If gas gets to $5.00 a gallon

[Buckfever]

Maybe I don't know how to do the math. But on 18000 miles per year @ 18 MPG that's about 1000 gallons, so from $3 to $5 that's another $2000 a year.

However, if I go to a vehicle that gives me 27 MPG , that would be 667 gallons for 18000 miles and at $5 per gallon saves me $1666.67 over the 4Runner.

But what vehicle is going to give me the performance and safety of the 4Runner and gets 27MPG?

Moreover when considering the reliability of the 4Runner, the difference is very probably not nearly that much.

Getting a second car, to save miles, heck the additional insurance will eat into the difference in fuel costs plenty.

I'd probably just slow it down a bit and do a little more of my own maintenance and keep my 4Runner even longer to avoid the depreciation costs of another purchase. Which brings up the excellent resale of the 4Runner. Damned near any other vehicle and you'll lose more on depreciation by comparison.

I don't know but as I see it, the 4Runner even at $5/Gallon gas is still a great value.

 

[hulk311]

I drive 16 - 20k a year, so I have considered replacing my 4Runner even at the current price of gas. However, when I look at the total cost of owning a vehicle, keeping the 4Runner still costs me less than it would to downgrade to a new more fuel efficient car. Except for gas, my 4runner has been a cheap vehicle to own. It is one of the most reliable vehicles around and I have spent ZERO dollars on repairs to my 2003. Insurance rates are good (it would cost me more to insure a new Corolla or Civic) and the depreciation rate is excellent.

In the end, I'll sell my 4runner when I find a vehicle I like better... which is a tall order, because the 4Runner is just sooo good!

according to my calculations, which may be ~10% off, you spend $3,333 on gas a year! That's like a friggin brand new 65" 1080 tv you could be buying each year. :beer:

 

[hulk311]

Except for gas, my 4runner has been a cheap vehicle to own. It is one of the most reliable vehicles around and I have spent ZERO dollars on repairs to my 2003.

which just makes you wonder why all of these people on here are taking the "plunge" and "pulling the trigger" on BRAND new 4runners when they could be buying one that is 2,3 hell even 5 or 7 years old and still runs well and saving thousands of $$$ that could be used on bigger tires, lifts, etc. :beer: :bigok:

 

[My1stT4R]

which just makes you wonder why all of these people on here are taking the "plunge" and "pulling the trigger" on BRAND new 4runners when they could be buying one that is 2,3 hell even 5 or 7 years old and still runs well and saving thousands of $$$...

For me, the difference between a 3 to 5 year old T4R and the price of a new one was $4K-$6K (Low Depreciation). Interest rates are higher for used vehicles. The price difference between used and new was insignificant enough that I purchased a new one at 1.9% for 60 months.

Since this was my first Toyota purchase, I wanted a new one. I have driven trucks since '88 and won't drive anything else. If you buy a truck, you can't concern yourself with gas prices. We have no control over it.

If you are paying for it, you might as well get what you want, and enjoy the fruits of your labor. I hate driving, but I enjoy my time in my 4runner. If gas hits $5 a gallon, I would still keep it. As always, YMMV.

 

[Falls]

If I calculate my fuel costs driving 20,000 ( very low average for me ) miles per year @ 5.00 per gallon and getting 16 miles per gallon>>>>>>> HOLY SHITZ ...... lol. Its like over 6k per year

Ahhhhhh.....life is good anyway. It is what it is. Think of the values of full size trucks and SUV's .....they will drop even lower than the last gas spike.

 

[peter78]

I don't know but as I see it, the 4Runner even at $5/Gallon gas is still a great value.

I did a little math and I figured if I fill up my 4Runner with $5.00 gas, um, lets see, I drive a older 4Runner with a smaller tank, so I usually get 17.0 gallons when it is low, so that would be $85.

I guess I will have to carry $100 bills in my wallet just to get gas. That would have to affect the market and how we drive.

