6th gen 2017 4R, will it exist?
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FordyceCreek
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Toyota definitely needs to catch up. I am buying a Raptor and next year, and the 4 Runner makes the F150 look like a deep space exploration craft. But I hope catching up does not mean Hatch Back car with AWD and IRS for the next 4 runner 
pauldavis
New member
Ford's interiors have gotten a lot nicer. The Edge and Explorer look really nice inside. Although I am perfectly happy with my 15 4runner interior. Seems nice. My only gripe would be not having the ability to turn on all the interior lights with a switch. Seems strange not to have that...
EEEliminator
Member
My Sienna can turn all the lights on or off, even overriding the rear map lights from a single switch, so I don't see why 4Runner shouldn't have it. Its nice for the van but don't miss it on the 4Runner.
All of the new Fords I've seen are much improved, I'll have to a say after driving my father in laws Explorer I don't like it as much as I thought I would have even though it looks pretty good. The dash is way too low for my liking, I feel really exposed and my right knee hits the steering column when trying to get out. The dash is a soft touch material meaning its got some give to it but it looks like miles of hard plastic they could've broken up the texture a little. I liked the look of the exterior when they first came out, but now they look a lot like minivans with swinging rear doors to me. I also don't like the trend of digital instruments, I prefer the analog gauges for tach and speedo. I hope Toyota doesn't go the route of a full screen dash.
I drove an Edge daily for awhile and liked that better, no real complaints there except I've never driven a car where I can't get the AC vents to blow directly on me. Sucks when its 100 out and you have to drive 5-10 min before the cabin cools down, especially if you're wearing nice clothes for work.
I wish the 4Runner had 3rd row or even 2nd row vents like the Explorer for my kids, but then again another AC evaporator and heater coil is just another thing to break.
The drop down tail-gait is pretty awesome on the 2nd gens as well, be nice if they could reintegrate that. I wouldn't mind a v8 either :biggrin1: , but who wouldn't.
1engineer
Moderator
This thread is so funny. Half of you want the new 4runner to be more primitive. Manual, rubber floors, etc. The other half wants it to be more tech and modern lol. Comparing it to a Ford? Really? How about comparing the residual value to Ford. The 4Runner is a unique vehicle and hopefully the next generation will be unique as well.
New to the forum, waiting on my quicksand trd pro to arrive! Saw this post and thought I'd let you know some info I received. I realize 99% of you will discredit what I say but I am an automotive engineer and have some friends that work at Toyota in Torrance. I spoke with one at length when I was thinking about purchasing my new 4runner, including whether the 2017 would be a redesign or not. He said the 2017 is not a redesign and it will be the last carry over year of the 5th gen. He said their new product launches are considered major or minor updates, major being a new gen, minor being small updates like colors, interior, a little sheet metal etc, he said like the tacoma did in 2011 to 2012. He said the 2017 4runner won't be a major or minor update.
Take it for what it's worth, but I wanted to let you guys know what I heard from the horses mouth.
Take it for what it's worth, but I wanted to let you guys know what I heard from the horses mouth.
wfo9
New member
Seems legit. They are very slow to make change... The 5th gen is really just minor changes from the 4th anyway... The 6th will be more of the same.
mnofpeace
Member
Mr fur_pig
with that logic and information...what do they consider the new taco? they stopped using the 4.0 engine for their ubiquitous 3.5 V6 (see the Highlander, Lexus cars, ect), they changed the frame some, gave it all new interior, gave it drastically new exterior...is that considered major or minor in toyo-speak? and with that, should we expect similar treatment for the 2017 Rnnr?
with that logic and information...what do they consider the new taco? they stopped using the 4.0 engine for their ubiquitous 3.5 V6 (see the Highlander, Lexus cars, ect), they changed the frame some, gave it all new interior, gave it drastically new exterior...is that considered major or minor in toyo-speak? and with that, should we expect similar treatment for the 2017 Rnnr?
wfo9
New member
He is saying no changes for 2017 for the 4runn.. Still a 5th gen.
The 2016 Taco is a new gen...
Seems like Toyota would have to have a 6th gen by 2018. Unless it is following in the FJs footsteps.
Magnetic4R
New member
I would think 2018 would be the earliest, they still got to get another year out of the Pro before a redesign.
BlackWorksInc
New member
That's entirely possible, it'll either be a 2017 or 2018 model year vehicle based on past practices with Toyota. I could be see them holding off one more year to fine tune it, been hearing some whispers of issues with the new Tacoma already. It's pretty much set in stone that the 6th gen will borrow much of the drivetrain and other components from the 3rd Gen Tacoma. As far as I can tell the 3rd Gen Tacoma is still underpinned by the J150 frame the previous generation had (despite Toyota saying that it is very much different, so far it looks like all they did in terms of physical changes is increased the size of the second body mount for overlap crashes; everything else seems to be identical to the 2nd Gen Tacoma's frame), so I expect the 6th gen to get the same second body mount reinforcement and that'll probably the only major change to the frame itself. The 6th gen will essentially be the same J150 platform underpinning the current gen, which itself is dimensionally identical to the J120 that underpinned the 4th gen; the body will be much different in construction for crash safety and weight savings I imagine. That's not a bad thing for us though, the J120/J150 platform has been a good frame and honestly it just means that parts commonality from an aftermarket standpoint for the 4~6th gens will be somewhat easier.
