Dirtco's 1999 4Runner Build

[Dirtco]

On the topic of steering racks, have you heard of a site called RackDoctor? Supposedly they rebuild OEM racks. I'm not 100% certain but it's maybe worth a phone call at least? If you had a spare oem rack you could probably have it sent to them to be rebuilt. Probably a sure way of knowing you're getting an OEM rack back unless they guarantee they only work on OEM racks.

Toyota 4 Runner Rack And Pinion

Thanks for the link! That's a pretty good price, and it has a "lifetime" warranty. Like you said, it's worth a call at least to see if they only use OEM stuff and what the warranty covers.

I still have my OEM rack that you could have if you wanted to try the above.

I'm very happy with the Safari LTD rack at the moment. Once I get my bigger tires and go wheeling I'll have a better feel for how it might hold up.

Thanks for the offer! I'll let you know, but don't keep it around just for me. I ordered the upgraded steering rack guide parts, so I hope that fixes the problem. Even if it does fix the slop, it's just a matter of time before the whole thing is going to need replacement. I'm leaning towards the Safari LTD rack, but I would like to know why it's better. Maybe a phone call is in order for them too. Good to hear that it's working out for you though.

Glad to hear your staying IFS at least for the time being. Just throwing this out there you may have already checked/fixed it or it may be unrelated, but I just read a few things about one of the steering shaft slip joints getting slack in them and needing to be roll pined or tack welded. I know mine is still making a little noise in the front after I replaced everything including the guide bushings, so I think this might be the problem on mine.

Good thinking, and thanks for the heads up on that. It's a very common issue that not many people address, or even think about. That's been on my list for a long time, I just haven't gotten around to fixing it yet. I do have a little play in the steering shaft like you, but the main issue I'm having is in the rack itself. I can take the D/S tire, move it back and forth (9 and 3 o'clock) and I have .25"-.50" of vertical movement on the inner rack, inboard of the inner tie rod end. It clunks around like crazy when I'm driving around.

 

[BigFishAllDay]

Dang, Jeremiah. Sorry to hear about your front end woes. Maybe this cheesy cat picture will cheer you up.



In all seriousness though, I'm glad you're sticking with it. I think rickashay said it best in his post yesterday, about the slippery slope. Personally, I'm just sitting back and watching all this stuff happen with you and Jim, and it's really given me some food for thought regarding how I'll deal with similar challenges down the road, should they arise.

 

[rickashay]

I'm not too worried about the tire, these KM2's are wearing really fast and all the lugs are getting rounded off. They are good tires, work great in the rocks and on the trail, but I don't see myself getting through next winter driving these on the street without some extra siping or creative grooving. Are you still sold on the MTZ's?

Honestly, the MTZ's have been phenomenal. Especially for an M/T that needs to perform in deep snow and the occasional hard-pack and ice. I honestly found it to be worlds above the KM2 in my experience. The only complete I have, is that I developed a small flat spot in one of the tires. It still balanced ok, but they still had like 85% tread left and maybe the inner carcass of the tire isnt as high of quality as the BFG's. But I really don't know how that would happen... not like I locked up the brakes all the time and developed flat spots... hahah Worth mentioning anyway. Oh, and they are definitely noisier than the KM2. If they made a 37" tire for a 16" rim like they used to, they would be my next tire....

 

[Dirtco]

Dang, Jeremiah. Sorry to hear about your front end woes. Maybe this cheesy cat picture will cheer you up.

View attachment 93065

In all seriousness though, I'm glad you're sticking with it. I think rickashay said it best in his post yesterday, about the slippery slope. Personally, I'm just sitting back and watching all this stuff happen with you and Jim, and it's really given me some food for thought regarding how I'll deal with similar challenges down the road, should they arise.

Well shoot, kittens make everything better! Haha, thanks Nick!

I've been doing this wheeling thing for a while and it's all just part of the hobby. Even the best rigs are going to need constant maintenance to keep them in good working order. The more built it is, and the more trails it runs, the more work it takes. For the most part it doesn't bother me, but at times it's easy to get burnt out and frustrated, like I was a few days ago. Having it be your daily driver just makes it worse.

And thanks for the detailed write-ups! I used your 97' 4Runner thread for the steering rack guide part numbers, and I think I'm going to have to get some replacement lower control arms like you have. I just hope I can push it back one more season (till winter), and address the upper arms at the same time.

