This post made me chuckle. And yes, you came off as trying to be on a soap box.
You're entitled to your opinion of course, but here's mine:
As far as people buying ICON because "everyone else has it," what's your point? What is a forum about other than a sharing of ideas and a discussion of similar interests? I don't see a ride in your signature, but I assume you own a 4Runner or have owned one in your past. Did you buy one because everyone else on here has one? ICON makes good $hit. If you can afford to buy it, why not?
Moreover, I would bet that most people here know what Camburg and Total Chaos are. I don't think you're giving the members here enough credit.
Regarding OME, it's a good option for what it is...a low-cost, effective solution. They're actually quite popular on this forum. That being said, a lot of things about them aren't so great (i.e. you can't rebuild them, not adjustable, etc.) However, I wanted some of the best suspension parts for my ride and went with something that I know others have had great experience with and that I myself will be happy with.
And as far as being "top cat" is concerned, it's okay to admit you're jealous. I definitely am of some of the rides on this forum. :keyboard:
Haha, yah I figured it sounded like a soap box rant, that wasn't my intention.
For discussion sake, the following is where I am coming from with regards to vehicle/use-specific non-adjustable shocks vs. rebuildable/re-valvable shocks, it is a bit all over the place I apologize but there is a lot involved when getting into suspension:
- Most people driving newer 5th gen 4runners are using them 90% on-road (that's my assumption). It is a very expensive vehicle to be relegated to off-road only duty.
- ICON or other rebuildable shocks with uni-ball and heim rod ends tend to be squeaky, clunky, require constant maintenance, rebuilding every 40-50K miles.
- Rear control arms that use heims transmit more vibration than rubber bushings. Heims or uni-balls do not provide any cushion. The 4runner control arm mounts at the frame and axle are relatively thin metal. The axle housing is relatively thin metal. Thin metal over time will deform when using uni-ball or heim joints on control arms, or worse yet crack/fail.
- Front coil-over shocks allow the user to fine tune ride height. Rear coil / shock setup is fixed and non-adjustable.
- Uni-ball and poly bushing upper control arms are squeaky, require constant maintenance, are an issue in snowy/salty climates.
- ICON / Camburg / KING / FOX / Sway-Away / Radflo, all of these companies are designing around desert racing equipment. High speed, high shock velocity, washboard and whoops. These conditions require larger volume shocks with external reservoirs to try to keep shock temperatures down so seals and shock fluid don't deteriorate and shocks don't lose damping. A lot of these companies have realized the market for after-market stock-replacement shocks is huge and they are tailoring to this crowd.
- OME or Bilstein shocks that use rubber bushings are less than half the cost of coil-over shocks or rebuildable rear shocks. At that cost, when it is time to rebuild your ICONs, you could buy new OME shocks and be less out-of-pocket than where you're at with the rebuildables. Plus, you are either out of a vehicle when your shocks are getting serviced, or you have to temporarily install your original equipment shocks. OME are non-rebuilable and non-adjustable, but are also no-maintenance required items. No cleaning and lubing uni-balls or heims, no worrying about salt/water contamination, no squeaking, no clunking, etc.
- 99% of the people buying ICON or other rebuildable shocks for their 4runners are never going to rebuild them or modify the valving themselves. Why spend twice or more for a rebuildable adjustable shock that you will never take apart? If you are going to tinker with valving, shock oil weight, etc then a rebuildable shock is for you.
There is a lot more, but I don't have enough time to get into it.
I am not knocking ICON or other C/O and reservoir shock companies. If you can afford it and like doing frequent maintenance, the setups are very nice. If you are more of a set-it and forget person, then a OME or Bilstein setup may be better for you.
And don't get me wrong, I love looking through the build threads that have all the bling setups with CNC machined billet aluminum control arms and UCA, and all the rest. My earlier post does not come from jealousy, I am just trying to present a contrasting opinion to help people sort things out that may be new to off-roading and modifying their vehicles.
My comments come from off-roading for 20+ years, owning and modifying off-road jeeps, motorcycles, mountain bikes for over 15 years.
I have dealt with the cascading affects of modifying vehicles and using them off-road. Stretched control arm mounts, broken link brackets, wornout suspension and steering components from lifting trucks.... The list goes on and on. There is a lot of hidden cost and work associated with modifying vehicles, I just wanted to bring that out for new people. If you are using the ICON suspension to it's fullest, then other factory equipment is going to break/fail, axle housing bent, mounts broken, etc.
My ultimate setup if money was no object: KING C/O and shocks with the compression adjustment to fine tune the setup for different loading, rear control arms similar to what SLEE Offroad makes for the FJ80 LC's, 4130 Cromoly tubing with a high-strength rubber bushings.
arty:
