. suppose there are 35,000 cops in nyc. in my small west-central nh town, there are 3.5 cops (3 full time, 1 part time). in effect, each represents 10,000 nyc cops. if ONE of my town's cops commits an offense/crime/whatever, that's the equivalent of 10,000 nyc cops doing the same. therefore, i don't buy that the larger population inherently has a higher rate.
 
wallytoo said:
i don't buy it. suppose there are 35,000 cops in nyc. in my small west-central nh town, there are 3.5 cops (3 full time, 1 part time). in effect, each represents 10,000 nyc cops. if ONE of my town's cops commits an offense/crime/whatever, that's the equivalent of 10,000 nyc cops doing the same. therefore, i don't buy that the larger population inherently has a higher rate.
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Yeah if you want to make linear comparison... but in such a low population I'd be willing to bet the possibility of one cop being corrupt is exponentially smaller. But hey, we're just puling numbers and theories out of our asses at this point. I don't see what value this adds to the conversation.
 
It's unfortunate that this happened and it's unfortunate that two police officers were also in the middle of it. However, we don't know any details of it nor do we know any real details of what the police officers did. We only know what the media reveals and we all know that they don't always tell the whole truth.

Before we start bashing the police or thinking that the officers involved were corrupt let's think of this in a different angle. These police officers were under cover. Even though that's no excuse to participate in what happened, how many of you have had to go under cover before and be put in a situation that could potentially cost you your life? Maybe they were way too wrapped up in their role that they forgot who they were or what was really happening? I can't imagine what they had going on in their heads every day. The stress they were under was probably unimaginable and that would probably severely impact their judgement. I do agree that they were wrong in their actions and should have broken cover in order change the outcome of what happened with the people in the rover. But put yourself in their position before you become too judgmental on them. I'm not saying they're innocent but I will say that I don't believe that they are corrupt nor do I believe that they intended any harm on anyone. Hopefully things get sorted out in a fair manner and those who are guilty are punished accordingly.

As for people suggesting to not sell gas to bikers is insane. There are a lot of idiots on bikes that want to zip around town and ride like an idiot but they are hardly violent and destructive.

I think something that people need to keep in mind here is that there are a lot more good cops out there than bad ones. This one single event should hardly give the public a reason to not trust the police. I wouldn't hesitate to rely on the police if I was ever in need of help.
[MENTION=67598]RandyDaytona[/MENTION] Thank you for what you do. I still believe that most police officers out there operate under the mentality that they are here for the citizens and work to protect and serve.
 
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The first 6 minutes of video are up on this link:

Hollywood Stuntz: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | HEAVY

http://www.heavy.com/news/2013/10/alexian-lien-road-rage-viral-video/

Although pulled by Youtube they are still up in the about link via the website LiveLink.



With all respect to the officers on this forum, after watching the video I think the undercover cop should lose his entire career for this BS. He went up to the car and hit the window....

Why the F$&%# wasn't he staying back and calling the cops for help. Even if he didn't want to blow his cover fine but this goes on for like 10 minutes and miles and miles of driving. Watch the uncut video.

For the cop to have hit the car window with a helmet he would have had to literally drive to the front of the chase, out of over what looks like 50 bikes, and then go out of his way to be a part of beating this family man down. Thats just BS. He could have stayed back a bit, even a few hundred yards, he SHOULD have called the police. Holy $##&@ how many other lives were put at risk by this whole ordeal?

Sorry but IF HE REALLY DID APPROACH AND HIT THE CAR WINDOW then this cop has to get kicked off the force. I will add that I don't expect these 5 officers to have prevented the assault or interviened. The video shows that would have been impractical but hell they should have been calling their fellow NYPD brothers, I mean how hard is it in NYC to get a patrol car involved? This thing went on for 10 minutes, just watch the video.

One cop was just formally charged by the DA. A jury of his peers will decide his fate.
 
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statement by the wife


Our plan last Sunday was to celebrate our wedding anniversary by having a nice family day out with our two-year-old daughter. Unfortunately, instead, we were placed in grave danger by a mob of reckless and violent motorcyclists.

Our sympathies go out to the injured motorcyclist and his family. However, we were faced with a life-threatening situation, and my husband was forced under the circumstances to take the actions that he did in order to protect the lives of our entire family. Our fear for our lives was confirmed when the incident ended with the ruthless and brutal attack on my husband, me, and, most importantly, our two-year-old child. We know in our hearts that we could not have done anything differently, and we believe that anyone faced with this sort of grave danger would have taken the same course of action in order to protect their family.

We would like to thank the brave citizens who risked their own safety to intervene on our behalf. They truly helped save our lives and prevented my husband from suffering further injury. We also appreciate and are moved by the outpouring of love and support so many have expressed here in New York and around the country.

We would ask that the public and the media to respect our privacy at this difficult time and allow my husband to recover from his injuries. From here on forward we would ask that any further inquiries regarding this unfortunate incident be directed to our lawyers Nicholas J. Massimo and Frank C. Panetta
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BrianSD_42 said:
The first 6 minutes of video are up on this link:

Hollywood Stuntz: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | HEAVY

Alexian Lien, Road Rage Victim: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | HEAVY

Although pulled by Youtube they are still up in the about link via the website LiveLink.



With all respect to the officers on this forum, after watching the video I think the undercover cop should lose his entire career for this BS. He went up to the car and hit the window....

Why the F$&%# wasn't he staying back and calling the cops for help. Even if he didn't want to blow his cover fine but this goes on for like 10 minutes and miles and miles of driving. Watch the uncut video.

For the cop to have hit the car window with a helmet he would have had to literally drive to the front of the chase, out of over what looks like 50 bikes, and then go out of his way to be a part of beating this family man down. Thats just BS. He could have stayed back a bit, even a few hundred yards, he SHOULD have called the police. Holy $##&@ how many other lives were put at risk by this whole ordeal?

Sorry but IF HE REALLY DID APPROACH AND HIT THE CAR WINDOW then this cop has to get kicked off the force. I will add that I don't expect these 5 officers to have prevented the assault or interviened. The video shows that would have been impractical but hell they should have been calling their fellow NYPD brothers, I mean how hard is it in NYC to get a patrol car involved? This thing went on for 10 minutes, just watch the video.

One cop was just formally charged by the DA. A jury of his peers will decide his fate.
Click to expand...

Very well said, Brian.



I know it looks like I hate cops from my posts in this thread and it's true - I hate bad cops. Certain professions require, no dictate, a higher level of scrutiny simply because of the responsibility carried and the impact on humanity they bring as examples. Police officers are one line on a much longer list - I'm not singling you out Randy or anyone else on here. Think about the impact the irs can now have on you - financial, legal, and now healthcare related issues can arise if you are a political opponent to those in charge. Not recognizing this and discussing it is a very dangerous, naive thing to do, especially considering the militarization of the police and other domestic LEO entities.
 
SV_Dude said:
It's unfortunate that this happened and it's unfortunate that two police officers were also in the middle of it. However, we don't know any details of it nor do we know any real details of what the police officers did. We only know what the media reveals and we all know that they don't always tell the whole truth.

Before we start bashing the police or thinking that the officers involved were corrupt let's think of this in a different angle. These police officers were under cover. Even though that's no excuse to participate in what happened, how many of you have had to go under cover before and be put in a situation that could potentially cost you your life? Maybe they were way too wrapped up in their role that they forgot who they were or what was really happening? I can't imagine what they had going on in their heads every day. The stress they were under was probably unimaginable and that would probably severely impact their judgement. I do agree that they were wrong in their actions and should have broken cover in order change the outcome of what happened with the people in the rover. But put yourself in their position before you become too judgmental on them. I'm not saying they're innocent but I will say that I don't believe that they are corrupt nor do I believe that they intended any harm on anyone. Hopefully things get sorted out in a fair manner and those who are guilty are punished accordingly.