Technically the 2GR-FKS is actually derived from the Lexus side of the family, particularly the 2GR-FSE used in the Lexus IS & GS (also the RS now). The difference being that the FSE is designed with Toyota's D4-S gasoline direct injection system and it's built as a "performance" rear-wheel drive engine. The 2GR-FE is a rather simple dual VVTi, transversely mounted engine designed with vehicles like the Sienna, Highlander, Camry, and Avalon in mind.
Also I hadn't noticed that Lexus has replaced the 2GR-FSE with the 2GR-FKS in it's new 2015 models, interesting, but not entirely surprising I suppose. Though honestly I'm not entirely impressed with the numbers of the 2GR-FKS on paper:
1GR-FE w/ Dual VVTi [4.0L V6] 278 ft·lbf@4400 rpm
2GR-FKS [3.5L V6] 265 lb·ft at 4600 rpm
2UZ-FE Non-VVTi [4.7L V8] 320 ft·lbf @ 3400 rpm (Just to provide a reference for a nice low end torque value)
It does feel peppier than the 1GR-FE, but the numbers are showing that the torque band widened up a bit (I'd be curious to see graphs of the torque bands of both engines, I feel like while the 2GR-FKS puts out less torque at a higher peak RPM, it has a bit more usable torque lower; but that could just be my imagination). So it looks more like it's a nice rear wheel drive V6 for a sedan or CUV that happens to work decently for a mid-sized pick-up; vs. it being designed for a pick-up/SUV from the get go and seeking a bit better low end.
Honestly I would like a nice V8, true rubberized floor (i.e. the harness connectors are either located higher up and/or protected and I can fill the floor with water and let it drain out the drain plugs without worrying about it being trapped in the insulation mats or harness like the FJ Cruiser's set-up), a manual full-time 4WD set-up wouldn't be a bad thing (with a Torsen T3 center differential), I could go with either an automatic or manual (I honestly have enjoyed not needing to dick around with a clutch on the trails and the transmissions in the 4th & 5th gens have been pretty stout off-road so far, so can't complain there), bigger wheel wells (both the 4th & 5th gens tend to get to a point where you need to start cutting up the fenders to fit nice 35" tires and still get good compression, where as FJ's are given more leniency there...), No annoying parking assist sonar crap, No distractedly useless BSM, No Automatic Rear hatch, No Smart/Laser Cruise, No pre-collision BS, No brake/accelerator cut-off programming BS, Switchable VSC/TRAC for modes other than 4LO/CDL engaged, a bit better massaged Entune system or even an Android head unit, optional Smart Key (it's admittedly grown on me playing with customer's vehicles I kind of wish my 4th gen had one sometimes, a rear window that rolls UP when commanded via key fob, a nice modern combination meter (oooh, maybe one of those fancy all LCD screen ones?).
There's a list of other stuff that obviously would never make it on a production vehicle such as expandable communications packages (i.e. having a section in the rear or in the vehicle where a UHF/HAM unit can be "plug & play" and utilize the headunit & hands free system as interfaces), Front & Rear lockers ontop of standard CDL, heavy duty on-board air that can put out at least 100 psi @ 4CFM on 100% Duty Cycle with small reserve tank, high out-put alternator, optional dual battery set-up with isolated fuse/relay block for "plug & play" accessory addition and control, IR camera with IR LED running lights, ect.
But I figure if they can at least offer a fairly decent starting point that doesn't require me to rip out $30k worth of "Luxury" BS that I don't need and had to pay for anyways (not all of us are [MENTION=65614]Antman[/MENTION] who can I guess buy a brand new 5th gen and then buy half the value of the vehicle in mods to install next week
); I can live with it being close to what I want. After all, half the fun is just tearing the truck apart and making it your own right?
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NoDak
Senior Member
on the new Tacoma, a lot of the frame is just the same, they just used different materials and/or strengthened the frame.
the bed shape is different and a pita really. they tapered the last 1/4 of the bed so it completely screws up adding a cover of any type.
back to the frame, from what I have been told, a lot of the mount points for aftermarket stuff is exactly the same.
the only issues I have run into on the warden's new Tacoma is :
1. the wind deflector rattles when the moonroof is closed
2. the front right passenger speaker area rattles
3. the shift points and the intelligence on the transmission is crap from my perspective (the warden could care less)
it tries to get into 4-6 gear way to aggressively even at low speeds to the point it bogs down.