I also hear on TV that gas will go up to $4 a gallon this Summer. Lets see that would be $4 times 17 gallons, sooo.....:bash: :wtf:

 

[leftyrb]

On the news this morning, they announced that gas was now being sold for $1.27 per litre Cdn in Vancouver, which is about $5.77 Cdn for an imperial gallon (160 oz.) - this means that gas here in BC has already reached $5/gallon and it is not summer yet!

 

[DJ's Toy]

Funny, I put my 4runner up for sale two weeks ago due to this very fact. I am sick of being gouged at the pump! Currently driving a Ford Focus that gets 30 about mpg.

As far as the selling goes I have had no offers and it is below KBB. Go figure.

03 4runner SR5 V-8
59,000 miles
New Dunlop Dueller A/T revo
New Brakes
$18000
Any takers?

Oh well, guess I will keep it.

DJ

 

[lawwailok]

no matter what, if we can afford a 4runner, i guess we don't really care about the gas price. if really care on gas price, then don't get the 4runner at the first place. just like the H2 folks, they still have their H2 drive around on the street.

 

[JP4RNR]

no matter what, if we can afford a 4runner, i guess we don't really care about the gas price. if really care on gas price, then don't get the 4runner at the first place. just like the H2 folks, they still have their H2 drive around on the street.

But if you bought your 4Runner when gas was $2.00 a gallon just 2-3 years ago it would not be reasonable to anticipate that gas would increase 2 and a half times. The whole point of this poll was really to find out how much is too much just because we can afford to pay 5$ at the pump does not mean we should. Oil companies are and have been making record profits. At these prices it does not matter what you drive you are going to feel it in your bottom line. Higher gas prices mean higher groceries,clothing,electronics etc. as shipping and trucking companies are going to pass the additional costs related to transit on to the consumer. Higher gas prices will increase cost of living across the board not just at the pump

 

[lawwailok]

But if you bought your 4Runner when gas was $2.00 a gallon just 2-3 years ago it would not be reasonable to anticipate that gas would increase 2 and a half times. The whole point of this poll was really to find out how much is too much just because we can afford to pay 5$ at the pump does not mean we should. Oil companies are and have been making record profits. At these prices it does not matter what you drive you are going to feel it in your bottom line. Higher gas prices mean higher groceries,clothing,electronics etc. as shipping and trucking companies are going to pass the additional costs related to transit on to the consumer. Higher gas prices will increase cost of living across the board not just at the pump

true, it really depends on how the usage of the 4runner. if daily driven for long distance, it is a big issue to consider about an alternative. hope gas price won't go any high i don't know if that's true or not, there's rumor said toyota were thinking to put hybrid in the new tundra and the next generation 4Runner, that'll be great it is true.

 

[Jeff Kleb]

What about a diesel option for the next generation 4Runner? I know that Toyota offers oil-burners for certain foreign markets (Europe, Caribbean, South America, etc.), so I suspect it would not be unreasonable for them to make a light-duty (US-spec) engine that could work in the 4Runner, Tundra or Tacoma.

Volkswagen has found a way to use one diesel engine block in various models (ex: the TDI in the Beetle, Jetta, Passat, etc.) and it has a rather decent reputation for reliability, economy and performance. Mercedes has also resumed offering diesels in the US market, after a hiatus lasting several years. (They never stopped selling them abroad, though.)

As the price of fuel escalates, the advantage of getting 20 to 30 percent more miles from a gallon of fuel grows exponentially. Imagine a 4-Runner equipped with a diesel engine that would get 20 miles per gallon in city driving and could possibly hit 30 mpg on the open highway, while providing enough torque for towing and off-road use.

A straight (inline) six or even a V6 might work, probably displacing about 4.0 to 4.5 liters (just a guess). Turbocharging, electronic engine management and good old Toyota ingenuity could probably come up with a powerplant that at least 1/3 to 1/2 of 4Runner owners would be willing to select. If they could squeeze at least 200 bhp out of it - with abundant torque (300+ lbs/ft) at low RPMS, it just might work. Oh, and offer a manual transmission as an option!
:biggrin2:

Any of you ever drove a diesel-powered Toyota truck? How did you like it?