 

[Dirtco]

Honestly, the MTZ's have been phenomenal. Especially for an M/T that needs to perform in deep snow and the occasional hard-pack and ice. I honestly found it to be worlds above the KM2 in my experience. The only complete I have, is that I developed a small flat spot in one of the tires. It still balanced ok, but they still had like 85% tread left and maybe the inner carcass of the tire isnt as high of quality as the BFG's. But I really don't know how that would happen... not like I locked up the brakes all the time and developed flat spots... hahah Worth mentioning anyway. Oh, and they are definitely noisier than the KM2. If they made a 37" tire for a 16" rim like they used to, they would be my next tire....

Thanks for the info Addison! I know a lot of your buddy's are running them, are they happy? Any balancing issue's that you have heard about? I'm looking for something that does better in the snow, but still wears okay and balances out (and runs smooth) for daily driver duty.

 

[Dirtco]

Small update...

I'm waiting for the steering rack parts to show up, and I can't really wheel the 4Runner the way it is, so started working on some other stuff.

First, I wired up a full time 12 volt outlet for the fridge. Having the rear aux fuse block right next to it made it super easy!



Since I removed the front sway bar the front tires have been rubbing the fenders. The amount of extra up-travel was more than I though it would be, which is a good thing but required some work.

I decided to just dive in and get it over with. I pulled the fenders, and got to work. You can see the rub marks on the flare.



Here is the old cut



And the new cut

 

[Rockdawg84]

Thanks for the info Addison! I know a lot of your buddy's are running them, are they happy? Any balancing issue's that you have heard about? I'm looking for something that does better in the snow, but still wears okay and balances out (and runs smooth) for daily driver duty.

I'm running MTZ's and while they have seen very little snow (it's a little warm here in AZ) I can tell you that they balanced out with less than 2oz per tire and have worn good. I probably have 25-30k on them with I would guess another 10 before I get to the wear bars. I've made several 1500 mile trips and they are great. I don't think they are very loud for being a mud tire, And in the rocks I run 8-10 psi and they stick like glue. My only complaint is that as a metric tire they are only 34.4 tall. But really I have no complaints at all. I would and may run another set when these are done. Though I really want to get a set of 35 pittbull rockers in the Radial. On my 84 I run Pittbulls and they are the best offroad tire I have ever owned. but 39.5 bias plys are not what I want for the 98. :eyebrows:

 

[downpour11]

I'm running MTZ's and while they have seen very little snow (it's a little warm here in AZ) I can tell you that they balanced out with less than 2oz per tire and have worn good. I probably have 25-30k on them with I would guess another 10 before I get to the wear bars. I've made several 1500 mile trips and they are great. I don't think they are very loud for being a mud tire, And in the rocks I run 8-10 psi and they stick like glue. My only complaint is that as a metric tire they are only 34.4 tall. But really I have no complaints at all. I would and may run another set when these are done. Though I really want to get a set of 35 pittbull rockers in the Radial. On my 84 I run Pittbulls and they are the best offroad tire I have ever owned. but 39.5 bias plys are not what I want for the 98. :eyebrows:

x3 on the MTZ's. Sam is the one who originally turned me on to them. I got a good 40k+ out of them (at the wear bars of course), they treated me very well. Sam - Pitbulls! You should already be set on those! They make them in a 315 as you know, but I'm not sure of the actual measurements. You might as well go for the 35x12.5

 

[Rockdawg84]

x3 on the MTZ's. Sam is the one who originally turned me on to them. I got a good 40k+ out of them (at the wear bars of course), they treated me very well. Sam - Pitbulls! You should already be set on those! They make them in a 315 as you know, but I'm not sure of the actual measurements. You might as well go for the 35x12.5

I will go the 35's but I need to buy 1 at a time so as to have to sell one of the boys. LOL

 

[downpour11]

I will go the 35's but I need to buy 1 at a time so as to have to sell one of the boys. LOL

Understandable lol hefty price tag on the Pitbulls - one of the main reasons I went with the IROK's, but no regrets - I'm loving the IROK's.

/thread jack

 

[Ol'Blue]

How much did the Safari rack run you? There's no price on their website, but I am in desperate need of a new rack and was unaware there was a better than OEM option until now.

Or you can just use my rack if you need it for a trip or something man.