ECT turned on helps but the button no longer is a static on/off. it turns off after each ignition off cycle.
even on cruise control the engine is always kicking down to 4-5 even on a slight incline or head/crosswind. sport shifting helps a lot.
using sport shift to downshift, I have notice the gearing is spaced a lot. what use to slow the truck down in 2-3 gear now hardly slows it down even in 2 it seems.
also there seems to be a surge at around 3-4k rpms, where the engine just completely goes beast mode. ("yo vtec just kicked in") haha
imo the everyone b.itching about wanting 6-8 gears in a truck/suv in a Toyota will be disappointed compared to the old 5 speeds.
either that or they need to change the shift points and whatnot before it gets to the 4runner.
oh and btw it will get up and haul a$$ if you get past 50-75% throttle. I haven't done WOT yet on the truck but the engine completely wakes up if you dip into the throttle correctly.
the bed shape is different and a pita really. they tapered the last 1/4 of the bed so it completely screws up adding a cover of any type.
back to the frame, from what I have been told, a lot of the mount points for aftermarket stuff is exactly the same.
the only issues I have run into on the warden's new Tacoma is :
1. the wind deflector rattles when the moonroof is closed
2. the front right passenger speaker area rattles
3. the shift points and the intelligence on the transmission is crap from my perspective (the warden could care less)
it tries to get into 4-6 gear way to aggressively even at low speeds to the point it bogs down.
ECT turned on helps but the button no longer is a static on/off. it turns off after each ignition off cycle.
even on cruise control the engine is always kicking down to 4-5 even on a slight incline or head/crosswind. sport shifting helps a lot.
using sport shift to downshift, I have notice the gearing is spaced a lot. what use to slow the truck down in 2-3 gear now hardly slows it down even in 2 it seems.
also there seems to be a surge at around 3-4k rpms, where the engine just completely goes beast mode. ("yo vtec just kicked in") haha
imo the everyone b.itching about wanting 6-8 gears in a truck/suv in a Toyota will be disappointed compared to the old 5 speeds.
either that or they need to change the shift points and whatnot before it gets to the 4runner.
oh and btw it will get up and haul a$$ if you get past 50-75% throttle. I haven't done WOT yet on the truck but the engine completely wakes up if you dip into the throttle correctly.
bigbwb
Member
Seems logical being the current 4R is selling very well even though its towards the end of its life cycle. Odds are they wanted to milk its good sales one more year before introducing the 6th generation model. Toyotas a business afterall
Taco Pro only lasted one year on the gen 2. You could argue that the Taco Pro is just a T|X Baja, though and you'd be 95% right.
New Taco is a major model change. It is considered a new generation internally.
jwkilgore
New member
For what it's worth, I don't think they want it to be only more primitive, just make the option available. If the goal is an off-road work vehicle, they are requesting the ability to buy a base-level factory equipped off-road capable vehicle. As opposed to paying for several thousand dollars worth of carpeting, trim, and highway tires that get immediately ripped out and sold on Craigslist just to get replaced with several thousand dollars worth of other stuff. Options like like all-weather flooring, factory crash-test bull-bars, and AT tires that are available for all-but-identical vehicles overseas, and they don't significantly affect things like EPA mileage and crash worthiness.
Personally, with my SR5 I believe I got exactly what I wanted and needed, so I'm happy. It's a daily driver that I am slowly modifying over time. But different people want different things.
Except a manual transmission... with the strength, mileage improvements, and ease of use with a modern automatic transmission, I cannot for the life of me figure out why someone would want to go back to the days of worrying with a clutch in traffic or on rocks. :der:
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jwkilgore
New member
No, not a replacement, a close cousin (or sister like Quentin said). It's more like the Lexus GX than the 4Runner, although all three share the exact same frame and suspension along with the discontinued FJ Cruiser.
In many countries the Toyota Fortuner with its newer frame style is considered to be the 4Runner's "replacement", but I'm not aware of any plans to bring the Fortuner to North America.
This sounds like 09 again on this forum.
Sadly not sure toyota has the stones to make the v8 stick shift rubber floored off road vehicle we may want. They have to dump that v6. I am all for 4runners that come with off road tires. V8. Etc. love reading reviews of 4runners and wranglers and listening to people whine that it doesnt drive or handle like a yuppie wagon.
We can dream. Toyota makes kick ass vehicles in other markets. Just got back from AUS. They have them.
Sadly not sure toyota has the stones to make the v8 stick shift rubber floored off road vehicle we may want. They have to dump that v6. I am all for 4runners that come with off road tires. V8. Etc. love reading reviews of 4runners and wranglers and listening to people whine that it doesnt drive or handle like a yuppie wagon.
We can dream. Toyota makes kick ass vehicles in other markets. Just got back from AUS. They have them.
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