P.S. My company owns some Hino (Toyota's heavy truck division) box trucks, and they are very, very quiet diesel engines - well, when compared to an International or Freightliner anyway.

 

[biglatka]

What about a diesel option for the next generation 4Runner? I know that Toyota offers oil-burners for certain foreign markets (Europe, Caribbean, South America, etc.), so I suspect it would not be unreasonable for them to make a light-duty (US-spec) engine that could work in the 4Runner, Tundra or Tacoma.

Volkswagen has found a way to use one diesel engine block in various models (ex: the TDI in the Beetle, Jetta, Passat, etc.) and it has a rather decent reputation for reliability, economy and performance. Mercedes has also resumed offering diesels in the US market, after a hiatus lasting several years. (They never stopped selling them abroad, though.)

As the price of fuel escalates, the advantage of getting 20 to 30 percent more miles from a gallon of fuel grows exponentially. Imagine a 4-Runner equipped with a diesel engine that would get 20 miles per gallon in city driving and could possibly hit 30 mpg on the open highway, while providing enough torque for towing and off-road use.

A straight (inline) six or even a V6 might work, probably displacing about 4.0 to 4.5 liters (just a guess). Turbocharging, electronic engine management and good old Toyota ingenuity could probably come up with a powerplant that at least 1/3 to 1/2 of 4Runner owners would be willing to select. If they could squeeze at least 200 bhp out of it - with abundant torque (300+ lbs/ft) at low RPMS, it just might work. Oh, and offer a manual transmission as an option!
:biggrin2:

Any of you ever drove a diesel-powered Toyota truck? How did you like it?


P.S. My company owns some Hino (Toyota's heavy truck division) box trucks, and they are very, very quiet diesel engines - well, when compared to an International or Freightliner anyway.

P.P.S. Diesel, gasoline

 

[Jeff Kleb]

Perhaps a diesel would be a good option for the 4Runner.....perhaps not. I was merely speculating on whether or not it might be good - based on today's fuel prices. It is true, though, that oil-burners get far more BTUs from a gallon because of the higher compression ratio.

Ironically, diesel fuel is actually cheaper (today, anyway) here in VA. On-road diesel fuel was $2.49 and unleaded regular was $2.71 at the same truck stop. Now that's a big difference!

Even if diesel fuel were $3.00 a gallon and unleaded was "only" $2.50, the increased miles per gallon of diesel fuel would probably cover the difference.

Now, as for BTU taxes and all that other stuff; well....that is another issue for another day.

My company's work truck - a large International 4900 with a DT466 diesel engine, gets about 7.5 to 8.0 miles per gallon. That is not much, but I bet I would be lucky to get 4 miles per gallon out of a comparable gasoline engine (if there were one available). The diesel lasts longer, requires less maintenance and will put up with a lot more abuse - heavy loads, lots of idling, etc., etc.

I am glad that it holds 100 gallons of fuel, though. It has a 50-gallon tank on each side, so I have to fill up at places with dual hoses on the pumps.
:bash:

 

[Even Steven]

I like how people chose the last option about keeping their 4r if gas gets to $5. Have fun paying $20,000 for gas a year lol.

$20,000/year? How many miles are you driving?

In my case, I average about 7,000 miles per year on my 4Runner (I live only a few miles from work), which works out to about $2500/year for gas. Thats based on 7,000 miles @ 14 mpg. 500 gallons of gas purchased in a year @ $5/gallon.

But even if I drove twice as much (which is more than the national average), I would still only pay $5000/year for gas. I would have to drive about 28,000 miles per year before I would be paying $20,000 for gas at $5/gallon!

The reality of it all is that I\'m already paying around $3/gallon for gas, so even if it goes up to $5/gallon, it\'s only an extra $1,000 per year out of my pocket, which is not nearly enough to make me even consider getting rid of my 4Runner

 

[biglatka]

Jeff,
All I was implying was that switching the 4Runner to an engine that uses Diesel fuel would be a stopgap measure and temporary at best. It would do nothing to alleviate the problems we have before us as I mentioned in my previous post.