As for people suggesting to not sell gas to bikers is insane. There are a lot of idiots on bikes that want to zip around town and ride like an idiot but they are hardly violent and destructive.

I think something that people need to keep in mind here is that there are a lot more good cops out there than bad ones. This one single event should hardly give the public a reason to not trust the police. I wouldn't hesitate to rely on the police if I was ever in need of help.
[MENTION=67598]RandyDaytona[/MENTION] Thank you for what you do. I still believe that most police officers out there operate under the mentality that they are here for the citizens and work to protect and serve.
Click to expand...

This is the thing that has had me confused...they keep mentioning that they are "undercover" cops, yet off duty during the incident. Now is the media purposely spinning this to lead us to believe they are "undercover" in the sense that they are on a mission while riding with this bike group; or merely that their official job title just so happens to be an "undercover cop", in the sense that they are plain clothes detectives?

To me it sounds like they are just plain clothes detectives which were off duty at the time and hanging out with the bikers, and not that they were working on a mission to befriend these bikers and uncover more dirt on them or whatever. If they were actually on assignment to catch these bikers doing something, they wouldn't considered off duty would they?

In which case, does it really matter if they "blew their cover" to a bunch of friends/acquaintances since they are not really acting out a role of anything? Granted yes, maybe some of those thugs might beat the turd out of them if they knew they were a cop, but that's not my point, lol.

My point is, I feel like they keep throwing the term "undercover" around a lot to sugar coat the situation. Would be interesting to know exactly what their roles where and what not, but too anything accurate will never be told by the media.
 
Understand that these bad pork sandwiches didn't report their presence out of good conscience or doing the right thing - they did so because they were afraid of getting caught NOT reporting their presence there and in the case of the window smasher, he saw that more videos and cameras were going to ID his dumbasss eventually.

Its incredible to me that some of you guys are actually acting as apologists here and coming to the defense of these sh1tbirds. None of the cops I know want any association with these @sshats, and none of them are felating each other over their defense.
 
Honestly it's probably that guilt that led the driver of the RR that got him pulled out of the vehicle and beat up. People are trained not to respond....e.g "try to get along..." "try to work it out"..."if you are involved it must be partially your fault". This the way we are socialized and men (and women) typically don't have the instinct or impulse to bring the hammer down. Fear led this man to drive over the bikes. When they surrounded him again and they started beating up his car he had a few options. We could talk all day long about "IF" he had a weapon in the vehicle should he have produced it. I'm not sure....and the incident begs the question where WERE THE COPS? Jesus, wasn't there enough time to find this guy and restore order? I know here in San Diego it's more a swarm for a speeding ticket....

Anyway, the men on bikes were trouble and should be held accountable. Me? I would have used the bull bar all day long.:boxer:
 
Jesus, wasn't there enough time to find this guy and restore order? I
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There would have been if they had called it in.

10 minutes went by, miles and miles of road and not a single patrol car. They obvious answer is that these 5 did not call it in, they left the man and his family to their fate.

Of course we don't really know. BUT in a city with 35,000 cops and not a single patrol call seen on the long long video, yeah it looks like they did not call it in and left the family to their fate.
 
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BrianSD_42 said:
There would have been if they had called it in.
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Would there really have been? From what I understand wasn't the wife on the phone with 911 throughout most of the chase so the authorities should've been aware of the situation already...or do you mean that they might respond faster if the cops themselves called it in? I think they're just slow as turd to respond in general, lol.
 
Which begs the question how do we protect our families on the road? Here is California I think a good bear spray would deter most people. Open the window a bit and fog the permitter. Sun roof would work also. But here is the thing. As long as he was thinking clearly he could have potentially driven to a police station or fire station. But with a screaming kid a terrified wife who can say...?

That would have been my play. Your advantages in a vehicle over a motorcycle are many. And as Ray Kelly said, when you feel your life is in danger you get a lot of latitude. Fun to contemplate no fun to actually do it I imagine. UNLESS you really like getting hostile....:gun6::gun6:
 
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