Blue

 

[JBurt]

Wow. I just got done going through all the stuff you've posted since you stopped updating the yotatech thread. Good work. Congrats on the daughter. My first kid was born last November. Makes everything more interesting.

I just wanted to say thanks for sharing all you've done. Makes me want to buy a welder. Fantastic inspiration. Makes me want to move to Colorado and see some real mountains. Awesome. Simply awesome. Hope the guides fix your rack issue.

 

[Dirtco]

I'm running MTZ's and while they have seen very little snow (it's a little warm here in AZ) I can tell you that they balanced out with less than 2oz per tire and have worn good. I probably have 25-30k on them with I would guess another 10 before I get to the wear bars. I've made several 1500 mile trips and they are great. I don't think they are very loud for being a mud tire, And in the rocks I run 8-10 psi and they stick like glue. My only complaint is that as a metric tire they are only 34.4 tall. But really I have no complaints at all. I would and may run another set when these are done. Though I really want to get a set of 35 pittbull rockers in the Radial. On my 84 I run Pittbulls and they are the best offroad tire I have ever owned. but 39.5 bias plys are not what I want for the 98. :eyebrows:

Thanks Sam, that’s exactly the information I was looking for!

I've had the BFG KM'2 on my 4Runner for 7000 miles, they come new with 20/32's and I'm down to 15/32's. If I run them to the wear bars (which I never do) I'll get maybe 25,000 out of them. I normally run my tires to half tread life, then sell them; so only 14,000 miles.

The MTZ's only taking 2oz of weight is awesome! My BFG's are 8,5,5,2; and the MTR's were 8,10,12, and wait for it, 16oz!!!

In a 17" wheel the MTZ's are listed at 34.6, but that really doesn't mean a thing. Both my KM2's and MTR's were "34.8", but there was a 1/2" difference between the two. I wish tire manufacturers would give out the real numbers instead of using what they think sounds good, Interco is really bad about that.

I also really want a set of Pitbull Rockers in the 35” radial, especially after seeing [MENTION=62779]Kurtis[/MENTION] 4Runner with them mounted up. I think they would be awesome for snow wheeling! But, I can’t justify them on a daily driver that also gets driven around on icy roads. I need something aggressive, but also year round street friendly.

x3 on the MTZ's. Sam is the one who originally turned me on to them. I got a good 40k+ out of them (at the wear bars of course), they treated me very well. Sam - Pitbulls! You should already be set on those! They make them in a 315 as you know, but I'm not sure of the actual measurements. You might as well go for the 35x12.5

Thanks for the info Rob! I also thought about the Irok’s like you have, again for the kick ass snow wheeling properties of them. But like the Rockers, I don’t see them being a very practical, year round, daily driver tire; I guess maybe a step above the Rockers. If I knew they would wear okay I might give them a shot but the last Swamper’s I had (LTB’s) wore SUPER fast! I think I only made it one oil change and they were close to ½ tread life! It is encouraging that they only took 4oz to balance though, just wish I knew what kind of life I could expect and how they do on hard packed snow / ice.

 

[downpour11]

Thanks for the info Rob! I also thought about the Irok’s like you have, again for the kick ass snow wheeling properties of them. But like the Rockers, I don’t see them being a very practical, year round, daily driver tire; I guess maybe a step above the Rockers. If I knew they would wear okay I might give them a shot but the last Swamper’s I had (LTB’s) wore SUPER fast! I think I only made it one oil change and they were close to ½ tread life! It is encouraging that they only took 4oz to balance though, just wish I knew what kind of life I could expect and how they do on hard packed snow / ice.

[MENTION=56529]Jon[/MENTION] has been on the rockers for quite a while now and I know he's in love with them. I want to say he has around 15k miles on them right now and they still look new. Maybe he can chime in and give you his opinion.

The IROK's are sweet, but for a daily driver I'm not sure... since I only have 1k miles on these right now. They are realllllly soft and squishy. I read people are getting 30k out of them with rotations every 4k. I only justified them for my truck (which is a DD) because since I live in such a small town now, I only drive maybe 5 miles a day. I would have loved to grab the pitbulls, but like I said earlier, they are $$$. :cheers:

Also, everyone on here who's running MTZ's seem to really like them too. Though if I were to get another set, I'd have them siped.

 

[Dirtco]

[MENTION=56529]Jon[/MENTION] has been on the rockers for quite a while now and I know he's in love with them. I want to say he has around 15k miles on them right now and they still look new. Maybe he can chime in and give you his opinion.

The IROK's are sweet, but for a daily driver I'm not sure... since I only have 1k miles on these right now. They are realllllly soft and squishy. I read people are getting 30k out of them with rotations every 4k. I only justified them for my truck (which is a DD) because since I live in such a small town now, I only drive maybe 5 miles a day. I would have loved to grab the pitbulls, but like I said earlier, they are $$$. :cheers:

Also, everyone on here who's running MTZ's seem to really like them too. Though if I were to get another set, I'd have them siped.

Very good points, I wonder how well the Rockers balance and stay balanced though. In all honesty I will probably go with the MTZ's, but it is fun to think about the other options out there!

 

[Dirtco]

Wow. I just got done going through all the stuff you've posted since you stopped updating the yotatech thread. Good work. Congrats on the daughter. My first kid was born last November. Makes everything more interesting.

I just wanted to say thanks for sharing all you've done. Makes me want to buy a welder. Fantastic inspiration. Makes me want to move to Colorado and see some real mountains. Awesome. Simply awesome. Hope the guides fix your rack issue.

It's good to see you over here! Congratulations on your daughter too.

Thank you! Yeah, it's been quite the project, never ending.

Colorado is awesome, you should really make a trip out here some time!

 

[LINY4Runner]

I've never run MTZ's personally but I will say that a directional tread will be far better for the deep snow stuff you're wheeling in. Snow is a lot like sand in the way tires perform on it, and all of my friends with beach trucks run directional tires (Most of them use the MTZ's or the Procomp knock-offs with the same tread pattern) with amazing results over my old KM2's and MT/R's (although the MTR's are pretty damn good on the sand...like 2wd, 45psi, no problem good)

 

[Kurtis]

Very good points, I wonder how well the Rockers balance and stay balanced though. In all honesty I will probably go with the MTZ's, but it is fun to think about the other options out there!

I'm having issues with my Rockers balancing right now. I think I have it figured out and I don't think it is an issue with the tires or wheels. Apparently "all 4 tire spun on the machine just fine" but they still have a decent wobble to them. I think they balanced them as a lug centric wheel. I don't want to give the tires and wheels a bad reputation if the tech was just a bone head. I'll know more this evening and will post about it in my build thread.

 

[Dirtco]

I've never run MTZ's personally but I will say that a directional tread will be far better for the deep snow stuff you're wheeling in. Snow is a lot like sand in the way tires perform on it, and all of my friends with beach trucks run directional tires (Most of them use the MTZ's or the Procomp knock-offs with the same tread pattern) with amazing results over my old KM2's and MT/R's (although the MTR's are pretty damn good on the sand...like 2wd, 45psi, no problem good)

Thanks for the input! The KM2's weren't horrible in the deep snow at super low pressure, but they were also were not the best, and there's plenty of room for improvement. Here is the other thing I really don't like about them in the deep snow; at 1.5psi the sidewall becomes part of the tread. The BFG's don't have crap for sidewall traction and you can see how much of a loss of traction that makes in the snow by looking at this picture.



Here is a picture of the MTZ for comparison. I believe that the sidewall alone would make a difference in the amount of traction the tires have in snow, not to mention the rest of the tread. (Disclaimer - I have no idea what size that tire is, so the tread depth could vary.)

 

[Dirtco]

I got the parts in for the steering rack guide, and installed them. The steering is noticeably tighter, and it seems like most of the slop/clunk is gone. I still need to take it wheeling to see how much of a difference it makes, but if I can get through this season without replacing the rack I'll be happy.

I used [MENTION=44220]BigFishAllDay[/MENTION] build thread to find the links. All the part numbers are listed below, I also didn't bother taking any pictures since it's been covered so well.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...-steering-rack-guide-pictures.html#post604234

Rack & Pinion issue - 2001 Taco - TTORA Forum

The whole thing took about 30 minutes, and that was with the Budbuilt's in the way. If I didn't have skid plates it would have been a 15 minute job. For anyone still running the old style guide,... Replace the damn thing with the upgraded version!! It's a simple and cheap (under $100) fix, and it makes a big difference. The old guide is a joke, most of the play was from the old roller style guide. I can move it up and down a good +1/16" with just my finger.