As far as the diesel engine is concerned it is more efficient because it operates with a higher compression ratio than a gasoline engine thus squeezing more energy out of the fuel but the BTU content is due to the fuel itself. The engine has to be made more durable because of the higher pressures and temperatures it operates at and thus too lasts longer.

Off the top of my head I believe diesel fuel contains 130,000 BTUs/gal with gasoline coming in at about 115.000/gal. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, I'm too lazy to look it up in my chemical handbook. So this higher BTU content of the fuel itself plus the higher efficiency of the diesel engine gives it the advantage over gasoline engines. But what if the oil companies impose a price based on BTU content rather than fuel type? Then the economic advantages will be largely wiped out except for better engine durability. I think this idea is coming down the line. I hope if this happens they give a tax credit for truckers and anyone else with similar occupations that have to make a living by driving.

At the risk of someone getting mad at me I would venture to say that there is a silver lining (for many reasons I could go into later) in this price increase especially if it sticks and even goes higher to $5.00/gal, but the payoff would not be near term. There would be a lot of pain for many in the present and near term.

Anyway, for most of us who drive 15,000 miles or less per year it does not pay to buy another car and give up the 4Runner even if gas went to $5.00/gal. The compromise would be if you already owned an economy car and drove that car a little bit more to offset the increased cost of driving the 4Runner. Just imagine, last year we had a similar question about what you would do if gas went to $3.00/gal? Now that price seems ok and we

 

[rando]

I'll worry about it when it happens. At that point I'll have the advantage of knowing the market for the altnernatives. Anything else is just wild speculation.

As for the political injections into this conversation -- my take is to kick the government out of the commercial oil market. Stop taxing oil and stop providing government services to protect the industry. Let market forces redirect available resources toward new energy innovation or not at all. The macroeconomic system that is the global oil industry is far to complex to be understood or controlled with the granularity to avoid local microeconomic disasters (such as $5/gal gas, inefficient cars, and no cost effective alternatives).

 

[Jeff Kleb]

I'll worry about it when it happens. At that point I'll have the advantage of knowing the market for the altnernatives. Anything else is just wild speculation.


That's the truth! As the old saying goes, "If ifs and buts were fruit and nuts, we would all have a great party!"
:awais:


As for the political injections into this conversation -- my take is to kick the government out of the commercial oil market. Stop taxing oil and stop providing government services to protect the industry.


As Ronald Reagan once said (about government interfering with private business), "If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. Once it stops moving, subsidize it."
:bash:


Let market forces redirect available resources toward new energy innovation or not at all. The macroeconomic system that is the global oil industry is far too complex to be understood or controlled with the granularity to avoid local microeconomic disasters (such as $5/gal gas, inefficient cars, and no cost effective alternatives).


Well, that pretty much sums it up. You just went over the heads of more than 90% of the population.

The last time our government decided to "help" us out of an energy crunch, we had to wait in line to buy expensive gas, could only buy it on certain days {odd/even rationing, etc.} and there were some states where you could only get five gallons at a time. Heaven knows we don't want to return to those dreaded days.

I would rather pay almost $3 per gallon for unleaded than to have it priced at $2.50 and be unable to find it. The free market ain't always pretty, but it is almost always the best way to provide the customer with the best product at a "fair" price.

Rock on, sir!!


Check out some of these links:

http://www.self-gov.org

http://www.lp.org

http://www.cato.org

http://www.lpva.org

 

[rando]

As Ronald Reagan once said (about government interfering with private business), "If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. Once it stops moving, subsidize it."
:bash:

OMG, I induced you to quote Reagan! :bigok: I'm feeling truly inspirational now!

 

[Jeff Kleb]

OMG, I induced you to quote Reagan! :bigok: I'm feeling truly inspirational now!

"Government is not the solution to the problem. Government is the problem." -- Ronald W. Reagan


"The tree of liberty must, from time to time, be watered with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


"They who sacrifice essential liberty to obtain temporary security deserve neither liberty nor security." -- Benjamin Franklin


Okay......that's my two cents for the day. I owe; I owe. Off to work I go.
:awais: